51 replies to this topic

[Wildstreak]

List of Mechs getting reduced by incoming Energy Range nerf to see what is getting nerfed and how bad.
One thing not made clear is if the nerf is only Energy Range or includes Mechs with both Energy and specific weapon Range buffs combined, 13 of these on the list.
I don't see this as too bad on Battlemasters and Stalkers, Thunderbolts depend on how it is done and 2 Blackjacks get a double nerf.
But all those other Mechs that have to pay......

Locust-1E -15%
Locust-1M -40%
Locust-1V -5%
Locust-3S -15%
Locust-3V -40%
Commando-1D -30%
Death's Knell -5%
Spider-5V -20%
Anansi -5%
UrbanMech-R60L -10%
Panther-8Z -15%
Raven-4X -20%
Wolfhound-1 -5%

Cicada-2A -15%
Cicada-3M -5%
X-5 -25%
Blackjack-1 -15%
Blackjack-1DC -15%
Blackjack-3 -10%
Arrow -10%
St. Ives Blues -5%
Enforcer-4R -10%
Hunchback-4G -5%
Grid Iron -20%
Trebuchet-5N -5%
Loup De Gurre MAYBE -5% somehow combination Energy and MPL
Griffin-1S -10%
Kintaro-20 -10%
Golden Boy MAYBE -20% somehow combination Energy and MPL
Wolverine-6K -15%
Wolverine-7D -5%
Wolverine-7K -10%

Dragon-1N -5%
Quickdraw-4G -15%
Quickdraw-4H -15%
Quickdraw-5K -10%
IV-Four -15%
Catapult-C1 -5%
Catapult-C4 -10%
Jester -5%
Thunderbolt-5S at least -5%, possibly -10% more between Energy and LL
Top Dog -15%
Thunderbolt-5SS at least -5%, possibly -15% more between Energy and MPL
Thunderbolt-9SE MAYBE -10% somehow combination Energy and LPL
Grasshopper-5H -5%
Grasshopper-5P -5%
Warhammer-6D -5%
Black Widow -5%
Black Knight-6-KNT -10%
Black Knight-6B-KNT -5%
Black Knight-7-KNT-L -10%
Bounty Hunter II MAYBE -10% somehow combination of Energy and ML

Awesome-8Q -10%
Awesome-8T -5%
Awesome-8V -15%
Pretty Baby -5%
Zeus-9S -5%
Battlemaster-1D -5%
Battlemaster-1G MAYBE -10% somehow combination of Energy and ML
Battlemaster-1S -15%
Battlemaster-3M MAYBE -10% somehow combination of Energy and ML
Battlemaster-3S MAYBE -5% somehow combination of Energy and MPL
Stalker-3H -5%
Stalker-4N MAYBE -5% somehow combination of Energy and LL
Stalker-5S MAYBE -5% somehow combination of Energy and LPL
Highlander-732B -15%
Highlander-733P -5%
Heavy Metal -15%
Banshee-3S MAYBE -5% somehow combination of Energy and ML
La Malinche MAYBE -10% somehow combination of Energy and LPL
Boar's Head -5%
Atlas-RS -5%

[Soulscour]

wow

[Gamuray]

Key Word:"Energy" Range.

Energy range being reduced doesn't mean they won't do SPECIFIC laser range quirks to replace it... (correct me if they said that it includes specific laser quirks and isn't just the general quirk for energy range)


Edit: Looked at Russ's wording, he even mentioned giving some mechs specific weapon quirks to replace the reduction in general energy range quirkage

Edited by Gamuray, 30 January 2016 - 10:57 AM.

[FupDup]

If I counted correctly, there are 72 mechs in that list for the chopping block.

Talk about collateral damage...

[Chados]

Wow, and a lot of subpar IS mechs are getting hammered, too. That makes the Clan buffs even more yuuuuuge in comparison.

[Duke Nedo]

FupDup, on 30 January 2016 - 11:08 AM, said:

If I counted correctly, there are 72 mechs in that list for the chopping block.

Talk about collateral damage...

Nerf them all, because Paul couldn't sort them out.

[XX Sulla XX]

[C I L L I P U D D I]

Oh no the TBR's and SCR's are gaining 1 extra laser from the buffs, EVERYONE RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!!!!!!

Some of those if not all of those IS mechs need the tone down. Some of them have 40% ENERGY range quirks. I don't see how taking away some nega-quirks is some jump to omg their buffing Clans. Clan lasers are still super hot and still have the range nerfs. Their just making Clans have no quirks. It's honestly not a big deal.

[FupDup]

Cillipuddi, on 30 January 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

Oh no the TBR's and SCR's are gaining 1 extra laser from the buffs, EVERYONE RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!!!!!!

Some of those if not all of those IS mechs need the tone down. Some of them have 40% ENERGY range quirks. I don't see how taking away some nega-quirks is some jump to omg their buffing Clans. Clan lasers are still super hot and still have the range nerfs. Their just making Clans have no quirks. It's honestly not a big deal.

At least half of the mechs in that list are considered mediocre at best. Some of them like Spiders and Commandos are trash tier even with their big values.

