1049 replies to this topic

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

April: Kodiak
May: ?????

Kodiak is May, no mech will be released this month: http://mwomercs.com/...230-kodiak-faq/

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 April 2016 - 12:02 PM, said:

We don't really need more IS mechs... Clans are the ones in dire need of more variety, I would not be disappointed if the rest of 2016 was all Clan, aside from the mystery mid month mech.

As someone who plays both, I would be. The argument could be made we don't' really need ANY more mechs, period. But PGI needs to sell to keep the lights on, and to do so they need both sides of the player base happy. Orr equally unhappy, depending on who you ask.

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 08 April 2016 - 12:03 PM, said:

Kodiak is May, no mech will be released this month: http://mwomercs.com/...230-kodiak-faq/

my bad, will edit.

dang shame...looks like it's near release ready.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 April 2016 - 12:05 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 12:03 PM, said:

As someone who plays both, I would be. The argument could be made we don't' really need ANY more mechs, period. But PGI needs to sell to keep the lights on, and to do so they need both sides of the player base happy. Orr equally unhappy, depending on who you ask.


my bad, will edit.

I play both too, but:

Lights: IS: 9 Clan: 5
Mediums: IS: 12(13) Clan: 5(6)
Heavies: IS: 13 Clan: 6
Assaults: IS: 10 Clan: 5(6)

After announced mechs in ( )

[LastKhan]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 12:03 PM, said:

As someone who plays both, I would be. The argument could be made we don't' really need ANY more mechs, period. But PGI needs to sell to keep the lights on, and to do so they need both sides of the player base happy. Orr equally unhappy, depending on who you ask.


my bad, will edit.

dang shame...looks like it's near release ready.

Im pretty much along those lines of not needing more mechs. I would rather see more gameplay features and maps. I dream of a Metro map.

[1453 R]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

Certainly, they will abandon some to history. Theres over 100 still possible mechs between IS and Clans, in this timeline. Ain't no way this game keeps afloat trudging through 8 years of mechs before skipping.

Heh…well, that and there will be rioting in the e-streets if Russ honestly tells us that getting the Whitworth in the game is more important to him than skipping forward and getting people their Bushwackers and Uziels. Not even the purest of TT purists is really going to be able to put their money behind that sort of decision. There’s certainly a few gems in the current timeline to hit, and nobody’s saying that they can’t introduce an Oldie once they jump forward, especially if that Oldie has FutureTech variants which really pop, but yeah. We’re starting to approach that event horizon wherein all options collapse into the FUTUUUURE.

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

So real world, what are the next 4 Clan Mechs and probable remaining 1 IS mech going to be?
2016:
Jan: Warhammer
Feb: Rifleman
March: Archer
April: Kodiak ????
May: ????? Kodiak
June: Phoenix Hawk
July: Viper (And Cyclops?)
August: (Cyclops?)
Sept: ????
Oct: ????
Nov: ????
Dec: ????

Well, the 2H/2M thing was for an ‘Omni’ pack, which limits choices there. We’ve been over the severe lack of options for heavy Omnis; I personally think the Night Gyr and Linebacker are sort of inevitable, with the Gyr getting the immediate nod as being a much more valuable machine. One of the mediums is obviously the Viper, and if I had to pick a second one right here and now, I’d probably go with the Huntsman being Russ’ second stringer. The Grendel still makes a strong case, and the Pouncer remains a workable option, but I don’t really see the Pouncer edging out either the visually interesting Grendel or the mechanically (semi)interesting Huntsman. So, ignoring the Spheroid Mystery Machine for the moment:

August: Night Gyr/Cyclops
September: Huntsman
October: Linebacker
November: N/A (Black Lanner? maybe Grendel? Alternately, a couple of BattleMechs[/i]
December: N/A/Clan BattleMech

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

Then... I would not be shocked to see a timeskip and new mech era announced for the opening of 2017.

Suppose that depends on how balls-deep they want to go with Solaris. Now that Russ is actively talking about it, and given the forum’s strong, if often contentious, desire for more gameplay/content over more ‘Mechs, I could see him delaying a timeskip in favor of Solaris. Especially if Piranha’s investigating new game engine technology, and doubly especially because Russ seems very skittish about a lot of FutureTech weapons. I may start a new thread soon with some ideas for FutureTech stuff implementations, see if we can spitball some more fair-and-balanced ideas for this junk, but I would not actually put it past Russ to decide that 2018 is a more likely date for a timeskip than 2017.

