So I started a new Alt account just to see what the game is like back as a beginner now. I did the tutorial and started out right at the top of Tier 5. After 2 matches, I was 1/4 of the way through Tier 4. How is that possible after 2 matches?! Shouldn't I have started at the bottom of Tier 5 and then progressed slowly up?
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Tier System Makes No Sense
Started by jonfett, May 04 2016 09:43 PM
41 replies to this topic
#1
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- Bad Company
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Posted 04 May 2016 - 09:43 PM
#2
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- Ace Of Spades
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Posted 04 May 2016 - 09:56 PM
That system is specifically to catch out smurfs. The first 20 or so games have a much heavier PSR rating than subsequent ones. If you truly want to smurf, then just suicide the first 20 matchs, then you can smurf hardcore in tier 5, and maybe get deathstar or something.
IIRC, you can get up to mid-way tier 3 if you get like 5+ kills every single match.
IIRC, you can get up to mid-way tier 3 if you get like 5+ kills every single match.
#3
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- Bridesmaid
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Posted 04 May 2016 - 11:13 PM
On an alternate account of mine I ended close to tier 2 after finishing my 25 cadet matches.
But yes, like KBurn said, PSR jumps a lot more during your first few games in order to catch out smurfs.
But yes, like KBurn said, PSR jumps a lot more during your first few games in order to catch out smurfs.
#4
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- The 1 Percent
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Posted 04 May 2016 - 11:43 PM
always run the worst stock mechs when in the first 20 matches. You will see a difference in your PSR. Now never ever ever ever do this to artificially lower your psr. That is bad, and as I would never actively support or promote that sort of play.
Stay away from the King Crab, Cheetah, Timber and Stormcrow plus some other builds that have been offered in the past. After you get the cadet bonus plus some buy a $20-$40 pack that is meta friendly and go to town. On my alt account I noticed a big jump in every 800+ game until I hit tier 3.5.
Stay away from the King Crab, Cheetah, Timber and Stormcrow plus some other builds that have been offered in the past. After you get the cadet bonus plus some buy a $20-$40 pack that is meta friendly and go to town. On my alt account I noticed a big jump in every 800+ game until I hit tier 3.5.
#5
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- The Nocturnal
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 01:32 AM
Alt account from some months ago:
aaaaaaaaaaaand tier 3 at once.
That's the reaason why I repeat everytime during townhall (RIP), that:
1) tier system must be reworked
2 ) everybody can reach tier 3 in a bunch of matches
3) MM has no sense because, actuelly, everybody can meet everybody because of point 2.
We need:
1) zero based psr sum, between all 24 players, psr sum must be zero.
2 ) reset tier for everyone and start it again
aaaaaaaaaaaand tier 3 at once.
That's the reaason why I repeat everytime during townhall (RIP), that:
1) tier system must be reworked
2 ) everybody can reach tier 3 in a bunch of matches
3) MM has no sense because, actuelly, everybody can meet everybody because of point 2.
We need:
1) zero based psr sum, between all 24 players, psr sum must be zero.
2 ) reset tier for everyone and start it again
#6
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- Elite Founder
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 02:00 AM
the whole tier system should just be removed anyway.
instead they should focus on balancing tonnage for each team. thats more important.
instead they should focus on balancing tonnage for each team. thats more important.
#7
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- Elite Founder
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 03:25 AM
Point to consider... You may have started an alt account and started at the appropriate tier 5.
But you're no newbie player.
Familiarity, experience and a deeper understanding of the play mechanics are a huge advantage over a brand-new to the game player.
Most folks who do what you did have very similar experiences akin to clubbing seals.
But you're no newbie player.
Familiarity, experience and a deeper understanding of the play mechanics are a huge advantage over a brand-new to the game player.
Most folks who do what you did have very similar experiences akin to clubbing seals.
