365 replies to this topic

[JC Daxion]

Saint Scarlett Johan, on 17 March 2016 - 11:43 AM, said:

Alright. I feel strongly about LRMs. They are such a craptastic place that I have but three LRM mechs total: MDD w/ cLRM-5s, CPLT-A1 w/ four iLRM-5s and two iLRM-10s, and a

Treb w/ two iLRM-10s.

I want them to be good, but I don't want them to be cheesy. Right now they're cheesy because they need to be spammy to get results. I don't like spam. We have enough spam with all the Rainbow Ralphing.


and said a ton of great stuff..

Not sure all his ideas are balanced, But it is a pretty nice list.. I think his missile buff, and speed increase would combined with all the other ideas would make them OP, and we would have another LRMageddon.. But in all honesty, i think we need another one, to get this weapon back viable.. I know i had a lotta fun during the LRM tweaks a few summers back and i don't think i was alone..



I've said this many times...


If you have LOS, a much faster lock should happen, i say near instant. Press R, it locks maybe .5 sec or something.. Those missiles fired at that point, will only stay locked if you hold the lock. Missile arc is much more shallow as well, which would reduce travel time. In a way they would be similar to locking Streaks, but longer range. Damage could be adjusted if they became OP..


ECM should be changed to Lock delay, not stealth mode. Moving out of LOS, would break it, and they would need to relock at a slower rate. The rate could add a few seconds to lock time. enough to peak out, and take cover, or make a break across a short ally or something like that.


As far as Blind fire goes, Perhaps no change.. as it is blind fire is risky at best and only works against people way way out of position, or brand new players. Also, the longer the range, the longer a lock takes? or is that just for info gathering? Perhaps lock range could scale as well.. 200-400 one level, 400-600 another level, and 800+ a third.


Give LRM players a buff for using LRM's at closer distances.. and keep um about the same as they are now at long ranges.. If you are being pelted at 900m your doing it wrong..

Edited by JC Daxion, 17 March 2016 - 06:56 PM.

[Mole]

I don't know why we are even discussing this. PGI never listens to community suggested balance fixes and just comes up with their own 'fix' that works about as well as trying to use a hammer to make a square peg fit in a round hole.

[Y E O N N E]

Mole, on 17 March 2016 - 06:52 PM, said:

I don't know why we are even discussing this. PGI never listens to community suggested balance fixes...

False.

All the morons around here pissed and moaned about weapon-specific quirks, and so we got general quirks which were abusive when applied to weapons they were never intended for, so those got scaled back and now everything suffers.

[Bishop Steiner]

Yeonne Greene, on 17 March 2016 - 06:57 PM, said:

False.

All the morons around here pissed and moaned about weapon-specific quirks, and so we got general quirks which were abusive when applied to weapons they were never intended for, so those got scaled back and now everything suffers.

the problem is they have a bad habit of listening to the wrong morons, instead of the right morons.

Virtually every single change ever implemented, started from one forum post or another.

[Y E O N N E]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 07:10 PM, said:

the problem is they have a bad habit of listening to the wrong morons, instead of the right morons.

Virtually every single change ever implemented, started from one forum post or another.

I just want my 230 m Small Lasers back for my LCT-1E.

It wasn't good, but it was certainly glorious. Ditto the 189 m rapid pewpew SPL on the 3M.

[Groovdog]

Thunderbird Anthares, on 17 March 2016 - 02:45 AM, said:

i thought balancing is supposed to be done for the top end, not low end - because if balanced for the low end, we end up with silly metas and broken builds

just a thought

I somewhat agree so long as the method used to balance is not something that by definition is unique to top tier players.

So taking it to extremes, the fast twitch movement/firing accuracy of elite ESports players is not something you can balance around. But you can balance general mechanics to work effectively at the Top 25% level and it should work out for everyone. The danger of balancing too high (Top 5-10%) is that you risk pissing off the 90% below that level which doesnt work in a game with a revenue stream structured like MWO's.

WoW is probably the ultimate example. Top guilds have always complained that things are too easy (even when they spend weeks refining an encounter, the problem is more they outrun the content). But there is a reason why they hold on to 5 mil players 12 years in. Everyone ******* about balance in WoW, and that is the definition of working as intended.

Here everyone *******, but many are bitching about other people bitching and not about the actual situation. Summation of many peoples views: LRMs should suck (because they are low skill), but I dont really care so long as you keep my meta laser vomit as the best please (because it is "high" skill). Good players should be able to adapt to changes. You can see it now with the Archers. I cry inside when I see 4 on my team in a PUG. That means we are basically gonna get rushed if the other team has a clue (ie can look in the sky and count little yellow blobs).