Use the rest of ’16 to iron out Commodity Warfare, finish up some of the high-profile ‘Mech releases, and mebbe block out Solaris, then use ’17 to do their game engine upgrade, kick Solaris out the door, and deal with issues both of those raise (on top of releasing a series of ever-more-questionable ‘Mechs) before Russ admits that there’s nothing else he can do to stall before he has to deal with a timeline advance. And frankly, at that point we’ll have been at ‘3053’ for, like…three years, and will have advanced the timeline the freaking hard way anyways

[Gas Guzzler]

1453 R, on 08 April 2016 - 12:39 PM, said:

August: Night Gyr/Cyclops
September: Huntsman
October: Linebacker
November: N/A (Black Lanner? maybe Grendel? Alternately, a couple of BattleMechs[/i]
December: N/A/Clan BattleMech

I would be thrilled if after the second heavy they went with some assault omnis, for instance an ECM Kingfisher and CJF staple assault, the Turkina.

[Bishop Steiner]

LastKhan, on 08 April 2016 - 12:08 PM, said:

Im pretty much along those lines of not needing more mechs. I would rather see more gameplay features and maps. I dream of a Metro map.

Yeah, except one has no impact on the other...except without mechs being sold, no money for more maps, etc. But as far as personnel resources? No correlation.

Gas Guzzler, on 08 April 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

I play both too, but:

Lights: IS: 9 Clan: 5
Mediums: IS: 12(13) Clan: 5(6)
Heavies: IS: 13 Clan: 6
Assaults: IS: 10 Clan: 5(6)

After announced mechs in ( )

and that is pretty much the balance of available mechs between all the timelines. Clans never catch up in raw numbers, and you realyl can't hold the pre invasion mechs against IS Players. That was then, this is now.

Redo that match on releases since June 2014, and tell me what we see.

[ScarecrowES]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

My guesses for remaining IS of 2016: Cyclops (Mystery Mech), Crusader (close out the unseen classic cycle) and maybe the Assassin. ( Doubt my Vulcan will make the cut)

It's such a bad mech (unless it gets some good hardpoint inflation), but I have such nostalgia for the Assassin. That mech basically was MY MECH for Mech2: Mercs. I can see how MWO would ever do those experiences justice but... 100% would buy.

Edited by ScarecrowES, 08 April 2016 - 01:01 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

1453 R, on 08 April 2016 - 12:39 PM, said:

Suppose that depends on how balls-deep they want to go with Solaris. Now that Russ is actively talking about it, and given the forum’s strong, if often contentious, desire for more gameplay/content over more ‘Mechs, I could see him delaying a timeskip in favor of Solaris. Especially if Piranha’s investigating new game engine technology, and doubly especially because Russ seems very skittish about a lot of FutureTech weapons. I may start a new thread soon with some ideas for FutureTech stuff implementations, see if we can spitball some more fair-and-balanced ideas for this junk, but I would not actually put it past Russ to decide that 2018 is a more likely date for a timeskip than 2017.

Use the rest of ’16 to iron out Commodity Warfare, finish up some of the high-profile ‘Mech releases, and mebbe block out Solaris, then use ’17 to do their game engine upgrade, kick Solaris out the door, and deal with issues both of those raise (on top of releasing a series of ever-more-questionable ‘Mechs) before Russ admits that there’s nothing else he can do to stall before he has to deal with a timeline advance. And frankly, at that point we’ll have been at ‘3053’ for, like…three years, and will have advanced the timeline the freaking hard way anyways

Which is why I said beginning of 2017 or 2018 were the most likely candidates. I would probably prefer 2017, the caveat being the needs of incorporating Future Tech being too resource intensive and clashing with Solaris/Cryengine Update and PvE, something almost everyone with a modicum of objectivity are more important to long term continuance of the game than newer stompy robots.

We know Mech Packs WILL continues, because even if they better monetize, decals, paints, skins, and even Geo, it's going to be the bulk of their profit. Especially since adding all those mods across the board for existing mechs, is more work than actually creating a new mech model. Remember, every skin has to be mapped to each mech existing mech. Anyone who's watched Lauren's livefeed knows that's not quick work, even if monotonous at times)

Existing Issues with population size, MM Buckets etc make pay access maps an impossibility. So Mechs remain for the lion's share of income.

