39 replies to this topic

[Malachy Karrde]

I've never bothered to look at the stats of the clan ac before... but aside from a slightly longer cool down .1 or .2 I believe, and they take one more slot, everything else is the same. I don't care about the slot, and the cool down seems negligable...why do people not use them? No jams....

[MechWarrior849305]

Malachy Karrde, on 09 March 2016 - 09:49 PM, said:

why do people not use them? No jams....

No second shot...
Not a thing in a battletech...

[FupDup]

Clan UAC/5 Advantages:
-One less slot
-Can double-tap for added damage
-Has a faster firing rate even in single-tap mode

Clan AC/5 Advantages:
-Derp

[Moldur]

Even with jams, the UAC-5 still has a higher DPS. That's why people use them.

Edited by Moldur, 09 March 2016 - 09:52 PM.

[Chimera_]

I haven't actually ever used standard clan ACs, but in general I think UACs are usually better than standard ACs. The jam chance is a big factor...but I find the ability to (most of the time) unload several volleys within just a few seconds is very beneficial, since it requires less facetime to get the same amount of damage in.

I general I don't really see any good enough reason to choose standard ACs over same caliber UACs.

EDIT: Derped and forgot that you can just hold the UAC down to fire normally without jamming - so yeah, standard ACs are worse in almost every way.

Edited by Chimera11, 09 March 2016 - 10:19 PM.

[Revis Volek]

Chimera11, on 09 March 2016 - 09:52 PM, said:

I haven't actually ever used standard clan ACs, but in general I think UACs are usually better than standard ACs. The jam chance is a big factor...but I find the ability to (most of the time) unload several volleys within just a few seconds is very beneficial, since it requires less facetime to get the same amount of damage in.

I general I don't really see any good enough reason to choose standard ACs over same caliber UACs.

I think the C-AC2 has a higher DPS then the C-UAC2 but i could be wrong with that.

[Moldur]

Chimera11, on 09 March 2016 - 09:52 PM, said:

I haven't actually ever used standard clan ACs, but in general I think UACs are usually better than standard ACs. The jam chance is a big factor...but I find the ability to (most of the time) unload several volleys within just a few seconds is very beneficial, since it requires less facetime to get the same amount of damage in.

I general I don't really see any good enough reason to choose standard ACs over same caliber UACs.

It is only worth it with the AC-2 over the UAC-2. The jam chance and jam duration is the same for all the Autocannons, but that means the amount of DPS lost is not (since the fire rate and damage per round is different.)

In other words, the only instance where the added rate of fire does not make up for the jam chance and jam duration is the UAC 2. The regular AC-2 actually has a higher dps.

[Malachy Karrde]

Moldur, on 09 March 2016 - 09:52 PM, said:

Even with jams, the UAC-5 still has a higher DPS. That's why people use them.

Going through a jam fest where all my autocannons are down more than up lately which is why I'm considering making a change. Had to kill a guy completely with my er small lasers tonight because my autocannons were out the whole fight.

[FupDup]

Revis Volek, on 09 March 2016 - 09:56 PM, said:

I think the C-AC2 has a higher DPS then the C-UAC2 but i could be wrong with that.

Well, to be more specific, using the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode has higher DPS over time than using it in double-tap.

The Clan AC/2 has the same DPS as the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode, which also lets it beat the double-tap mode's DPS.

Edited by FupDup, 09 March 2016 - 10:00 PM.

[MechWarrior414712]

C-AC5;
-longer cooldown
-takes an extra slot

C-UAC5;
-Jams >only< when you double tap, which means if you don't double tap it's still higher DPS than the C-AC5

Conclusion? Bravo PGI

[Malachy Karrde]

FupDup, on 09 March 2016 - 10:00 PM, said:

Well, to be more specific, using the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode has higher DPS over time than using it in double-tap.

The Clan AC/2 has the same DPS as the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode, which also lets it beat the double-tap mode's DPS.

so, if I was going to try quad ultra 2s, I'd be better off with quad ac 2s? I had considered dropping the 5s and trying 2s.

[Moldur]

Malachy Karrde, on 09 March 2016 - 09:58 PM, said:

Going through a jam fest where all my autocannons are down more than up lately which is why I'm considering making a change. Had to kill a guy completely with my er small lasers tonight because my autocannons were out the whole fight.

On the whole, you are still better off with UACs except for the AC-2 and UAC-2. Not that we can plan for every situation, but if we assume jamming doesn't result in your immediate death, UACs with jamming still have a better rof and dps which means more shots off and more damage done by the end of the round, or some arbitrary period of time.

[MischiefSC]

A little trigger discipline and the Cuacs are in all ways superior. Doubletap for emergencies or a kill steal.

[FupDup]

Malachy Karrde, on 09 March 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

so, if I was going to try quad ultra 2s, I'd be better off with quad ac 2s? I had considered dropping the 5s and trying 2s.

Note that you can also replicate the effect by just using single-tap mode on the Ultra 2's...if you need to save on slots. It also gives you a backup plan for when you care more about doing a bunch of damage than steady DPS over time.

With that being said, the class-2 is the only case where there is any degree of real choice between them, in all other cases it's Ultra > AC.

[El Bandito]

Malachy Karrde, on 09 March 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

so, if I was going to try quad ultra 2s, I'd be better off with quad ac 2s? I had considered dropping the 5s and trying 2s.

CAC2 has slightly longer range. CUAC2 has double tap + costs 1 less slot. Pick your poison.

[Revis Volek]

FupDup, on 09 March 2016 - 10:00 PM, said:

Well, to be more specific, using the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode has higher DPS over time than using it in double-tap.

The Clan AC/2 has the same DPS as the Ultra 2 in single-tap mode, which also lets it beat the double-tap mode's DPS.

Thank you Fup, put much more eloquently.

[Malachy Karrde]

Moldur, on 09 March 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

On the whole, you are still better off with UACs except for the AC-2 and UAC-2. Not that we can plan for every situation, but if we assume jamming doesn't result in your immediate death, UACs with jamming still have a better rof and dps which means more shots off and more damage done by the end of the round, or some arbitrary period of time.

thanks... I guess this is why I don't boat uacs and have my 6 er small lasers and 2 racks of lrm 10. If I had only 5 or 6 autocannons, I'd have lost that fight earlier tonight.

[Revis Volek]

El Bandito, on 09 March 2016 - 10:05 PM, said:

CAC2 has slightly longer range. CUAC2 has double tap + costs 1 less slot. Pick your poison.

Longer range, better DPS in single then the UAC in Double from the post above.

Its a better option all around apparently.

[El Bandito]

Revis Volek, on 09 March 2016 - 10:07 PM, said:

Longer range, better DPS in single then the UAC in Double from the post above.

Its a better option all around apparently.

Both are crap choice compared to CUAC5.

Edited by El Bandito, 09 March 2016 - 10:12 PM.

[Cyborne Elemental]

Its a dps thing.

When you have the potential of getting double dps, vs range (only CAC2/5 get more range).. the risk is worth it for using UAC.

The cooldowns on CAC's are also a bit too steep and they don't sync up with anything really.

Edited by Mister D, 09 March 2016 - 10:36 PM.