28 replies to this topic

[Jon Gotham]

Just read some notes from townhall meeting last night and am pretty disgusted to be honest. Which leads me to the problem;

How are units going to recruit now?

Forums clearly are not the answer as majority never seem to go on them so....solo Q will be out of the question now as well as they will be "protected" from all us seal clubbers. We might be able to spam group Q but...hardly an option.
There seems to be no mention of any in game UI elements dedicated to community building either-the "war on teamwork" seems to be gathering speed.
So that leaves the community to try to work around this, once again.

I propose:

We have a unit tag like;

[LFUD] Davion
[LFUL] Liao
[LFUM] Marik
[LFUS] Steiner
[LFUK] Kurita
[LFUR] Raselhague

and for the clans;

[LFUB] Ghost Bear
[LFUF] Jade Falcons
[LFUJ] Smoke Jaguars
[LFUW] Clan Wolf

Then if you see a solo or two in your unit Q "CW" match you'll know these guys are actively looking for a unit? Otherwise how is your group ever going to know which tags only have one member?
I'd be happy to set up the Marik TAG up.

[Ace Selin]

Interesting thought, guess people will recruit from Quick Play Q

[Jon Gotham]

Well, just an idea. We are going to have to be pro active if the community aspect of mwo is going to survive! Better to try something positive rather than rage about it!

[Sandpit]

Jon Gotham, on 30 January 2016 - 04:29 AM, said:

the "war on teamwork" seems to be gathering speed.

honestly?
Tweet Russ
constantly

That's what those QQing about "evil premades and groups and units" do

That's the only way you're going to even get his attention.

He actively ignored reading threads and dismisses their ideas out-of-hand without even reading them. That's from personal experience. That's from 3 years of experience in dealing with PGI.

Want results?
As much as it pains me to say it, complain on Twitter. He isn't going to listen to anything else.

[DarklightCA]

I had suggested a recruitment hub a few times, it works really great for World of Tank's which is pretty much just a more popular tank version of this game. They have their own Community Warfare and everything but theirs is a lot more thought out and well designed and one of the most popular aspects of that game.

Generally what they do is players fills out a personal file that details what they are looking for, the kind of things you would detail in this file are times you play the game and how many days a week you play the game. Minimum number of players in the unit and checkboxes for the reasons why you want to join a unit.

For MWO you would have Socialization, Grouped Quick Play, Cybersport and Team battles, Community Warfare, player's will check these for what kind of unit they want to join. You would also list what language you speak.

As a unit you generally create a filter based on the things listed in a personal file so let's say if you are a Community Warfare only unit than you would only have the Community Warfare checkbox listed for applications so player's who check that box will see your unit as a potential unit to join and unit's will see all those player's as potential recruits in that hub. Players can also check out general information about the units like a description, see how many players it has, could also have other statistics listed there so players can get a full grasp of that unit.

They also have a tab that lists unit's based on their statistics. As a example you would have average win rates based on how many player's are in a unit, average battles per member, average elo of player's for quick play, average elo of player's for Community Warfare and they would have a Unit Rating which tallies all those stats up and lists unit's with the overall best ratings in those categories.

So if a player wanted to find a unit that was the most active they would list unit's by most games played per member, if the wanted to join a overall good unit they will list unit's by overall unit rating, if they wanted to join a successful Community Warfare unit they would list player's by average elo in Community Warfare or I guess in this games case would be planet count? and quick play would be average tier?.

Edited by l)arklight, 01 February 2016 - 02:13 PM.

[xX PUG Xx]

Sycosys you kinda missed the point there..... by quite a bit and gave us a perfect example of an irrational "evil teams are evil" arguement.

The vast majority of units look to recruit, offer advice and train those that are willing to listen and learn. Very few actively trash those new/untagged players for the very reason they may become their next recruit. Please stop trying to turn CW into another solo queue, it already exists.

Jon and Darklight, both ideas have merit. Jon's only requires players to put in minimal effort but Darklights requires coding work from PGI. I can see that be a longtime coming but IMO it is something that will be gravely needed if PGI is serious about prmoting the "team" aspect of the game; especially if they want to chase the esport thing.

[sycocys]

If you only saw how many times Unit players would openly bash their teammates in ALL chat. And that's just what we see when they post to everyone, I'm quite sure much worse happens in the team chat/voip because we've all see/heard how these players react when they are on the losing sides of matches from the quick queues where we get to drop along side them.

You can make believe it isn't happening if you want though, doesn't bother me at all.

