94 replies to this topic

[Afuldan McKronik]

At this point the game engine is so convoluted, the Cryengine guys cant make heads or tails of it, and some of it seems beyond PGI's ability to comprehend also.

[Johnny Z]

Mister Blastman, on 25 April 2016 - 11:00 AM, said:

First decision: Not use Cryengine!

Second decision: Blend the TT themes with a modern approach.


And by that, in the second decision, I mean...

TT is about long, drawn-out fights with lots of nail biting, so consider the tt system designed for... tt and dice... and thus make the MWO system either use modified values or tt values with modified mechanics such as a huge increase to the number of armor hitboxes, etc., to reward skill and accuracy and help spread damage.

That's just a start.

Third decision: Allow users to host the servers.
Fourth decision: Allow users to create custom content.
Fifth decision: NOT FREE TO PLAY. One purchase, one product. Occasional expansion packs made of full single-player campaigns, maps and robits.

Which one is most important? That is hard to say--probably all of them but getting rid of free to play is a big one.



Not using cryengine is a legitimate point. It is a difficult to swallow one, but it is a valid one.

I think most of these ideas are really bad. If not for the idea of having some kind of price on entry you would deserve an award for bad ideas.

9 dollars or something under 10 dollars would be a good idea as a "cover charge". If for no other reason than to keep trolls out and guys rerolling accounts after being banned for free. But also then players that think the game is worth 10 dollars to try out are a little bit invested.

A cover charge is not a new idea and I always liked it.

[Afuldan McKronik]

Give em an incentive to boot for that cover charge. "Heres your shiny new stock Hbk-4g! Plus you get a cadet bonus!"

[Johnny Z]

Afuldan McKronik, on 25 April 2016 - 01:44 PM, said:

Give em an incentive to boot for that cover charge. "Heres your shiny new stock Hbk-4g! Plus you get a cadet bonus!"

No doubt. The loaner trial mechs always seemed cheesey and what better way to ensure new players are not at all invested in the game the are trying out.

A starter mech is a great idea.

Edited by Johnny Z, 25 April 2016 - 01:52 PM.

[Mister Blastman]

Johnny Z, on 25 April 2016 - 01:42 PM, said:

I think most of these ideas are really bad. If not for the idea of having some kind of price on entry you would deserve an award for bad ideas.

9 dollars or something under 10 dollars would be a good idea as a "cover charge". If for no other reason than to keep trolls out and guys rerolling accounts after being banned for free. But also then players that think the game is worth 10 dollars to try out are a little bit invested.

A cover charge is not a new idea and I always liked it.

I know you are but what am I. That's what your post sounds like.

Specifically what part of each idea is bad?

As far as I can tell you're irritated I would even dare suggest free to play is a bad idea--and it is. Free to play is a poison to gaming and leads to terrible design decisions in the name of quick, easy money.

[Troutmonkey]

I would have picked an engine different to CryEngine, most likely Unreal. Unity 5 is pretty good now but in 2011 it wouldn't have been nearly good enough for this sort of game.

I would have spent a lot more time creating a better new player experience, with better tutorials, better user interfaces, and more meaningful progression in regards to levelling up mechs.

[Anjian]

Why keep blaming the game engine?

I just started playing Armored Warfare, and immediately on the same hardware, I am playing very high quality modes, with superbly smooth framerates. I am seeing huge maps with so much structures and textures, with incredible photorealistic detail on them. For a moment there I cannot believe this is the same game engine on MWO. The difference is like night and day.

Sample:


The only reasonable conclusion I can get from this experience is that PGI's development team blows.

Edited by Anjian, 25 April 2016 - 09:21 PM.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Anjian, on 25 April 2016 - 09:18 PM, said:

Why keep blaming the game engine?

I just started playing Armored Warfare, and immediately on the same hardware, I am playing very high quality modes, with superbly smooth framerates. I am seeing huge maps with so much structures and textures, with incredible photorealistic detail on them. For a moment there I cannot believe this is the same game engine on MWO. The difference is like night and day.

Sample:


The only reasonable conclusion I can get from this experience is that PGI's development team blows.

