21 replies to this topic

[BasTagE]

Just out of curiosity, I am wondering if there would be any interest from players or plans to develop or test from the devs with Land/Air Mechs or LAMs within the MWO Universe?

Despite the poor armor on those configs, they could bring a new element of recon and air support conceptually...


comments?

[TKSax]

PGI when asked so No.

[Barantor]

I believe they said at one point it wasn't under consideration at all, much like the quad mechs.

[DivineEvil]

There's no conditions viable to handle LAM to even respectable degree. Don't be ridiculous. We all know what kind of scale is required to utilize combat planes.

[Metus regem]

DivineEvil, on 22 March 2016 - 09:31 AM, said:

There's no conditions viable to handle LAM to even respectable degree. Don't be ridiculous. We all know what kind of scale is required to utilize combat planes.

Even in Air Mech mode, they could be viable with correct implementation of Wing in Ground Effect (WiGE) movement, they would hover half an Atlas height above the ground, meaning a lot of cover would be rendered useless. The benefit of it would be doing 151km/h, provided you maintain 150m of forward movement... Also gliding down form high areas to avoid falling damage too.

The would offer some unique gameplay at the very least, not necessarily better, just different.

[dario03]

DivineEvil, on 22 March 2016 - 09:31 AM, said:

There's no conditions viable to handle LAM to even respectable degree. Don't be ridiculous. We all know what kind of scale is required to utilize combat planes.

Yeah they would be out of bounds before they could even hit top speed in full out flight mode. Well...unless they were made to hit top speed in like 2 seconds then you could maybe do it on alpine if you went from one end to the other in a circle.
And people already complain about hitting 140kph lights, what would happen with 1600kph flying lights that the netcode/engine couldn't even handle.

Edited by dario03, 22 March 2016 - 09:41 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

I'm sorry, but the idea of LAMs are dumb IMO. I'm glad MWO will not be implementing that idea.

[Metus regem]

dario03, on 22 March 2016 - 09:40 AM, said:

Yeah they would be out of bounds before they could even hit top speed in full out flight mode. Well...unless they were made to hit top speed in like 2 seconds then you could maybe do it on alpine if you went from one end to the other in a circle.
And people already complain about hitting 140kph lights, what would happen with 1600kph flying lights that the netcode/engine couldn't even handle.

Again one does not need to put in Aerospace mode for LAM's, even the hybrid state should be enough, that hybrid state already has a speed that functions with in the current game rules....

[dario03]

Metus regem, on 22 March 2016 - 09:43 AM, said:

Again one does not need to put in Aerospace mode for LAM's, even the hybrid state should be enough, that hybrid state already has a speed that functions with in the current game rules....

Which is why I said full flight mode. They could put in the hybrid mode but then its missing a big part of its features.

Edited by dario03, 22 March 2016 - 09:54 AM.

[jss78]

The problem is that even traditional lights don't really have a role in the game. With that I mean scout/recon role lights, most commonly 20 tonners. Not needed as scouting is dead in this game (maps small and gameplay predictable). Most lights we see fall in a narrow subgroup of 35-ton combat light.

If there's no need for lights, what possible role could there be for LAMs which sacrifice even more combat ability for mobility?

If we had huge maps and need to recon large expanses, I'd love them.

[DivineEvil]

Metus regem, on 22 March 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

Even in Air Mech mode, they could be viable with correct implementation of Wing in Ground Effect (WiGE) movement, they would hover half an Atlas height above the ground, meaning a lot of cover would be rendered useless. The benefit of it would be doing 151km/h, provided you maintain 150m of forward movement... Also gliding down form high areas to avoid falling damage too.

The would offer some unique gameplay at the very least, not necessarily better, just different.

Then I'd be much, much less concerned if Trial mechs would be replaced entirely with different ComVec's, including copters. Battletech LAMs are mechs, that transform into Aero-Space Fighters - same Fighters, that deliver Air Strikes today. There's no capability to implement LAMs the way they're meant to be, and the way you describe will just make them a dead weight, because hovering will place you in everyone's crosshairs the moment you ascend, and drawbacks you'd pay for that questionable hovering ability will turn all LAMs into wasted design hours.

Besides, LAM is Harmony Gold's original idea from Macross series. Get LAM into MWO and achieve exactly the issues PGI avoided by creatively redesigning "Classic" mechs.

Edited by DivineEvil, 22 March 2016 - 10:01 AM.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

I wish.
I think we are likely to see Elementals become a playable option long before LAMs, and I dont think that is going to happen anytime soon.

I would much rather see physical melee attacks, engine explosions, repair bays, non-mech vechicles etc etc etc before LAMs either way.

And I also agree with them really just not fitting in the game. Given the current issues with game physics and hit reg adding something like LAMs would be jumping out of the pan into the fire.