[DarklightCA]

sycocys, on 02 February 2016 - 03:51 AM, said:

If you only saw how many times Unit players would openly bash their teammates in ALL chat. And that's just what we see when they post to everyone, I'm quite sure much worse happens in the team chat/voip because we've all see/heard how these players react when they are on the losing sides of matches from the quick queues where we get to drop along side them.

You can make believe it isn't happening if you want though, doesn't bother me at all.

Show me on the doll where the unit's touched you... also I am fairly sure you are mistaking frustration with bashing. You act like non-unit player's don't get frustrated at their teammates and go off on them. Why are individual player's in unts special in this regard? Oh right I forgot that unit hating is the new fad now.

Funny how you don't mention any unit's that actively try to help their teammates, coordinate their teammates, or try and teach their team. Only the bad things individual players do in some units ever get any credit around here because that's the only thing that fits this unit hating narrative that people have setup on these forums.

[sycocys]

Why mention the bad? Because that's what leave a lasting impression in players, and it is far far more prevalent than the good that solo unit tagged players get up to.

And when it comes down to recruiting, if you have unit players behaving this way from now until the change those names will get remembered as "I don't want to play with that dbag" and then "Wasn't that dbag part of this unit?"

[Hellsoutcast777]

sycocys, on 01 February 2016 - 06:51 PM, said:

You'll just have to stop being ragey d-bag trolls in your alt accounts, try to repair any hurt feelings you caused by thinking you were a super elite ultimate master mechwarrior and trashing on pug players that didn't telekinetically know what you thought they should be doing - then start teaching them and offering them spots in your units.

Dude really how dumb are you aabout units. Lastsunday i was activeily trying to teach the opposing team of pugs how to set a firing line and ounter our tactics. I was drop calling for a 12 premade. We won but not becuase i tricked them i did eaxcily what i told them i was going to do. Some of them did set up a nice firing line others did not. YOU HAVE TO WORK AS A TEAM IN CW THERE IS NO OTHER WAY TO PLAY IT. Case in point same day we lost to pugs who where very much talkng with each other

[BLOOD WOLF]

sycocys, on 01 February 2016 - 06:51 PM, said:

You'll just have to stop being ragey d-bag trolls in your alt accounts, try to repair any hurt feelings you caused by thinking you were a super elite ultimate master mechwarrior and trashing on pug players that didn't telekinetically know what you thought they should be doing - then start teaching them and offering them spots in your units.

that's one thing I can not stand, when players talk about pugs as if they are incapable of learning. The few maybe, but most probably want to be better players

[sycocys]

Hellsoutcast777, on 02 February 2016 - 06:18 AM, said:

Dude really how dumb are you aabout units. Lastsunday i was activeily trying to teach the opposing team of pugs how to set a firing line and ounter our tactics. I was drop calling for a 12 premade. We won but not becuase i tricked them i did eaxcily what i told them i was going to do. Some of them did set up a nice firing line others did not. YOU HAVE TO WORK AS A TEAM IN CW THERE IS NO OTHER WAY TO PLAY IT. Case in point same day we lost to pugs who where very much talkng with each other

Guess what, you are vastly outnumbered by the guys that don't do anything but rage on their solo dropping teammates. It's a huge gap. And these players have done nothing but drive new players away from wanting to join units, 1 bad experience has more weight than a dozen good ones - and that's why we so often see people hop on the forums and shout about not wanting to join up with a unit full of dbags. Most units are not, but the few players that present that way hold far more influence towards driving players away than any amount of good ones are going to be able to change minds on.

[DarklightCA]

So what exactly is your point sycocys. Don't join units? Don't form up as a team in a team based game? or do you even have a point beyond ragging on units and giving no constructive input about the subject the OP brought up because unit's already offer to teach players and offer them to join units. "Don't be d-bags on your alt accounts" and "don't think you are super elite" isn't really helpful.

I highly doubt with how many Units there are in this game and how many players there are in those units that the people who yell at pugs "vastly outmumber" the people who do not and most units as a whole usually try to coordinate their pug team in some way.

I'd also like to point out that the players who drag down games by not communicating with their team or attempt to work with their team "vastly outnumber" the players who yell at there team and as such it's more likely that players would be attracted to join a unit to escape that over being persuaded against it just because some guy in some random game who had a tag yelled at him once.

I'd also like to point AGAIN that it's not just players in Units that do it, I've seen players not in units yell at their team plenty of times but of course they don't fit your unit bashing narrative so they are not worth bringing up in this discussion right?

Edited by l)arklight, 02 February 2016 - 07:12 AM.

[sycocys]

The point is stated pretty clearly in my first post.