Its not the same engine, AW uses a later and more functional version of cryengine.
Not the zero support beta engine PGI picked up for 2 pieces of bread and a bottle of syrup

[Anjian]

So what version of the CryEngine did PGI use? According to AW.com, AW is using CryEngine 3, which was the one announced in 2009.

https://aw.my.com/us/about

http://www.crytek.co...ngine3/overview

Another game that uses CryEngine 3.

Edited by Anjian, 25 April 2016 - 11:54 PM.

[Doctor Hell]

1. I wouldn't have lied to my playing (paying) base about CW 30 days after open beta when they had not lifted a finger on it. And then continued to lie for the next two years about it.

2. I would have hired a skilled high school kid to make a user interface. This game still has the UI of any game ever made even after three attempts.


I could go on forever. You can't make a game out of a house of cards. The ONLY thing this game ever had going for it was the artwork on the mechs. I predict they will cancel the World Championship due to lack on interest and lack of money. And then, that will basically be it. The game is nearing it's logical end. PGI has alienated a large portion of it's fan base and the Whales are growing tired of funding it. I hardly ever see new blood. It is the same 200 or so people in every tier1 match.

[Doctor Hell]

Oderint dum Metuant, on 25 April 2016 - 04:39 AM, said:

Oh Boy where to begin!

I would (In no order)

• Not commit suicide by telling people who funded the game, they aren't the target audience or they are on an island bro.
  
• Picked a game engine that was fully functional, not one that came without netcode and DX11 graphics pipelines that sucked out huge amounts of time.
  
• Not lied about getting CW 90 days after beta when i knew i hadn't even got past napkin stage.
  
• Not bothered with a quick play
  
• Instead of quickplay CW is the primary game mode, this mode features Assault, Conquest, Skirmish and later Domination, Scouting 4v4 with all maps and their variations - The giant IS battle should be the hook that keeps people playing.
  
• Not neglect the new player experience until it became too late.
  
• Complete a full featured Solaris module, stable creation, Cbill betting, 1v1,2v2,3v3, free for all. ( This is your esports module)
  
• Employ or get volunteer Game Masters, who lead each faction in CW this allows player drive alliances, betrayals and politics - Drama - Fun- Engagement
  
• Employ an actual UI designer who understands the concepts of UI design ( Simple, Sleek, minimize repetition unnecessary button clicks )
  
• Design an active radar/passive radar concept (ala MW4), including weight class metrics and ranges of detection.
  
• Create maps that are not moba style corridors, more maps in the style of Polar but each with it's own flavor of rolling hills, open expanses, cityscapes.
  
• Not employ a stalker as a community manager.
  
• Balance the game without the band aid system, no ghost heat, no gauss charge up, actual checks and balances.
  
• Part of 13 is the introduction of an actual heat scale system.
  
• Allow Unit leader and appropriate ranks, to withdraw unit cbills and distribute to team - Seriously it just sits there for nothing.
  
• For CW implement a salvage system (bonus cbills for mech disablement rather than destruction) Re-implement re-arm and repair.
  
• Implement a pilot skill system revolving around specializations (not lore friendly sorry!) people that want to scout invest skills into scouting - Quicker radar locks/target Info/Capping/ Ability to remain undetected at range etc etc.
  
• Introduce sized hard points to aid balancing.
  
• HIRE AN ACTUAL QA TEAM, the office cat does not qualify.

Theres more...but my brains gone with all the things i would do....

This. Especially #1. When you are condescending to your paying customers, you WILL fail.

[Bishop Steiner]

Biggest mistake/thing I would change?


IGP.

Beyond that, since it's obvious that Russ desires to chase the Esport Dragon, Instead of filling peoples heads with nonsense of CW and a grand persistent mercenary Simlite... should have advertised it as MW: Solaris and the Founders Packs shoudl have been sold as Solaris Stable slots, and the whole focus should have been on the Arena Experience. Even the "biggest" CW map honestly is Arena sized.

[The Amazing Atomic Spaniel]

Alistair Winter, on 23 April 2016 - 12:06 PM, said:

• Abandon CW all together. Never promise CW. Never develop it. Battletech is too much of a niche game, and CW is such a huuuge project for such a small company.
  
