146 replies to this topic

[MiniKin]

I know that when you lost a left or right torso in the tabletop game you died if you were IS and had an XL engine. 3 engine hits and you died on all mechs. This was fine on the tabletop where you had hit location RNG on your side - I get it. The problem with MWO is that you can choose where you want to hit and hit it with good accuracy; often times this is the left or right torso so that you can get rid of weapons from the arm and torso and if they have an XL engine they die. This has led to having to get rid of all XL engines on all my mechs so I could survive longer. This is an option that has become useless.

Is there any chance that it could be changed where you lost performance instead?

[Cranial Enigma]

Sadly that won't ever happen. You are better off praying to PGI to implement Light Fusion engines into the game for IS. And on that note, when was the last time we got new tech/weapons into the game? So yeah, don't get your hopes up too much.

[Wrathful Scythe]

Thing is: If you let IS survive the STloss, you would need to buff clanmechs significantly, which would open a whole new bag of problems, because omnis can't switch to std engines.

I'm not against something like that but some IS machines would be really terrifying if IS could survive the st-loss. Even if it comes with a price like being slower.

[FupDup]

The funny thing is that even with the instadeath side torsos, the majority of IS mechs are stronger with XL engines than STD engines. Only a few mechs rely on STD engines or can choose between both engine types without one choice being clearly better.

[Thunderbird Anthares]

Light Fusion Engine would solve that problem

and why the hell would you suggest you need to buff Clans for that is beyond me, they still have XL engines that can pull it off - which means they STILL get to carry more weapons - more better weapons that are STILL SMALLER AND LIGHTER than IS gear

[Tyler Valentine]

FupDup, on 25 February 2016 - 01:40 PM, said:

The funny thing is that even with the instadeath side torsos, the majority of IS mechs are stronger with XL engines than STD engines. Only a few mechs rely on STD engines or can choose between both engine types without one choice being clearly better.

Truth.

Many times, if you lose the side torso you've lost half your weapons, 3 heat sinks, and the ability to fight back effectively. In most 'mechs, you're better off taking an XL and spreading damage to the best of your ability.

[Johnny Z]

Inner Sphere XL insta blow is LAME and CHEAP and a few other things like that.

+1 for shutdown on IS XL ST loss.

Edited by Johnny Z, 25 February 2016 - 03:28 PM.

[Canuck307]

I run XL's on pretty much every mech with the exception of a few heavies and assaults. Yes it does suck to die from a torso loss, but most of the time it's due to me being flanked and losing it from the rear. I will admit, would be nice to have that extra lifeline in the torso. But really, most of my mechs I tend to load most if not all my weapons to one side or the other. So you lose most of your fire power anyway.

[cazidin]

Wrathful Scythe, on 25 February 2016 - 01:37 PM, said:

Thing is: If you let IS survive the STloss, you would need to buff clanmechs significantly, which would open a whole new bag of problems, because omnis can't switch to std engines.

I'm not against something like that but some IS machines would be really terrifying if IS could survive the st-loss. Even if it comes with a price like being slower.

Why do we need to buff Clans if the IS gets an XL engine buff? They still have more range, more damage (but longer burn time and a little more heat usually), less bulky Endo and FF (when applicable) and more.

[Mcgral18]

It's an easy change to make.

Our client side has this information:

cXL
"sidesToDie="2""

isXL
"sidesToDie="1""


Care to guess what happens when you switch that 1 to a 2?
Engine Slots mean nothing in MWO.

[cazidin]

Mcgral18, on 25 February 2016 - 03:51 PM, said:

It's an easy change to make.

Our client side has this information:

cXL
"sidesToDie="2""

isXL
"sidesToDie="1""


Care to guess what happens when you switch that 1 to a 2?
Engine Slots mean nothing in MWO.

The entire game breaks down and is forced into maintainence for about 2-3 days while PGI desperately tries to fix the code that they broke?

[Mcgral18]

cazidin, on 25 February 2016 - 03:52 PM, said:

The entire game breaks down and is forced into maintainence for about 2-3 days while PGI desperately tries to fix the code that they broke?

There was that AC2 incident...

[cazidin]

Mcgral18, on 25 February 2016 - 03:52 PM, said:

There was that AC2 incident...

Honestly, I wasn't there for that. Give me the full story, please?

[Homeskilit]

That is the first step to balancing the game is to either buff isXL to cXL status or reduce cXL to isXL status.

[Mcgral18]

cazidin, on 25 February 2016 - 03:56 PM, said:

Honestly, I wasn't there for that. Give me the full story, please?

They changed the Ghost Heat on AC2s, and Clam Lower Arm Actuators broke.

[Brandarr Gunnarson]

This is a well-discussed subject.

It's THE core issue of techline imbalance.

The most effective, fairest, simplest and easiest way to fix this is just to make isXL function like cXL.

Then, buff Std. engines to provide additional durability.

Next, strip off most durability Quirks.

Now that there's foundational balance and an end to the ridiculous and arduous Quirk cycle, we can look at weapons and other things more clearly.

[Monkey Lover]

Wrathful Scythe, on 25 February 2016 - 01:37 PM, said:

Thing is: If you let IS survive the STloss, you would need to buff clanmechs significantly, which would open a whole new bag of problems, because omnis can't switch to std engines.

I'm not against something like that but some IS machines would be really terrifying if IS could survive the st-loss. Even if it comes with a price like being slower.

I'm all for letting clans to use std but I'm wondering who would do it I'm not using stds on any of my 2c mechs. I just see the reason to zombie around for the cost of so much tonnage.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 25 February 2016 - 05:12 PM.

[Brandarr Gunnarson]

Monkey Lover, on 25 February 2016 - 04:33 PM, said:

I'm all for letting clans to use std but I'm wonder who would do it I'm not using stds on any of my 2c mechs. I just see the reason to zombie around for the cost of so much tonnage.

This is the main reason that when you buff isXL to (near) cXL levels, you have to buff the durability of Std. engines.

They need to remain viable and the way to do that is to push the contrast between XL being light and fragile and Std. being heavy and durable.

Therefore: +20% structure to CT when running Std. sounds about right to me.

[Blue Boutique]

Then what good would STD engine then? The only reason they stayed constant throughout the years in TT was that they were cheaper to repair and manufacture.

[Mcgral18]

Blue Boutique, on 25 February 2016 - 05:09 PM, said:

Then what good would STD engine then? The only reason they stayed constant throughout the years in TT was that they were cheaper to repair and manufacture.

See above, significant structure gains.

Imagine the BJ or Atlas quirks, but assigned to STD engines.
Adjust it to the point where the durability outweighs the extra guns.