Also, if you are intent on trying to make a lore based argument then you should know that in this time period LAMs were all but extinct.

[Bishop Steiner]

BasTagE, on 22 March 2016 - 09:03 AM, said:

Just out of curiosity, I am wondering if there would be any interest from players or plans to develop or test from the devs with Land/Air Mechs or LAMs within the MWO Universe?

Despite the poor armor on those configs, they could bring a new element of recon and air support conceptually...


comments?

Metus regem, on 22 March 2016 - 09:37 AM, said:

Even in Air Mech mode, they could be viable with correct implementation of Wing in Ground Effect (WiGE) movement, they would hover half an Atlas height above the ground, meaning a lot of cover would be rendered useless. The benefit of it would be doing 151km/h, provided you maintain 150m of forward movement... Also gliding down form high areas to avoid falling damage too.

The would offer some unique gameplay at the very least, not necessarily better, just different.

about the only way they would be probably remotely resource viable would be if they are locked into Airmech Mode, permanently.

And even then, the sheer amount of resources "for test purposes"? Never happen. If they had that much free time to devote, there are a couple dozen more pressing things that need addressing.

Only way it could remotely happen would be a community campaign that dwarfed my Urbanmech efforts to convince Russ the financial support was there, and even then it would probably require a "money first/develop second" approach, like my Urbie. Only I'm pretty sure the target goal to get it into development would have to be 5-10 times greater than Urbie was since Urbie was just about time devoted to a new model, and a 360º rotation. Nothing actually new was implemented.

Even in a locked Air Mech congfig, you would still have to develop new hitbox models, new rigging, animations, make the WiGEs rules, mechanics, etc. For a Mech to Air Mech convertor? Probably 25x the sales the Urbie needed. And unless we got War Thunder sized Maps (which would get the impatient CoD crowd in normal mechs crying like babies) we will never see actual Fighter mode.

On top of that, 90% of people would cry because they would almost certainly have no Quirks, much like IIC mechs, and in fact because they are supposed ot be fragile (just look at the whining the Bads Who Stare are doing about the RFL, a "fragile" Mech, that actually does just fine...if you keep moving).

So realistically? Not going to happen.

I'd Actually enjoy having locked Airmechs in game, I think, but just too many hurdles, not enough financial incentive.

[Metus regem]

And I agree Bishop, it's a pipe dream for me, but I still want them.

[martian]

BasTagE, on 22 March 2016 - 09:03 AM, said:

Just out of curiosity, I am wondering if there would be any interest from players or plans to develop or test from the devs with Land/Air Mechs or LAMs within the MWO Universe?

Despite the poor armor on those configs, they could bring a new element of recon and air support conceptually...

comments?

How I see it:
1) Maps are not large enough to utilize LAMs fully.
2) LAMs are not needed because in three quarters of games you can guess where the enemy is coming from.
3) LAMs are very fragile and their speed is their best defense. However, the game engine has its limitations and can't handle 'Mechs moving too fast.
Plus, the problems with hitreg would be probably much worse with LAMs.
4) LAMs do not sport significant firepower. That would be a problem in MWO where your score and C-Bill earnings depend mostly on how much damage you can do.
5) LAMs have three modes. That means that PGI would have to effectively model three different 'Mechs.

DivineEvil, on 22 March 2016 - 09:55 AM, said:

Besides, LAM is Harmony Gold's original idea from Macross series. Get LAM into MWO and achieve exactly the issues PGI avoided by creatively redesigning "Classic" mechs.

The easiest thing to do is to redesign those traditional LAMs slightly to avoid potential lawsuit,
exactly as CGL has done in case of BattleTech Unseen LAMs and PGI has done with its redesigned Phoenix Hawk.

Edited by martian, 22 March 2016 - 11:02 AM.

[Richard Hazen]

I think the next step should be proper melee if possible.

[Bishop Steiner]

Will Hawker, on 22 March 2016 - 11:03 AM, said:

I think the next step should be proper melee if possible.

Because the only thing cooler than flying mechs is mechs with Hatchets and Swords jumping up and cutting their wings off.....

[Richard Hazen]

Damn right I just think we should fully realise the potential of the current mechs rather than going off at a tangent on something that could be drastically more difficult to achieve and require considerably more time.

Edited by Will Hawker, 22 March 2016 - 11:25 AM.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 March 2016 - 11:14 AM, said:

Because the only thing cooler than flying mechs is mechs with Hatchets and Swords jumping up and cutting their wings off.....

Much better... go-go Hatchetman!

[MeiSooHaityu]

Metus regem, on 22 March 2016 - 11:32 AM, said:

Much better... go-go Hatchetman!

Just a little off the top.

That Hatchetman reminds me of an insane barber that wishes he was a Lumberjack.