Edited by Groovdog, 17 March 2016 - 07:15 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Yeonne Greene, on 17 March 2016 - 07:12 PM, said:

I just want my 230 m Small Lasers back for my LCT-1E.

It wasn't good, but it was certainly glorious. Ditto the 189 m rapid pewpew SPL on the 3M.

I just want a game that resembles "A Battletech Game" in more than the names pasted on the Gundams. Guess I have to wait til 2017 and hope that one doesn't end up as bastardized due to idiot forum pressure as this one did.

But you know some bunch of jackwagons are going to make it a point to ruin it too, because they "Gotta has mah Uziel n Mad Cat herpaderp!"

[Wintersdark]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 07:10 PM, said:

the problem is they have a bad habit of listening to the wrong morons, instead of the right morons.

Virtually every single change ever implemented, started from one forum post or another.

Even ghost heat.

I'd just like to say, I wanted to punch the guy who suggested it then, and I still want to punch him today.

They always listen to the wrong morons.

That's why I fear for people posting those exceptionally stupid ideas.... Because there's this wierd thing with Paul, where he seems to never look on the forum except for when someone has posted an amazingly idiotic ill-conceived pile of crap. It calls to him, from across the aether and whether Paul is just helpless in the face of its idiocy, or is truly a monster himself, I'll never know.

[Bishop Steiner]

Wintersdark, on 17 March 2016 - 07:30 PM, said:

Even ghost heat.

I'd just like to say, I wanted to punch the guy who suggested it then, and I still want to punch him today.

They always listen to the wrong morons.

That's why I fear for people posting those exceptionally stupid ideas.... Because there's this wierd thing with Paul, where he seems to never look on the forum except for when someone has posted an amazingly idiotic ill-conceived pile of crap. It calls to him, from across the aether and whether Paul is just helpless in the face of its idiocy, or is truly a monster himself, I'll never know.

Or was it Paul posting it under one of his aliases, to begin with....... *queue X Files theme*

[RestosIII]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 07:37 PM, said:

Or was it Paul posting it under one of his aliases, to begin with....... *queue X Files theme*

Personally, I find LRMs to be in an "interesting" place. Clan LRMs? They're great. Couldn't ask for much besides lower flight paths when you have direct LoS. IS LRMs though? Hot garbage IMO. When the only proper LRMs to use are 5's and 10's on chain fire, you know something is wrong. LRM 20's should be dangerous, not carry-on baggage that does the same damage as an LRM 15 on average due to how many missiles miss.

[JC Daxion]

Wintersdark, on 17 March 2016 - 07:30 PM, said:

Even ghost heat.

I'd just like to say, I wanted to punch the guy who suggested it then, and I still want to punch him today.

They always listen to the wrong morons.

That's why I fear for people posting those exceptionally stupid ideas.... Because there's this wierd thing with Paul, where he seems to never look on the forum except for when someone has posted an amazingly idiotic ill-conceived pile of crap. It calls to him, from across the aether and whether Paul is just helpless in the face of its idiocy, or is truly a monster himself, I'll never know.

Honestly, i don't get the hate for ghost heat.. It sure isn't perfect, but it does help curb a lot of boating. I'll take that, verse getting popped by 4PPC's or quad Clan ERLL's ext..

I'm hoping the next system is better.. but i will just wait and see. People also have to remember that most of the player base are not top players, they are weekend warriors that wanna have fun, and play a game that lets them play with all the mechs, and all the weapon systems The meat and potato players.. those are the ones that need to enjoy the game, for any game to work for the masses

[MischiefSC]

Make them AC5 speed with LOS. Tight pattern. Flat trajectory.

Indirect fire, wider spread, existing speed.

That would be a good start.

[Y E O N N E]

MischiefSC, on 17 March 2016 - 08:46 PM, said:

Make them AC5 speed with LOS. Tight pattern. Flat trajectory.

Indirect fire, wider spread, existing speed.

That would be a good start.

How about acceleration?

Y'know, so they are slow up close but actually reach their destination quite quickly.

Missiles have more gradual acceleration than a bullet.

[Imperius]

Bishop Steiner, on 17 March 2016 - 07:15 PM, said:

I just want a game that resembles "A Battletech Game" in more than the names pasted on the Gundams. Guess I have to wait til 2017 and hope that one doesn't end up as bastardized due to idiot forum pressure as this one did.