That said, we are at a balancing point where Tech Boredom is becoming almost as big a stink as stagnant Game Play features and content.

IMO, doing anything toward Solaris or PvE before deciding on the feasibility of the Cryengine Port (which if I understood the last town hall correctly is not even a given, but still needs to be researched?) seems like putting the cart ahead of the horse, and just causing more work to redo, port, etc.

That said, the people working on THAT end of the technical stuff, are NOT part and parcel to those handling modeling and weapons, etc. So it would be IMO the best allocation of resources to investigate then tackle the Cryengine Update while doing a Clan Invasion style Tech Update.

This actually would be a good, logical time fo 2 more Jumbo Packs (though whether or not their marketing shows Jumbo Burnout could make this a null point), a 4 Pack of New Tech Mechs for Each the IS and the Clans, featuring new timeline staples, which would give 4 months to adapt the tech of the timeskip (2 less than the Clan Invasion, but hopefully they have more an idea what is needed, too) and causing enough buzz, speculation and exciting to reignite some sales interest.

That's the thing, I think be it a Time Skip, PvE or Solaris, they NEED some Buzz starter to reignite passion. Of them, new Tech Mechs is the lowest hanging fruit, which is PGIs usual MO.

So, just some thoughts about the future. Could be dead wrong, or a regular frikking prophet. Who knows?

[Bishop Steiner]

ScarecrowES, on 08 April 2016 - 01:00 PM, said:

It's such a bad mech (unless it gets some good hardpoint inflation), but I have such nostalgia for the Assassin. That mech basically was MY MECH for Mech2: Mercs. I can see how MWO would ever do those experiences justice but... 100% would buy.

99% of Mechs get inflation.

Even if you just look at the basic and go 2xE RA, 2xM Rt, 2x M LT, you open up some interesting potential, especially on a 121 kph, 7 JJ mech with a profile between the ACH and the BJ.

MW2 Mercs...yup was my go to mech also. Would replace the SRM with a second LRM5, and moonwalk away from the oncoming enemy. LRM mechanics led to a lot of head kills, and an enemy that kept advancing into my effective range, while I kept sliding out of theirs. Good memories. Though I was never able to finish the game in it (usually the mission with the Flashman inside the crashed dropship was when I had to get a bigger mech).

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

and that is pretty much the balance of available mechs between all the timelines. Clans never catch up in raw numbers, and you realyl can't hold the pre invasion mechs against IS Players. That was then, this is now.

Redo that match on releases since June 2014, and tell me what we see.

Sure you can! That is the variety we have available.

Hell the king of brawling assaults right now was the first assault mech ever released.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 April 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

I would be thrilled if after the second heavy they went with some assault omnis, for instance an ECM Kingfisher and CJF staple assault, the Turkina.

unfortunately, I rate the likelihood of that happening as only slightly higher than your campaign to seduce Marthe Pryde actually happening.....

Gas Guzzler, on 08 April 2016 - 01:12 PM, said:

Sure you can! That is the variety we have available.

Hell the king of brawling assaults right now was the first assault mech ever released.

so what you're saying is spend the rest of the year driving off half the player base as they get bored of clan mech releases, over something that noone had any say or control over 2 years ago? Not smart marketing.

Back then, clan wasn't an option, and it was a known factor. Now they have two groups of fanbois to keep placated, if they wish to avoid defections. The scenario and marketing realities are totally different.

Simply put, it's not only kind of silly, but short sighted, financially. Especially if the current status quo on balance holds slightly favoring the IS. (personally I hope it doesn't, but just dealing with realities as they are NOW). Since currently you won't get any of the competitive players rushing to buy Clan Heavies ro Assaults, unless they are just insanely demonstrably meta, like the BANE could be.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 April 2016 - 01:18 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 01:16 PM, said:

unfortunately, I rate the likelihood of that happening as only slightly higher than your campaign to seduce Marthe Pryde actually happening.....


so what you're saying is spend the rest of the year driving off half the player base as they get bored of clan mech releases, over something that noone had any say or control over 2 years ago? Not smart marketing.

Back then, clan wasn't an option, and it was a known factor. Now they have two groups of fanbois to keep placated, if they wish to avoid defections. The scenario and marketing realities are totally different.