#8
Posted 05 May 2016 - 05:51 AM
Stefka Kerensky, on 05 May 2016 - 01:32 AM, said:
Alt account from some months ago:
aaaaaaaaaaaand tier 3 at once.
That's the reaason why I repeat everytime during townhall (RIP), that:
1) tier system must be reworked
2 ) everybody can reach tier 3 in a bunch of matches
3) MM has no sense because, actuelly, everybody can meet everybody because of point 2.
We need:
1) zero based psr sum, between all 24 players, psr sum must be zero.
2 ) reset tier for everyone and start it again
aaaaaaaaaaaand tier 3 at once.
That's the reaason why I repeat everytime during townhall (RIP), that:
1) tier system must be reworked
2 ) everybody can reach tier 3 in a bunch of matches
3) MM has no sense because, actuelly, everybody can meet everybody because of point 2.
We need:
1) zero based psr sum, between all 24 players, psr sum must be zero.
2 ) reset tier for everyone and start it again
Not ANYONE can make it to t3 in a few games, thats quite an over exaggeration.
Your asre basing that idea off t1's making alt accounts and then being placed high in the tiers due to their first 20 games...that sounds like a working system if you ask me. At least in the cadet portions to weed out seal clubbers.
So you want it fixed so you can derp around and kill t5's without ever going up? Is that the change you are looking for?
I agree it needs a reworks but to say its isnt letting you derp therefore it must be broken is pretty stupid at best.
#9
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- The Nocturnal
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 06:25 AM
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 05:51 AM, said:
Not ANYONE can make it to t3 in a few games, thats quite an over exaggeration.
Your asre basing that idea off t1's making alt accounts and then being placed high in the tiers due to their first 20 games...that sounds like a working system if you ask me. At least in the cadet portions to weed out seal clubbers.
So you want it fixed so you can derp around and kill t5's without ever going up? Is that the change you are looking for?
I agree it needs a reworks but to say its isnt letting you derp therefore it must be broken is pretty stupid at best.
You really miss the point. My point is about MM in solo que.
I don't care at all about alt.account.... I cannot even remember the pasword of "tzetzefly"
I did that experiment to see how psr and tier were working.
I think that everybody here, and u too, know very well that tier goes up only, no matter how you play, and even easily when the tier is 5 to 3.
This is what it is not working corectly:
"everybody" (except yoloing guys, or derp) can reach tier 3--------> everybody can be match up versus everybody.
And that's why solo que sucks hard.
I hate to find "extremely green pilots" in my team....and also I hate to "shoot fishes in the barrel" vs enemy team.
But, according tier system...they are tier 3!!! Which is a bull$h1t.
There is no MM, actually, for those reasons written above.
We need zero sum psr in a match: so the ones doing good have thier tiers going up, and those ones doing bad have thier tier going DOWN (which is not happening with the actual system: the more you play the more your tier goes up, now).
I don't know how to explain this in simplier words
#10
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- The Nocturnal
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 06:35 AM
DaZur, on 05 May 2016 - 03:25 AM, said:
Point to consider... You may have started an alt account and started at the appropriate tier 5.
But you're no newbie player.
Familiarity, experience and a deeper understanding of the play mechanics are a huge advantage over a brand-new to the game player.
Most folks who do what you did have very similar experiences akin to clubbing seals.
But you're no newbie player.
Familiarity, experience and a deeper understanding of the play mechanics are a huge advantage over a brand-new to the game player.
Most folks who do what you did have very similar experiences akin to clubbing seals.
the only reason you are tier 3 is because you don't play enough.
Tiers have nothing to do with "skillz" and that bar is a grind bar.
Sadly this hurts very much MM.
#11
Posted 05 May 2016 - 06:37 AM
Stefka Kerensky, on 05 May 2016 - 06:25 AM, said:
You really miss the point. My point is about MM in solo que.
I don't care at all about alt.account.... I cannot even remember the pasword of "tzetzefly"
I did that experiment to see how psr and tier were working.