But you know some bunch of jackwagons are going to make it a point to ruin it too, because they "Gotta has mah Uziel n Mad Cat herpaderp!"

I said I wasn't going to post in this thread again, but I lied. Actually I'm staying far away from HBS game because yes it has nothing in it I want. So you won't have to worry about me asking for a Mad Cat MK II there. Once it got multiplayer it was DOA, too much Dev time will be wasted on the multiplayer, I'm glad I didn't fund it. If it didn't reach multiplayer tier I would have bought it. No matter though, this game is getting a campaign and a mad cat mk II and I can't wait! Until then I'll only play mostly private matches and some events.

I hardly post about balance, I did post a ton to stop pop-tarting and nerf ECM though... My only reason... Not all mechs get JJ and ECM

[Wintersdark]

JC Daxion, on 17 March 2016 - 08:11 PM, said:

Honestly, i don't get the hate for ghost heat.. It sure isn't perfect, but it does help curb a lot of boating. I'll take that, verse getting popped by 4PPC's or quad Clan ERLL's ext..

I'm hoping the next system is better.. but i will just wait and see. People also have to remember that most of the player base are not top players, they are weekend warriors that wanna have fun, and play a game that lets them play with all the mechs, and all the weapon systems The meat and potato players.. those are the ones that need to enjoy the game, for any game to work for the masses

There were many other solutions at the time, and many that did not result in all the collateral damage ghost heat caused. Sure, it stopped multiPPC alphas, but clearly it doesn't stop massive laser alphas that do more damage, without need to lead, for less heat. The problems with ghost heat are many and numerous - it's confusing to new (and even many experienced) players, it only functions in specific combinations which means it's pretty easy to bypass, and it broke a lot of builds that weren't problems in the first place.


And all those problems, all of them, we all specifically warned them from the first peep about it. So, yeah, that's why people hate it so much.

[Wolfways]

QuantumButler, on 17 March 2016 - 06:46 AM, said:

I for one only tried out MWLL after having played MWO for abit, by then the community was all but dead, the only ones left being people who played it for so many years the skill gap was very large, especially map knowledge wise.

Same here. I actually found out that MWLL existed through the MWO forums.
I wandered around the amazing maps, tried out the weapons, and different mechs/vehicles/etc. And then I compare it to MWO...

The only good thing I can say about MWO is the mechs look better...and pulse lasers sound great. IMO everything I got to try out in MWLL was better.
Of course it wasn't perfect. I didn't like the "run back to base for repairs" thing, but I've learned from MWO that no respawn (or repair) means crap game modes.

Unfortunately the player base is tiny, and that's the only reason I'm (rarely) playing MWO instead tbh.

[Wolfways]

Saint Scarlett Johan, on 17 March 2016 - 10:35 AM, said:

Our resident box dweller is on vacation. Me and my Pretty Baby eagerly await his return.

I don't mind being in charge, since when they put me in charge and I started to get some things together we started seeing people logging in to the TS server again and playing with us. Hell, we had a record turnout one night of like 21 people in channel...

I just want people logging in to play with.

Also, so I don't seem like I'm derailing Bish's thread I'm currently typing up a book in Notepad to copy over.

lol resident box dweller

****, I woke the bairn up....

[Snuggles Time]

As mentioned in the thread before, but it needs to be said again.

If you make LRMS viable for tier 1/2/ tiers 4/5 are going to be a living hell.

[Mead]

JC Daxion, on 17 March 2016 - 08:11 PM, said:

Honestly, i don't get the hate for ghost heat.. It sure isn't perfect, but it does help curb a lot of boating. I'll take that, verse getting popped by 4PPC's or quad Clan ERLL's ext..

I'm hoping the next system is better.. but i will just wait and see. People also have to remember that most of the player base are not top players, they are weekend warriors that wanna have fun, and play a game that lets them play with all the mechs, and all the weapon systems The meat and potato players.. those are the ones that need to enjoy the game, for any game to work for the masses

If each additional laser had added a portion of "ghost heat" to the total then it might have been easier to swallow, but as it is now, dat threshold. Go home, consistency, you're drunk.

[Widowmaker1981]

MischiefSC, on 17 March 2016 - 08:46 PM, said:

Make them AC5 speed with LOS. Tight pattern. Flat trajectory.

Indirect fire, wider spread, existing speed.

That would be a good start.

How about make Artemis do what you suggest? (flatten trajectory, massive velocity boost, spread reduction) It only works in LOS, so would have the effect of buffing direct fire while not buffing indirect, AND it increases the value of larger launchers, because Artemis is cheaper when you have fewer launchers..