• Make 2 different experiences for MWO. The first is Solaris PVP. Leaderboards, crazy customization, min-maxing, esports, all that. The second is single-player PVE campaigns with mission packs and DLC you can buy.

Pretty much this. CW, FW, or whatever, sounds to be a bit of a failure. I never play it. I suspect most MWO players never play it.

I might add that they should at every decision have asked - will what we are doing make the mechs feel like giant stompy walking tanks or will it make them feel like hyperactive kids in mech suits?

[Karl Streiger]

maybe we should just give PGI some ideas how to monetize CW - maybe they find some good ideas then.
Something like give the Phoenix Hawk superb quirks while reducing scouting tonnage to 45 - later to 45ton IS vs 40t Clan

[AWOL 01]

Here's what I would've done:
__________________________________________________________________________

• Start in the Succession Wars Era. When you start the game, you pick a faction and are sent to "Basic Training," just like the Academy we have now, except individualized for each faction. When you drop into a match, all of your teammates are of the same faction, and maybe have a leaderboard for how each faction is doing. You can change your faction, but maybe lose the mechs in your bay (not the XP and upgrades they had - if you acquire another one it's the same as it was when you changed factions) and start fresh with that faction's light mech.
  
• To start, only come out with the mech in each weight class that is most used by each faction (Each faction has 1 mech of each weight class). When you start the game, you get the light mech, and have to work your way up to the assault. Founders get access to whichever they want so everyone isn't in lights when the game is released. Maybe follow TROs when releasing new mechs? You can only buy mechs that are canon to your faction, and not all mechs are available at all times (higher chance of it being available depending on its usage in your faction). If you destroy a mech you have a chance to salvage it, which is how you can acquire mechs that aren't usually available in your faction.
  
• Instead of mastering mechs, you choose a role and spend XP toward upgrading specific traits. For example, a Scout could upgrade their speed/acceleration/sensor range... while a brawler could upgrade armor effectiveness/decreased crit chance... and any mech could have any role. If you want a Scout Assault you can have one (but you'd be sacrificing arguably better upgrades for the maneuverability upgrades that Scouts get). Your XP and C-Bill rewards would depend on which role you have also.
  
• No locks until the enemy is within sensor range. Active and passive sensors. Fix weapon ranges so that autocannons do damage at realistic ranges, but the limiting factor is your ability to aim accurately. Follow GMan129's ideas on LRMs. Try to balance weapons so that there are tradeoffs. Make ammo count based on total damage.
  
• Instead of Ghost Heat, follow TT with negative effects when operating at certain heat levels.
  
• Look at previous MechWarrior games for inspiration to make game modes. Probably start with Deathmatch, Base Assault (with destructible bases and turrets like MechCommander), and an Escort mode. Further divide these into 4v4, 8v8, 12v12, maybe even 24v24.
  
• After everything is balanced, move on to 3050 Era and then the Clan Invasion. Make Clans OP, but counter this by making the matches 12v10, 8v5, etc. and by giving them a weight penalty when calculating the weight of each team (+10 tons for each Clan mech, i.e. 50 ton Clan = 60 ton IS). Also, no fixed equipment.
  
• Way more customization options. Pattern and decal unlocks depending on your faction and your achievements. RGB Camo selection, and you only pay C-Bills based on how many colors you have selected and if you're changing a pattern. MC options for some special items.
  
• Make the mechs feel more agile (but still stompy). Make them able to crouch, raise their arms to fire over obstacles, maybe even a dodge/quick strafe to attempt to evade enemy fire. Water impedes mech movement. Implement quad mechs.
  
• Have Solaris and the previously mentioned game modes to have PvP and PvE focuses respectively, with Solaris focusing on becoming the top MechWarrior and the battles focusing on simulating a battle involving vehicles, aerospace fighters, and infantry.
  
• Have the battles take place on different planets with massive battlefields, and instead of adding new maps, add new planets for the factions to fight over. Each individual battle would use a portion of the total battlefield, until the entire battlefield is conquered by the invading faction. Maybe even add a "War of Attrition" mode where players can respawn until the planet is conquered or a total number of kills is achieved/time runs out.

__________________________________________________________________________

And even though I would make all these changes, I still love playing MWO.