I think that everybody here, and u too, know very well that tier goes up only, no matter how you play, and even easily when the tier is 5 to 3.
This is what it is not working corectly:
"everybody" (except yoloing guys, or derp) can reach tier 3--------> everybody can be match up versus everybody.
And that's why solo que sucks hard.
I hate to find "extremely green pilots" in my team....and also I hate to "shoot fishes in the barrel" vs enemy team.
But, according tier system...they are tier 3!!! Which is a bull$h1t.
There is no MM, actually, for those reasons written above.
We need zero sum psr in a match: so the ones doing good have thier tiers going up, and those ones doing bad have thier tier going DOWN (which is not happening with the actual system: the more you play the more your tier goes up, now).
I don't know how to explain this in simplier words
I don't care at all about alt.account.... I cannot even remember the pasword of "tzetzefly"
I did that experiment to see how psr and tier were working.
I think that everybody here, and u too, know very well that tier goes up only, no matter how you play, and even easily when the tier is 5 to 3.
This is what it is not working corectly:
"everybody" (except yoloing guys, or derp) can reach tier 3--------> everybody can be match up versus everybody.
And that's why solo que sucks hard.
I hate to find "extremely green pilots" in my team....and also I hate to "shoot fishes in the barrel" vs enemy team.
But, according tier system...they are tier 3!!! Which is a bull$h1t.
There is no MM, actually, for those reasons written above.
We need zero sum psr in a match: so the ones doing good have thier tiers going up, and those ones doing bad have thier tier going DOWN (which is not happening with the actual system: the more you play the more your tier goes up, now).
I don't know how to explain this in simplier words
Again, MM and PSR are working EXACTLY as PGI intended them to.... There is NO ZERO SUM and its IMPOSSIBLE TO GO DOWN.
How do you have any idea weather PGI intended it to be that way or not? You dont, you are just speaking out of your ***.
Now PGI's intentions, well thats a discussion for another thread, maybe on Reddit.
#12
Posted 05 May 2016 - 06:43 AM
I agree, the PSR system needs to be tweaked some.
Tier 1 should be exclusive to those that play consistently beyond 'above average'.
And by 'average', and I'm being EXTREMELY generous here, having the ability to score AT LEAST 200 damage each match, where in my experience, if EVERYONE on your team is AT LEAST CLOSE to 200 points damage, you've got a better than 90% chance of a win at the end (watch the EOM scores, wins vs. losses, what you'll find is when you lose you had a significant number of people who did significantly less than 200 points of damage).
In the current system, being on the losing side is more punishing than being on the winning side, as it's not possible to do bad enough and go down in PSR if your side wins, you will at most come out "=". While on the losing side it's possible to get an above average score (again, read at least above 200 damage) and STILL be hit with a negative PSR rating.
Winning and losing is still too much of a factor of PSR, and not actual individual performance.
If the PSR system was reworked so that individual performance, damage done, UAV kills, target locking, KMDD's, were scored more heavily than "win/loss" or 'survival' and then our scores were reworked based on the new formula, I think we'd get a better, more accurate ranking structure.
Incorrect, it's not "impossible" to go down, it's just extremely unlikely that ANYONE is TRULY that bad at this game.
It's possible to go down in the following way:
When your team wins, you've done poorly enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
When you lose, you NEVER do well enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
Again, it's highly unlikely that anyone BAD ENOUGH to do the above will play this game for very long, people THAT bad will move on to CoD and the like...
Tier 1 should be exclusive to those that play consistently beyond 'above average'.
And by 'average', and I'm being EXTREMELY generous here, having the ability to score AT LEAST 200 damage each match, where in my experience, if EVERYONE on your team is AT LEAST CLOSE to 200 points damage, you've got a better than 90% chance of a win at the end (watch the EOM scores, wins vs. losses, what you'll find is when you lose you had a significant number of people who did significantly less than 200 points of damage).