LOL!

And yeah, I guess not shutting off IS releases completely, but maybe just going a LITTLE heavier on Clan releases..

[ScarecrowES]

Luckily, doing a time skip itself is very easy. For the purposes of the game, it means merely adjusting the starting points for the Sphere map at the start of a CW session, and putting the right factions in the right locations. It's very minimal impact for the art department, and minimal for the background stuff (doing a "find and replace" search in text documents is hardly difficult). And of course, coding would be minimal to non-existent.

You've got a few factions to add, but as long as you stay within the Invasion era (3050-3060) you've still got the very basic "IS" vs "Clan" positioning. It's just a matter of having to establish a system to handle faction/tech assignments that allows for more complexity than "IS uses only IS tech" and "Clan uses only Clan-tech."

But starting that, you've established a baseline system onto which you can graft new weapons, tech, and mechs that can't exist within the scope of the current game.

Moving the timeline will be super easy. It's the stuff that comes after that might be harder. New weapons will probably need little or no new modeling, so that's great. Mostly it's going to be a bit of coding... but more significantly tuning. Other than the art assets, weapons exist only in the realm of text documents. The coding doesn't need to be modified unless the new weapons have new mechanics (ATMs). Otherwise it's just a matter of tuning a bunch of numbers in text.

The process for mechs is really no different.

Honestly, a time jump is not likely nearly as much work as many people would expect it to be. It is, reasonably, the "low hanging fruit." But it opens up a whole new world of mechs, conflicts, gameplay options, and paves the way for new tech.

[Bishop Steiner]

Gas Guzzler, on 08 April 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

LOL!

And yeah, I guess not shutting off IS releases completely, but maybe just going a LITTLE heavier on Clan releases..

Rest of the year, it would be... 4 to 2. And yet the final tally would be 6/6. Otherwise IS gets nothing to look forward to the rest of the year.

Personally, I wish they would alternate monthly, or even better do the one of each they claimed they would, with the Invasion...but yeah, we all know how that worked out.

Still, it would get out everybody's faves faster, and put us in line to be timeskip ready sooner. So, possible win/wins, aside fromt eh Pokemech collectors who may object to spending twice as much.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 01:20 PM, said:

Rest of the year, it would be... 4 to 2. And yet the final tally would be 6/6. Otherwise IS gets nothing to look forward to the rest of the year.

Personally, I wish they would alternate monthly, or even better do the one of each they claimed they would, with the Invasion...but yeah, we all know how that worked out.

Still, it would get out everybody's faves faster, and put us in line to be timeskip ready sooner. So, possible win/wins, aside fromt eh Pokemech collectors who may object to spending twice as much.

There art department has began to grow a little bit so they could potentially start churning out two per month..

[Bishop Steiner]

ScarecrowES, on 08 April 2016 - 01:20 PM, said:

Luckily, doing a time skip itself is very easy. For the purposes of the game, it means merely adjusting the starting points for the Sphere map at the start of a CW session, and putting the right factions in the right locations. It's very minimal impact for the art department, and minimal for the background stuff (doing a "find and replace" search in text documents is hardly difficult). And of course, coding would be minimal to non-existent.

You've got a few factions to add, but as long as you stay within the Invasion era (3050-3060) you've still got the very basic "IS" vs "Clan" positioning. It's just a matter of having to establish a system to handle faction/tech assignments that allows for more complexity than "IS uses only IS tech" and "Clan uses only Clan-tech."

But starting that, you've established a baseline system onto which you can graft new weapons, tech, and mechs that can't exist within the scope of the current game.

Moving the timeline will be super easy. It's the stuff that comes after that might be harder. New weapons will probably need little or no new modeling, so that's great. Mostly it's going to be a bit of coding... but more significantly tuning. Other than the art assets, weapons exist only in the realm of text documents. The coding doesn't need to be modified unless the new weapons have new mechanics (ATMs). Otherwise it's just a matter of tuning a bunch of numbers in text.

The process for mechs is really no different.

Honestly, a time jump is not likely nearly as much work as many people would expect it to be. It is, reasonably, the "low hanging fruit." But it opens up a whole new world of mechs, conflicts, gameplay options, and paves the way for new tech.

