52 replies to this topic

[Sagamore]

I'm almost done the "any mech" challenge and not really having an issue getting KMDD in my Atlas and I am really liking Kill Most Damage Dealt as an indicator of contribution/performance or whatever BUT there is one thing that grinds my gears: I'm seeing opportunistic friendlies finish off a side torso that I've put in work on and getting that bonus damage from the arm. Kill stealing 2.0.

Its happened to me a few times where I've gotten a fresh enemy mech to red internals in the LT or RT and one of my allies sneezes on him to finish the torso while my weapons are on recharge and he will likely get the KMDD because his damage done includes the armour and internals of the fresh arm. Its especially annoying when said enemy has an XL.

Don't get me wrong, blowing out side torsos is currently the best way to farm this stat but its annoying when I've done all the work to strip that torso and someone else gets credit for the arm even though, technically speaking, I've inflicted the most direct damage. I don't honestly care about kill steals since its all about dropping the enemy as quickly as possible but I feel that the way this one issue is treated is not in the spirit of the KMDD award.

Isn't that the whole point of this stat? To award the guy that put in the work, not the guy that gets the last hit?

Perhaps the whole business of awarding damage for arms blown off on a torso loss is a bit silly to begin with. I mean, following this logic if you blow out the CT or the head of an enemy mech, you should get damage credit for every other component's remaining health.

[Evan20k]

But that's the nice part about STs. They have 2 of them, so shoot the other if you're that concerned with it.

Personally, I find it best to just play normally and don't think about the challenge. I had mine done in a few matches like that with my 4 PPC WHK-Prime.

[Accused]

Are we seriously arguing about people stealing other people's side torsos?

[Monkey Lover]

I been loving the kmdd model. The rare times this might happen doesnt effect me anywhere close to the "kill" with a win system they used to use.

[Sagamore]

Accused, on 28 January 2016 - 09:05 PM, said:

Are we seriously arguing about people stealing other people's side torsos?

Yes. But what I'm really saying is that awarding arm damage in this scenario is against the spirit of the KMDD stat.

Monkey Lover, on 28 January 2016 - 09:07 PM, said:

I been loving the kmdd model. The rare times this might happen doesnt effect me anywhere close to the "kill" with a win system they used to use.

Agreed. This is much better than what we had before.

[Lightfoot]

It's my understanding that KMDD doesn't require you to kill the mech. I have gotten KMDD with no killing blows scored, only assists. It only requires that you dealt the most damage and the mech was destroyed by anyone.

[Sagamore]

Lightfoot, on 28 January 2016 - 09:12 PM, said:

It's my understanding that KMDD doesn't require you to kill the mech. I have gotten KMDD with no killing blows scored, only assists. It only requires that you dealt the most damage and the mech was destroyed by anyone.

You are correct. I guess I should call it "stat stealing" and not "kill stealing"

[SkyHammyr]

Nice.

"We need to focus fire and shoot open locations...
Wait! Stop Stat Stealing me!!!"

[Alistair Winter]

All these challenges based on doing damage are unfair, because they favour assault mechs and heavy mechs anyway, which typically do more damage.

But the point isn't to make fair challenges. The point is to make you buy all the best robot Pokemons to collect maximum gold coins. That's the name of the game.

[Dirk Le Daring]

No such thing as kill stealing in this game......

Enemy goes down, I do not care who took the last shot.

Fact.

[MechWarrior849305]

Accused, on 28 January 2016 - 09:05 PM, said:

Are we seriously arguing about people stealing other people's side torsos?

Guess it's better than stealing flying futapantsu

[Jman5]

I really need to test this in a lobby. I've seen this claim thrown around here and on Reddit, but I'm pretty sure arm health does not get added onto your damage nor does it contribute to KMDD when you just shoot a ST off.

If this were true you would be getting something like 700+ damage out of a single atlas solo kill if you took out ST and CT, which is common. The damage numbers would suddenly be through the roof if the game was tacking on arm health to your damage.

Edited by Jman5, 28 January 2016 - 10:00 PM.