In the current system, being on the losing side is more punishing than being on the winning side, as it's not possible to do bad enough and go down in PSR if your side wins, you will at most come out "=". While on the losing side it's possible to get an above average score (again, read at least above 200 damage) and STILL be hit with a negative PSR rating.
Winning and losing is still too much of a factor of PSR, and not actual individual performance.
If the PSR system was reworked so that individual performance, damage done, UAV kills, target locking, KMDD's, were scored more heavily than "win/loss" or 'survival' and then our scores were reworked based on the new formula, I think we'd get a better, more accurate ranking structure.
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 06:37 AM, said:
...
There is NO ZERO SUM and its IMPOSSIBLE TO GO DOWN.
...
There is NO ZERO SUM and its IMPOSSIBLE TO GO DOWN.
...
It's possible to go down in the following way:
When your team wins, you've done poorly enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
When you lose, you NEVER do well enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
Again, it's highly unlikely that anyone BAD ENOUGH to do the above will play this game for very long, people THAT bad will move on to CoD and the like...
#13
Posted 05 May 2016 - 07:13 AM
Dimento Graven, on 05 May 2016 - 06:43 AM, said:
I agree, the PSR system needs to be tweaked some.
Tier 1 should be exclusive to those that play consistently beyond 'above average'.
And by 'average', and I'm being EXTREMELY generous here, having the ability to score AT LEAST 200 damage each match, where in my experience, if EVERYONE on your team is AT LEAST CLOSE to 200 points damage, you've got a better than 90% chance of a win at the end (watch the EOM scores, wins vs. losses, what you'll find is when you lose you had a significant number of people who did significantly less than 200 points of damage).
In the current system, being on the losing side is more punishing than being on the winning side, as it's not possible to do bad enough and go down in PSR if your side wins, you will at most come out "=". While on the losing side it's possible to get an above average score (again, read at least above 200 damage) and STILL be hit with a negative PSR rating.
Winning and losing is still too much of a factor of PSR, and not actual individual performance.
If the PSR system was reworked so that individual performance, damage done, UAV kills, target locking, KMDD's, were scored more heavily than "win/loss" or 'survival' and then our scores were reworked based on the new formula, I think we'd get a better, more accurate ranking structure.
Incorrect, it's not "impossible" to go down, it's just extremely unlikely that ANYONE is TRULY that bad at this game.
It's possible to go down in the following way:
When your team wins, you've done poorly enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
When you lose, you NEVER do well enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
Again, it's highly unlikely that anyone BAD ENOUGH to do the above will play this game for very long, people THAT bad will move on to CoD and the like...
Tier 1 should be exclusive to those that play consistently beyond 'above average'.
And by 'average', and I'm being EXTREMELY generous here, having the ability to score AT LEAST 200 damage each match, where in my experience, if EVERYONE on your team is AT LEAST CLOSE to 200 points damage, you've got a better than 90% chance of a win at the end (watch the EOM scores, wins vs. losses, what you'll find is when you lose you had a significant number of people who did significantly less than 200 points of damage).
In the current system, being on the losing side is more punishing than being on the winning side, as it's not possible to do bad enough and go down in PSR if your side wins, you will at most come out "=". While on the losing side it's possible to get an above average score (again, read at least above 200 damage) and STILL be hit with a negative PSR rating.
Winning and losing is still too much of a factor of PSR, and not actual individual performance.
If the PSR system was reworked so that individual performance, damage done, UAV kills, target locking, KMDD's, were scored more heavily than "win/loss" or 'survival' and then our scores were reworked based on the new formula, I think we'd get a better, more accurate ranking structure.
Incorrect, it's not "impossible" to go down, it's just extremely unlikely that ANYONE is TRULY that bad at this game.
It's possible to go down in the following way:
When your team wins, you've done poorly enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
When you lose, you NEVER do well enough to get '=' in your PSR score.
Again, it's highly unlikely that anyone BAD ENOUGH to do the above will play this game for very long, people THAT bad will move on to CoD and the like...