Moving a timeline, without updating the available tech, is a halfass expedient, that will cause more complaints and issues than it solves. Sure, IF it includes the mkII, it'll hopefully mollify Imperius, (unless it turns out to be less amazing than hoped), but that alone ain't the point of a timeshift.

And anything that includes even adding the new introduced tech, even to your precious 3059 (which is not a guaranteed waypoint, no matter how much you reiterate it). will require months of meeting, coding in house testing and balance, etc. Just liek it did for the Clan INvasion. Maybe not as intensive since they don't have to cosmetically create a whole new look/feel, but it's not just fudging lines on a map.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 April 2016 - 01:27 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

1453 R, on 08 April 2016 - 11:42 AM, said:

We’re honestly just about out of top-flight OmniMechs in the current timeline. There’s a few good options for mediums (I maintain that the Grendel would be a nifty halfway point between a Huntsman and a Viper, but I also know for a fact I’m alone in that opinion), but after the two mediums/two heavies Russ had mentioned, I’m thinking we’re either going to start seeing more Clan BattleMechs and other second-liners, or that’s rightabouts the time when he’s going to start investigating a timeskip.

Let’s all face reality here – there’s going to be ‘Mechs that get ‘abandoned’ by the timeline. Most of them will probably be things nobody cares about – I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again; ain’t nobody cares if the Whitworth ever gets into this game – but while Russ’ determination to get as many timeline-appropriate machines as he can in before the soft cutoff is indeed cool, we’re not getting all of them.

Frankly, I think a lot of it is buying the devs time to try and figure out how to implement/balance certain types of FutureTech equipment. Russ seems particularly concerned with heavy lasers, and I can see where people just would not appreciate dealing with HAG-40s (or MRM-40s). Coding for things like MMLs or ATMs make their whole “we can’t do ammo switching between slug and cluster rounds for LBX autocannons” schtick really, really painful.

Suppose that means there’s still a shot for non top-flight Omnis like the Turdkina to make it in. Frankly the Mega Turkey could probably be made to compete with the Whale alright-ish if it was given significantly wider twist arcs/speeds, or other torso mobility boons over the War Blimp. Less firepower, significantly worse hardpoints, but better ability to get what guns it does have on target. Seems to sorta fit with the jumpy semi-precision thing Turkeys do. Beyond that…well, we’ll need to get into BattleMechs before too long here, unless Piranha wants to try and sell just outright bad OmniMechs.

Which, given the Mist Lynx, they’re perfectly willing to do. Just don’t see that working nearly as well in these modern Singleton Pack days.

I care if the Whitworth gets abandoned I want it in Battletech, though I've lost a lot of passion since it's only going to be lance sized units

Seriously it's no worse looking mech than the TRO Quickdraw, or Blackjack.

[Bishop Steiner]

Cathy, on 08 April 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

I care if the Whitworth gets abandoned I want it in Battletech, though I've lost a lot of passion since it's only going to be lance sized units

Seriously it's no worse looking mech than the TRO Quickdraw, or Blackjack.

Yeah, though I would not hold off later patches and stuff that allow for larger unit battles. But anything above 12v12 would get real unwieldy unless they skip to the old big unit rules, which honestly were boring to me.

Also, the look of the Whitworthless never bothered me.... it was how boring they were to play, lol. Solid unit, actually, but I always preferred the Dervish for my Medium Missile boat. Felt the speed was worth the slight armor difference.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 08 April 2016 - 01:28 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Bishop Steiner, on 08 April 2016 - 01:16 PM, said:

unfortunately, I rate the likelihood of that happening as only slightly higher than your campaign to seduce Marthe Pryde actually happening.....


so what you're saying is spend the rest of the year driving off half the player base as they get bored of clan mech releases, over something that noone had any say or control over 2 years ago? Not smart marketing.

Back then, clan wasn't an option, and it was a known factor. Now they have two groups of fanbois to keep placated, if they wish to avoid defections. The scenario and marketing realities are totally different.

Simply put, it's not only kind of silly, but short sighted, financially. Especially if the current status quo on balance holds slightly favoring the IS. (personally I hope it doesn't, but just dealing with realities as they are NOW). Since currently you won't get any of the competitive players rushing to buy Clan Heavies ro Assaults, unless they are just insanely demonstrably meta, like the BANE could be.

I agree but when have P.G.I been long sighted