95 replies to this topic

[LordNothing]

i have to say it. the last two light mechs i mastered were the ach and the jenner iic. i found the jenner iic to be the much more evil of the bunch. its sneaky and has 36 tubes of death. hug the back end of any mech and fire, its usually an instakill. the cheetah gets hot and is really only good for hit and run work. you usually have to break off and go in for another pass, by which time some kind of reinforcement shows up. the jenner iic meanwhile as gotten me 3+ assault/heavy mechs more than once.

[Troutmonkey]

cazidin, on 21 March 2016 - 02:16 PM, said:

I propose that the Arctic Cheetah receives the following negative quirks and changes to make it balanced with other Light Mechs.

1.Increase the volume by 30%, basically the Catapult in reverse.
2.Increase the CT hitbox to Dire Wolf Black Hole levels.
3.Negative structure quirks for the arms and legs. No less than 50%.
4.Negative weapon cooldown and beam duration quirks. No less than 50%.
5.Give it Ammo Quirks. Because after all those nerfs I feel sorry for it.

ACH seems fine. Before the structure nerf they were pretty scary, but now their arms keep falling off. I'd rather play my Firestarters and Jenners right now

[Strength Damage Cliff Racer]

cazidin, on 21 March 2016 - 02:16 PM, said:

I propose that the Arctic Cheetah receives the following negative quirks and changes to make it balanced with other Light Mechs.

1.Increase the volume by 30%, basically the Catapult in reverse.
2.Increase the CT hitbox to Dire Wolf Black Hole levels.
3.Negative structure quirks for the arms and legs. No less than 50%.
4.Negative weapon cooldown and beam duration quirks. No less than 50%.
5.Give it Ammo Quirks. Because after all those nerfs I feel sorry for it.

6. Give it flamer heat gen -85% So it would be better than firestarter at making campfires.

[DovisKhan]

NoiseCrypt, on 21 March 2016 - 02:22 AM, said:

Just wait until you meet a Spider then...

gj

talk about that salt mine, hope their whiny reports got ignored

[Wolfways]

Krivvan, on 21 March 2016 - 07:54 PM, said:

Which will be balanced out by the fact that you can take multiple Light mechs for a heavier mech, which you cannot do in MWO. Games where each player plays a mech and a game where each player has multiple mechs have different balances. Who would've thunk it.

Yeah can't do that in a 12 v 12 game.
*runs off to play another 10v12 match*

[Strength Damage Cliff Racer]

What I think needs to be done is actually buffing lights, but not in the way THEY work but in the way how MAPS treat them. I feel excited when I find another possible route for my locust. Give a bunch of such holes for every map and you get enemy team wasting time just to secure possible exits for these creepy crawlies. Or ignoring these and getting fully justified back scratch. Of, let's say, locust SRM2 machinegun.

[Clanner Scum]

Revis Volek, on 21 March 2016 - 01:18 PM, said:

LOL so because i BUY a BWM my opinion is invalidated vs someone who got it given to them? or found it? stole it? etc?


How does money being spent make someone opinon any less valid OP? Just because i bought ACH means I am also biased and a jerk?


You really need to look in the mirror. ACH is fine its your skills that need a little help.

Well I AM a tier2 pilot so my personal skill isn't the issue here.

It's the mech.

Edited by Clanner Scum, 22 March 2016 - 04:20 AM.

[Triordinant]

Krivvan, on 21 March 2016 - 07:54 PM, said:

Which will be balanced out by the fact that you can take multiple Light mechs for a heavier mech, which you cannot do in MWO. Games where each player plays a mech and a game where each player has multiple mechs have different balances. Who would've thunk it.

Last I looked your unit has a fixed number of 'mechs so you can't swap several lights for an assault. It looks like it'll be like previous MW games where bigger is always better.

[Pjwned]

The only part about it that needs to be nerfed is the ECM and a couple quirks on some of the omnipods, and that's it.