You are right, i exaggerated it a bit.
It is possible to go down, but even when you go down a mediocre game that you went up on removes that.
Its just about impossible to go down i should say. I did a small poll just among the peeps i play with and 0-200 have gone done since PSR was implemented. Granted thats a tiny, minuscule sample but its still a sample.
So on the books yea you can go down, but its doesn't seem like anyone is actually THAT BAD according to PGI's system. Im sure there are some out there that sank like rocks due to being carried but i have yet to find them.
#14
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- The Determined
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 07:14 AM
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 06:37 AM, said:
Again, MM and PSR are working EXACTLY as PGI intended them to.... There is NO ZERO SUM and its IMPOSSIBLE TO GO DOWN.
How do you have any idea weather PGI intended it to be that way or not? You dont, you are just speaking out of your ***.
Now PGI's intentions, well thats a discussion for another thread, maybe on Reddit.
My Tier 5 PSR bar would like a word with you.
#15
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- Bad Company
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 07:17 AM
Khobai, on 05 May 2016 - 02:00 AM, said:
the whole tier system should just be removed anyway.
instead they should focus on balancing tonnage for each team. thats more important.
instead they should focus on balancing tonnage for each team. thats more important.
Didn't we have tonnage matching long ago and people whined and cried about it, which is why we ended up with Elo, then 3/3/3/3, then PSR?
I say **** it! Let's just have random matchmaking. It'll probably be no worse than everything tried so far and it's much much simpler to implement.
Edited by Mystere, 05 May 2016 - 07:20 AM.
#16
Posted 05 May 2016 - 07:26 AM
Alan Davion, on 05 May 2016 - 07:14 AM, said:
My Tier 5 PSR bar would like a word with you.
Not to be a jerk but do you have any disabilities? How old are you? Arthritis? Play on a potato?Bad internet connection?
#17
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- The Nocturnal
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- Locationmy cockpit
Posted 05 May 2016 - 07:44 AM
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 06:37 AM, said:
Again, MM and PSR are working EXACTLY as PGI intended them to.... There is NO ZERO SUM and its IMPOSSIBLE TO GO DOWN.
How do you have any idea weather PGI intended it to be that way or not? You dont, you are just speaking out of your ***.
How's that?
you are saying esactly what I'm saying.... but I'm speaking out of your *** because imo pgi did it in the wrong way?
Because, you know... they just did it bad and wrong. Period.
Take a camomile , dude.
Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 05 May 2016 - 07:45 AM.
#18
Posted 05 May 2016 - 08:02 AM
Stefka Kerensky, on 05 May 2016 - 07:44 AM, said:
How's that?
you are saying esactly what I'm saying.... but I'm speaking out of your *** because imo pgi did it in the wrong way?
Because, you know... they just did it bad and wrong. Period.
Take a camomile , dude.
How do you know something is bad or wrong with application?
I know you may think im upset (camomile is gross) but the only one with his panties in a bunch seems to be you.
Get over it bud, sometimes people fail.
#19
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- The Determined
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 08:02 AM
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 07:26 AM, said:
Not to be a jerk but do you have any disabilities? How old are you? Arthritis? Play on a potato?Bad internet connection?
Yes, I in fact do. I suffer from Crohn's Disease. I'm currently 31 and I've had the condition since I was 3. Make of that what you will.
I wouldn't call my system a potato, though it is probably just a few steps above that. My current rig is the one my brother built about 6 years ago, I got it about 2 years ago when he built himself a better rig. I'm currently waiting on my tax return to build an even better system than my brother has.
#20
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- The Nocturnal
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Posted 05 May 2016 - 08:39 AM
Revis Volek, on 05 May 2016 - 08:02 AM, said:
How do you know something is bad or wrong with application?
Because I can see ppl I meet when solo dropping that they are absolute beginners.
And I should not meet them, if tier system MM would make sense and work.
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