The "work around" will be to not act like a bunch of ****** in your alt accounts. Then teach people how to play CW and recruit them to your units.

[Ehjay_52]

Umm... wasn't the initial concern that both soloQ and groupQ will be separated, in which, we would not actually be able to, and I quote... "not act like a bunch of whatever you called people, and then teach people how to play CW and recruit them into units."???

So going back the original topic at hand. The point was we won't have mixed Qs anymore so we will have to get creative.
My former unit would drop a CW group of 10, instead of 12... pick up 2 solo players and befriend them in the match. Teach and guide them and see if they would listen and learn. Most players are pretty excited when a unit is glad to have them around and that makes them want to join.

So ya Jon, I agree...we will definitely have to think about stuff like this.

[DarklightCA]

sycocys, on 02 February 2016 - 08:01 AM, said:

The point is stated pretty clearly in my first post.

The "work around" will be to not act like a bunch of ****** in your alt accounts. Then teach people how to play CW and recruit them to your units.

Which units already do. Units teach people how to play CW and they recruit people into their unit's. The point of the discussion is how they can do that in a split queue and how they can easier do that in general like a recruitment hub tool. You stating that units act like dbags which is not completely factual has no real baring on the discussion other than to call out units.

[Sandpit]

sycocys, on 02 February 2016 - 08:01 AM, said:

The point is stated pretty clearly in my first post.

The "work around" will be to not act like a bunch of ****** in your alt accounts. Then teach people how to play CW and recruit them to your units.

so the solution is go through the trouble of creating a second account, grinding it up, just so you can have a "solo" account to recruit?

I'm picking on you a bit here, but it sounds like you already work for PGI. That's exactly what I mean by trying to come up with the most complicated mechanics and solutions possible to solve a relatively easy problem that online games have dealt with and solved for over 2 decades. lol

[sycocys]

Sandpit, on 02 February 2016 - 10:35 AM, said:

so the solution is go through the trouble of creating a second account, grinding it up, just so you can have a "solo" account to recruit?

I'm picking on you a bit here, but it sounds like you already work for PGI. That's exactly what I mean by trying to come up with the most complicated mechanics and solutions possible to solve a relatively easy problem that online games have dealt with and solved for over 2 decades. lol

Probably a good 10-20% of veteran players already have an alt account.

Otherwise what do you need to grind out? The tutorial and 25 matches maybe? The trial/champion mechs aren't the pure shat they used to be so you really only need 1-2 rigged mechs to compete well in solo v solo CW - otherwise if you are capable of running trials and showing solos that you actually possess a fair amount of skill you are already a step up on recruiting the ones that are looking.

Alternatively if you are a die hard unit you just toss 80-120 bucks into your recruiter account and put a pack on it.

[Jon Gotham]

Toker Hv52, on 02 February 2016 - 08:22 AM, said:

Umm... wasn't the initial concern that both soloQ and groupQ will be separated, in which, we would not actually be able to, and I quote... "not act like a bunch of whatever you called people, and then teach people how to play CW and recruit them into units."???

So going back the original topic at hand. The point was we won't have mixed Qs anymore so we will have to get creative.
My former unit would drop a CW group of 10, instead of 12... pick up 2 solo players and befriend them in the match. Teach and guide them and see if they would listen and learn. Most players are pretty excited when a unit is glad to have them around and that makes them want to join.

So ya Jon, I agree...we will definitely have to think about stuff like this.

Thank you Toker.
Sycocys, would you kindly refrain from bringing anti unit rhetoric into this thread. That is not what I made this thread for, ok?

[Sandpit]

sycocys, on 02 February 2016 - 01:27 PM, said:

Probably a good 10-20% of veteran players already have an alt account.

Otherwise what do you need to grind out? The tutorial and 25 matches maybe? The trial/champion mechs aren't the pure shat they used to be so you really only need 1-2 rigged mechs to compete well in solo v solo CW - otherwise if you are capable of running trials and showing solos that you actually possess a fair amount of skill you are already a step up on recruiting the ones that are looking.

Alternatively if you are a die hard unit you just toss 80-120 bucks into your recruiter account and put a pack on it.

so your response and "solution" to me pointing out just why and how it's a ridiculously complicated idea is to say "Well 10-20% (which is completely false since you don't know the stats of the game to begin with ) already have alt accounts anyhow, no need fo rthem to grind out a new account.

What about the other 80%?

Get real dude lol It's a bad idea, it's a horrible "solution", and it's nothing more than a workaround that the dbags creating issues in the first place will use to bypass and exploit the new system.
period