More mechs (and light mechs in particular) should strive to be as good as the Cheetah--without overdone quirks that is.

Edited by Pjwned, 22 March 2016 - 04:46 AM.

[Bud Crue]

To me, nerfs and buffs should be used for the following reasons and in this order

1) to make an otherwise POS mech viable.
2) to make a viable mech distinctive as compared to others of similar weight and role.
3) to make a role specific mech more than a one trick pony.

I believe that PGI actually does fairly well with 1-3, most of the time. There are of course, exceptions where they have failed miserably, but here the problems are more with the weapons of the mech and or improper sizing of the mech (see for example the oversized Treb and its traditional role with a weapon system that many consider fairly weak (LRMs) -no amount of quirks and buffs are going to encourage players to be huge fans of that mech).

Looking at the Cheetah, it is in the perfect place for a Clan mech. Clearly, step 1 above is not an issue. That leaves 2 and 3. As to its roles and limitations, I see it as the aggressive harasser that the more supportive Mist Lynx could never be. It is the durable short range laser brawler to the more snipe-y Adder and generalist Kitfox. If anything, imho the Cheetah is a great lens through which the other light clan mechs should be viewed. Through that lens perhaps one might start to see some of the shortcoming of the other clan lights, and then give them a pass with steps 1-3 above and see if any need a bit of help. Maybe they do and maybe they don't, but clearly when compared to the others the Cheetah is exactly what it is supposed to be (a tough little knife fighter), and it seems just fine.

Note: before they nerfed its structure after release, I too thought it was OP. Now however, the only time I think it is a horror, is when they are in groups that effectively wolf pack. But I feel the same way about most lights. So again, I don't see the mech as anything other than a really good light mech that is perfectly positioned in the hierarchy of the clan line up).

Edited by Bud Crue, 22 March 2016 - 04:57 AM.

[DovisKhan]

Krivvan, on 21 March 2016 - 02:14 AM, said:

You can look at the pure numbers, it objectively has less HP than a Firestarter. Remember that the Arctic Cheetah today has zero durability quirks and zero heat quirks. As a 30 ton mech it has the durability of an unquirked Spider or a quirked Locust.

It does have slightly better hitboxes than a Firestarter, but the smaller HP count means a good alpha or two nevertheless screws it.

Firestarter is 5 tons heavier and doesn't have an ECM, it's apples and oranges.

Spider 5D is the equivalent as it's an IS light at 30 tons capable of ECm, however it has half the damage and only 35 more structure in total, only 15 of which are actually relevant being STs and CT (each 5 structure)


Other 30 tonner is Urbie and everyone knows it pales against a Cheetah



So it's objectively much better than anything at or below it's tonnage, finding better or equivalent mechs at higher tonnage SHOULD be the case, so that argument is moot

Edited by DovisKhan, 22 March 2016 - 05:03 AM.

[Bud Crue]

DovisKhan, on 22 March 2016 - 05:03 AM, said:

So it's objectively much better than anything at or below it's tonnage, finding better or equivalent mechs at higher tonnage SHOULD be the case, so that argument is moot

I just disagree. I've killed plenty of Cheetahs in my Spiders (and even more in my Locusts), and many of them have killed me. The only time I see them as some sort of OP threat is when they are in groups and I am in something slow. But this is true of all lights.

[CDLord HHGD]

All mechs need to be debuffed to parity then rebuild from that baseline as needed.

[Valdarion Silarius]

Alot of people are bashing the OP, but I understand completely where he is coming from. I think the TRIAL arctic cheetah is pretty damn OP.











I do a steady basis of 500-700 damage with several kills on each match with the trial version. The mech does insanely well with laser cool downs, critical chances with the tcomp and structural bonuses.

