25 replies to this topic

[102_devill]

Hi,

here is some of my stats from this event in FP:

30+ games played
5 wins
25+ losses
average damage per game ~1500


All games dropped as solo, with no more than 4-man groups in the team.
5 wins were against comparable pug drops.
Another 5-6 very close games again against comparable pug drops.
All other games were against groups of 8-12, and resulted in a loss by a large margin (at least 2:1).
Only about 5-6 games (losses) were with Long Tom available to the enemy.
No winning games had LT available to my side.
Therefore I do not count LT as a decisive factor in this poor win/loss rate.

I do not believe that these stats reflect only my lack of skill since I have been in the top 30% of my team by damage done, in each match, regardless of whether it is a victory or a loss.

Does this tell us something about the balance of FP and merged queues?

To me it says that I shouldn't play FP unless I join a unit capable of fielding a large group for each drop.

I think that there are too few players active in FP to support this model and that we are progressively loosing the FP population.

I hope something changes.

[Triordinant]

RokerSaMoravu, on 10 May 2016 - 08:56 AM, said:

To me it says that I shouldn't play FP unless I join a unit capable of fielding a large group for each drop.

I think that there are too few players active in FP to support this model and that we are progressively losing the FP population.

You're not wrong.

[SteelMantis]

I would love to have pug vs. pug and group vs. group queues. I hate being on either side of pug vs. group games and feel it's a pretty poor system to have. But we don't have enough players for separate queues and are in a vicious circle of not having enough players so we lose players so we don't have enough players.

That said pugging it has been treating me a lot better than I expected and I am doing around the same damage per match as you are. Do you have a mic? Sometimes a noob leader is better than no leader if no one else is rounding up the herd.

[Felio]

Just quit FP until and unless something changes. Refuse to be content for other players to consume. That's what I did and I'm much happier.

[Fle]

Felio, on 10 May 2016 - 09:44 AM, said:

Refuse to be content for other players to consume.

This!

[xe N on]

I really dont understand solo or small groups playing FW at all. I stopped playing CW/FW a month after release. Because I was instantly aware of that as a solo player you just being used to feed large premade unit players.

Edited by xe N on, 10 May 2016 - 10:14 AM.

[Murphy7]

Considering the role of solo players and small groups in FP, there are significant differences between this event and FP as a whole.

For FP in general, being solo or part of a small group, you are less at the mercy of pugs and have proportionately more impact on your relative success or failure in the Scouting mode than in Invasion mode. I think this is a good thing, and offers a useful and fun niche of players & low population units that cannot reliably field 10-12 group for Invasion drops.

In the context of this event, this doesn't help you meet the Invasion mode requirements if that is a goal for you.

Something you might try, if Marik alone is not helping you out, is selecting defensive drops against clan attacks, and see if you cannot coordinate with members and small groups from other IS houses to do defensive drops against the same planet?

[TWIAFU]

xe N on, on 10 May 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

I really dont understand solo or small groups playing FW at all. I stopped playing CW/FW a month after release. Because I was instantly aware of that as a solo player you just being used to feed large premade unit players.

Yea, it is not like they actually told everyone that CW/FP is made PRIMARILY for Groups/Units and not for Solo play without difficulty.

Not rocket science here, hell, not even science to figure out that a solo player in the part of the game, any game, where it is focused on the Group/Unit is going to get clubbed.

Solo players can go get clubbed in QP.

[Starbomber109]

I think this is why I joined FRR, their Teamspeak is the most active it seems, makes it quite easy to form groups

[102_devill]

TWIAFU, on 10 May 2016 - 10:41 AM, said:

Yea, it is not like they actually told everyone that CW/FP is made PRIMARILY for Groups/Units and not for Solo play without difficulty.

Not rocket science here, hell, not even science to figure out that a solo player in the part of the game, any game, where it is focused on the Group/Unit is going to get clubbed.

Solo players can go get clubbed in QP.

I agree completely, solo players should not participate in the FP.

Although, I do not know where did you hear this that the FP is in any way primarily for groups/units. In the current patch, only 1 out of 3 career choices requires you to have a unit. None of them require you to drop in a group.

I think skilled group players will be much happier anyway if all the solos would just stick to QP.

[MadcatX]

RokerSaMoravu, on 10 May 2016 - 01:21 PM, said:

I think skilled group players will be much happier anyway if all the solos would just stick to QP.

It's a misconception that everyone in a group, even if in the same unit, is skilled. Also I think it would kind of suck to lose those solo players that usually fill the gaps for medium and small units that don't have enough active members on at the same time willing to do FW. And even when you're running two groups, it happens often enough that they don't coordinate between each other, preferring to just stick to their own TS's than have one member of the two group call out targets and tactics.

[xX PUG Xx]

I'm currently playing as solo and doing no differently than usual, win or lose.

I think it really depends on WHO the solo player is, if they have a reasonable idea of what is required to provide a decent performance. Then they can be a bonus to the premade that they fill a spot for, while being able to provide solid competition for any enemy they face.