[Clownwarlord]

KMDD is one of two things. Either your inability to focus and kill the enemy by you 'farming' the side torsos. Or some one else kill steals ... in truth get better at aiming and you wont have to worry about kill stealing.

[El Bandito]

There is no "kill stealing" in MWO. Unlike League of Legends, there is no benefit in "feeding" a single player kills.
See the enemy = shoot it until its dead. Simple.

[Sagamore]

El Bandito, on 28 January 2016 - 10:00 PM, said:

There is no "kill stealing" in MWO. Unlike League of Legends, there is no benefit in "feeding" a single player kills.
See the enemy = shoot it until its dead. Simple.

This is not my point or perhaps you are just reading the topic title, which I admit is a bit misleading.

I don't care or believe in kill steals in this game. I'm talking about damage-padding with arm health on ST kill when someone else did most of the ST damage. Even then, yeah you should shoot for open components but the whole awarding arm health in damage on ST destruction is a silly mechanic IMO and counter intuitive to the point of the KMDD stat which I believe is to award the player who did the most work on a target, not the guy who got the league of legends last hit.

Edited by Sagamore, 28 January 2016 - 10:35 PM.

[Sagamore]

Jman5, on 28 January 2016 - 09:57 PM, said:

I really need to test this in a lobby. I've seen this claim thrown around here and on Reddit, but I'm pretty sure arm health does not get added onto your damage nor does it contribute to KMDD when you just shoot a ST off.

If this were true you would be getting something like 700+ damage out of a single atlas solo kill if you took out ST and CT, which is common. The damage numbers would suddenly be through the roof if the game was tacking on arm health to your damage.

I think McGral or someone did some pretty thorough tests at some point when structure buffs were first introduced. If you knock off both torsos off an Atlas by yourself you'll be getting a very high match score. If the atlas is played right, the arms are usually shredded by the time that happens though.

[SuomiWarder]

If you did the most damage to the mech and it gets destroyed by a friendly then you get the most damage points. it can be thirty points between two legs and an arm then someone head shots it for 15, you only hit CT until a sliver of health was left and then someone hit CT for the last two damage, or you and another pilot are ripping up the same target landing hits all over it and the other pilot gets the kill shot but you did 5 more damage.

So I suppose one could run around shooting off arms and a leg and then moving to the next enemy to score more damage. don't know if that is a viable win strategy or one to leading to many enemy deaths without your own. Or if you see a red side torso you can start shooting the arms trying to rack up enough damage to get the most damage stat before someone kills the target. Kinda doubt that a lot of that is going on though.

[Jman5]

Sagamore, on 28 January 2016 - 10:40 PM, said:

I think McGral or someone did some pretty thorough tests at some point when structure buffs were first introduced. If you knock off both torsos off an Atlas by yourself you'll be getting a very high match score. If the atlas is played right, the arms are usually shredded by the time that happens though.

That was in the PTR where it was messed up and double counting them or something like that. That never made it to the live version.

I'll see if I can find a couple people to help me test this in lobby, but I'm almost certain you're not getting free damage by shooting side torsos with arms attached.

[Rogue Jedi]

Alistair Winter, on 28 January 2016 - 09:46 PM, said:

All these challenges based on doing damage are unfair, because they favour assault mechs and heavy mechs anyway, which typically do more damage.

But the point isn't to make fair challenges. The point is to make you buy all the best robot Pokemons to collect maximum gold coins. That's the name of the game.

I have a far easier time getting kill most damage in Lights and Mediums than Heavies and Assaults, I tend to play harrasser so I will try to find isolated Mechs and take them down as quickly as possible (usualy rear CT), only to have someone else show up at the last second to get the kill shot.
For damage numbers in general a Heavy or Assault have a serious advantage but getting Kill most damage in a fast Mech is much easier for me than in a slow Mech.

[crustydog]

Now kids, it's called "Kill Secured" and don't forget your back armor!

Your fellow warriors are so concerned about your well being that sometimes they will risk shooting through you to get that enemy mech properly squared away:)