My custom executioner nor any of my assault mechs do even do this good during quick plays. However being the naive me, I went and bought a c-bills version of the Arctic Cheetah and realized how under performing it was compared to the trial version. Once I saw that price tag of 4,000 MC for the same exact version of the Arctic Cheetah, I realized what PGI was doing.

Baiting people into buying the MC version compared to the actual balanced C Bill version of the Arctic Cheetah.

So let me clarify that I know exactly why the OP is frustrated. Yeah, the trial version of the Arctic Cheetah is a ridiculously good mech. I suggest that the OP tries a c-bill Arctic Cheetah to reconsider his statement. However, I dislike the baiting tactic used by PGI to get you to spend your hard earned shekels to buy the exact trial Arctic Cheetah Prime(c) version, while my executioner suffers from crappy hit boxes and constant CT's.

Edited by Arnold The Governator, 22 March 2016 - 05:53 AM.

[Coolant]

Pilots are saying you just have to leg it, and I agree. Still doesn't explain shut down arctic cheetahs taking multiple alphas, back or front and not dying. Saw an arctic cheetah shut down yesterday and took 2 gauss...twice. It's a crutch mech.

[Johnny Z]

The Arctic Cheddar is easily the strongest light mech in the game and has a good chance 1 v 1 against any other mech of any weight class.

[Gyrok]

Arnold The Governator, on 22 March 2016 - 05:49 AM, said:

Alot of people are bashing the OP, but I understand completely where he is coming from. I think the TRIAL arctic cheetah is pretty damn OP.











I do a steady basis of 500-700 damage with several kills on each match with the trial version. The mech does insanely well with laser cool downs, critical chances with the tcomp and structural bonuses.

My custom executioner nor any of my assault mechs do even do this good during quick plays. However being the naive me, I went and bought a c-bills version of the Arctic Cheetah and realized how under performing it was compared to the trial version. Once I saw that price tag of 4,000 MC for the same exact version of the Arctic Cheetah, I realized what PGI was doing.

Baiting people into buying the MC version compared to the actual balanced C Bill version of the Arctic Cheetah.

So let me clarify that I know exactly why the OP is frustrated. Yeah, the trial version of the Arctic Cheetah is a ridiculously good mech. I suggest that the OP tries a c-bill Arctic Cheetah to reconsider his statement. However, I dislike the baiting tactic used by PGI to get you to spend your hard earned shekels to buy the exact trial Arctic Cheetah Prime(c) version, while my executioner suffers from crappy hit boxes and constant CT's.

My Whammy puts up bigger numbers than that routinely...and nobody is calling that mech OP.

You just found something that "clicks" for you...enjoy it. ACH is not OP.

Coolant, on 22 March 2016 - 06:01 AM, said:

Pilots are saying you just have to leg it, and I agree. Still doesn't explain shut down arctic cheetahs taking multiple alphas, back or front and not dying. Saw an arctic cheetah shut down yesterday and took 2 gauss...twice. It's a crutch mech.

Somebody missed their shot...I promise you.

I had an ACH stop about ~200m in front of me the other day to shoot down a UAV. While he stopped, I hit him with the 53 alpha on my 6D whammy and absolutely 1 shot killed him from 100% health through the CT.

Not OP.

[Green Mamba]

I gave up on them nerfing Clans and bought me an Arctic Cheater...Finally got my Ace of Spades Title with it to...Never got 8 kills before since playing for 3 plus years not even in my pre-nerf ER PPC stalker from way back.

[cazidin]

Confirmed Cheater, on 22 March 2016 - 02:24 AM, said:

6. Give it flamer heat gen -85% So it would be better than firestarter at making campfires.

Actually, I was thinking that the Arctic Cheetah should get a 2.5% AMS ROF quirk too. Now that I think about it... maybe a PPC velocity quirk too? /Continues to throw darts, presumably at a board and not the taunting squirrel outside.

[MadIrish]

Agreed the Arctic Cheetah has issues that make it as tuff as a heavy mech, it needs to be fixed.