True there are times when your best will not be enough but such is the nature of any PVP environment, the key is to actually do your best as often as is possible.

*no idea how it managed to double up that post in one go*

Edited by xX PUG Xx, 10 May 2016 - 08:34 PM.

[Hang Jebat]

There's nothing wrong with small groups or solo players doing FW. I have dropped plenty of times with only 1-3 other members of my unit. Be it against another pug groups or a full 12-man, we have won our fair share of matches.
The biggest difference on whether we win or lose, i found, comes down to one major thing. Listening to instructions.
When someone in the group takes initiative to call, when everyone follows, we win maybe 80% of the games. When the majority don't follow, going off and doing their own thing, we lose almost all of the games.

Throw out your "i'm solo, i dont take orders" mentality and work as a group. Move as a group, push as a group, pick off targets as a group, etc. That's all it really takes.

[p4r4g0n]

Teamwork, coordination and communication are not things only units can use, there is nothing to prevent an adhoc group of individuals from using the in-game VOIP to move together and shoot at the same targets.

Granted an experienced group that plays together often will do it better but there is nothing to stop any solo player from using whatever tools are available to find and play more often with the same people.

Being in a unit makes this easier but in some ways it can be restrictive as well as people in units tend to play with people in said unit.

In the final analysis, what you get from FP is directly correlated to the effort you put into doing what is required to win in FP.

[iLLcapitan]

PGI should pool the factions in 2 (IS/clan) with subfactions for the rewards.
If there's a time, where there are unproportionally more members of one side online, they should be able to fight themselves.
Then split between group and non-group queue (unlike the unit / non_unit split we had) and be done with it.

Some people like the challenge to drop alone in CW and improve, most can't take a beating.

[102_devill]

xX PUG Xx, on 10 May 2016 - 03:58 PM, said:

I'm currently playing as solo and doing no differently than usual, win or lose.

I think it really depends on WHO the solo player is, if they have a reasonable idea of what is required to provide a decent performance. Then they can be a bonus to the premade that they fill a spot for, while being able to provide solid competition for any enemy they face.

True there are times when your best will not be enough but such is the nature of any PVP environment, the key is to actually do your best as often as is possible.

*no idea how it managed to double up that post in one go*

I am happy for you although I don't have the same experience. But, as you say it is probably just me and my lack of skill.
Would you like to drop a few drops with me in a group of 2 and show me how its done?

Hang Jebat, on 10 May 2016 - 06:50 PM, said:

Throw out your "i'm solo, i dont take orders" mentality and work as a group. Move as a group, push as a group, pick off targets as a group, etc. That's all it really takes.

I am trying to do that. But its hard. There is this silence over comms and when I try to break it, nothing happens.
Maybe my VOIP is off?

[TWIAFU]

RokerSaMoravu, on 10 May 2016 - 01:21 PM, said:

I agree completely, solo players should not participate in the FP.

Although, I do not know where did you hear this that the FP is in any way primarily for groups/units. In the current patch, only 1 out of 3 career choices requires you to have a unit. None of them require you to drop in a group.

I think skilled group players will be much happier anyway if all the solos would just stick to QP.

From Russ himself.

[102_devill]

It was more of a rhetorical question; I know Mr. Bollocks is saying this.
Yet, as I described, the game design gives a different message.
It is just a testament to the fact that this game suffers from an identity crisis.
But, we are all looking forward to going into E-sports!

Edited by RokerSaMoravu, 11 May 2016 - 05:59 AM.

[Randy Poffo]

p4r4g0n, on 10 May 2016 - 07:16 PM, said:

In the final analysis, what you get from FP is directly correlated to the effort you put into doing what is required to win in FP.

Of course it is correlated, but then again there are degrees of correlation and this doesn't mean that the "direct" correlation is strong enough to reliably be worth the effort.

There are also some forms of "effort" that are more laudable than others. You can be a sh*tter and invest your effort into joining a unit, remain a sh*tter, but still club seals all day. The correlation between effort and reward is there, depending on what you find rewarding. You could also practice night and day, become the godlike Achilles of MWO, join a unit, and club seals with an occasional good match against another team. Again, correlation between effort and reward is there, depending on what you find to be rewarding, though it will be up to you to decide if it's worth the effort. Or you could become the godlike Achilles of MWO, drop solo, and achieve modest success not losing 100% of the time, and that again is rewarding in a way so you have your "correlation".

The only difficult part is figuring out ahead of time whether it's going to be worth it. And for those who look at the current system and find that to be unlikely, telling them that there is a correlation between effort and reward is an obvious but completely useless observation.

[Randy Poffo]

RokerSaMoravu, on 10 May 2016 - 01:21 PM, said:

I think skilled group players will be much happier anyway if all the solos would just stick to QP.

The funny thing about that is that most of them wouldn't actually be happier. Instead you would hear the howls of pain as q times rise, and PGI would try to incentivize solo players to go back to FW (by, say, having a big FW event with shiny rewards).