[Torgun]

Cillipuddi, on 30 January 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

Oh no the TBR's and SCR's are gaining 1 extra laser from the buffs, EVERYONE RUN FOR THE HILLS!!!!!!!!!

Some of those if not all of those IS mechs need the tone down. Some of them have 40% ENERGY range quirks. I don't see how taking away some nega-quirks is some jump to omg their buffing Clans. Clan lasers are still super hot and still have the range nerfs. Their just making Clans have no quirks. It's honestly not a big deal.

Yes especially the Commandos, those things were so OP they were everywhere.

Blanket nerfs/buffs are just stupid, and PGI just showed how bad they are at balancing the game yet again.

[Chados]

And it's being combined with across-the-board nerfs to the IS mechs, some of which were the only ones that could compete with the Clans as it was, and the rest of which were already mediocre to start with. I mean, really: The URBANMECH is getting a 10% energy range nerf. The Urbie. Seriously?

Which means: Yuuuge buff to Clans. I for one welcome the return of our TimberGodly overlords. I always got a giggle running with 11 Clan mechs on my team in the public queue and my Catapult or Marauder being the only IS mech. I had a couple matches in October where the Victor I was running was the only IS mech in the whole MATCH.

Edited by Chados, 30 January 2016 - 12:57 PM.

[Alistair Winter]

Misleading title is misleading.

Replacing range quirks with other quirks is not necessarily a nerf.

[Appogee]

I wonder what PGI are actually working on these, in between the now-monthly patches, given they've given up on addressing balance in any meaningful way.

A sequel to Transverse, perhaps.

Edited by Appogee, 30 January 2016 - 12:56 PM.

[Aiden Skye]

Most of these aren't even that bad.

[C I L L I P U D D I]

You nerf individual mechs, the good players just find the ones you didn't nerf and use those. You blanket nerf 1 quirk, like Energy Range, it has a solid impact on the Long Range Poke meta. You can't nerf mechs on a individual basis, you have to nerf quirks 1 by 1, slowly, to balance things out properly. Now, they are going after some hardcore quirk offenders like the blackjack, but that's a reasonable nerf that most people agree on. Russ even stated yesterday, that with some of the rescales and newer mechs coming out they're going to have to take a closer look into quirks. You can't just listen to every person's quirk suggestion because if that was the case Clans would only be able to fire 1 laser and it would cause 50% heat and commandoes would be as tanky as Atli.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Good. More than 10-15% range is stupid*. Maybe this means they'll start going for more specific quirkage like on the TBT-5J and Crabs.

*although we wouldn't need those pesky range quirks if IS lasers just had their range pushed up.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Seeing Urby on the list to be nerfed AGAIN, makes me angry.

Oh and assuming that any of the lost %'s in quirks will some how be leaked back into specific weapon quirks elsewhere... sigh.

Assumption is the mother of all **** ups.

[Scyther]

Presumably the intent is to cap out generic 'energy range' quirk plus IS-ERLLs, which is really the only thing that fuels the whole "IS outranging Clans" argument.

If that is the intent they pretty much need to make it a blanket cap. Hopefully they add back in some LL, LPL etc quirks. No use crying the sky is falling until we see what they replace it with. In fact probably not until the next balance/adjust pass *after* this.

Edited by MadBadger, 30 January 2016 - 01:06 PM.

[Monkey Lover]

Ha-ha lots of junky hero mechs they plan to make even worse.

[Wildstreak]

Gamuray, on 30 January 2016 - 10:52 AM, said:

Key Word:"Energy" Range.

Energy range being reduced doesn't mean they won't do SPECIFIC laser range quirks to replace it... (correct me if they said that it includes specific laser quirks and isn't just the general quirk for energy range)


Edit: Looked at Russ's wording, he even mentioned giving some mechs specific weapon quirks to replace the reduction in general energy range quirkage

Key Words: Reading Comprehension

I listened to the live TH and you can read the summary though you should have already.
Nowhere was it mentioned specific weapon quirks would replace anything.
Someone during the stream tried getting NGNG to ask Russ for clarification regarding Mechs that have both Energy and specific Energy weapon Range quirks but the question was not passed on.
Also you should remember why specific weapon quirks were removed from a lot of Mechs, because a good number of players across various skill levels were extremely tired of them since they forced you on a number of Mechs to use certain builds to do good instead of offering build flexibility. Adding more weapon specific quirks goes backwards on that and we are back to that old never-should-be-brought back problem.

Cillipuddi, on 30 January 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

Some of those if not all of those IS mechs need the tone down. Some of them have 40% ENERGY range quirks. I don't see how taking away some nega-quirks is some jump to omg their buffing Clans. Clan lasers are still super hot and still have the range nerfs. Their just making Clans have no quirks. It's honestly not a big deal.

40%+ Energy Range quirks on the Locust-1M, -3V and Commando-1D, such OP Mechs wrecking things everywhere. Followed by the seen everywhere X-5 with the massive 35%.
Look, you want to be all supportive, fine, just check stuff before posting or you ruin your own post like this one.
Nowhere did I say they are super buffing Clans, drop the made up junk and learn to look at things objectively.

Alistair Winter, on 30 January 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

Misleading title is misleading.

Replacing range quirks with other quirks is not necessarily a nerf.

See reply to Gamuray.