101 replies to this topic

[AssaultPig]

the only thing they'd need to change about the KDK-3 would be to give clan UAC10s a bit more ghost heat, like they did with AC20s back in the day. The chassis itself does not need nerfed.

The spirit bear is fine as is

[Mystere]

kapusta11, on 18 May 2016 - 10:08 AM, said:

Just what can PGI possibly do about it, Bishop? Take away its quirks? Trust me it will remain to be a great mech. If anything, because of its quirks it would be easier for PGI to ignore reasonable complaints about how big its cockpit and CT hitboxes are. If everyone's complaining about how OP it is it probably doesn't have any disadvantages, right?

Hmm, let me see. Assuming a loud and concerted effort at whining ensues, PGI can get weak-kneed -- again -- and decide to give it:

• crippling speed quirks
  
• crippling heat quirks
  
• crippling mobility quirks
  
• crippling armor quirks
  
• crippling structure quirks
  
• crippling range quirks
  
• crippling ghost heat quirks

Did I miss anything?





The Clans are most certainly not allowed to have any nice things.

I'm not buying until the dust settles ... and then wait some more.

Edited by Mystere, 18 May 2016 - 02:21 PM.

[Corrado]

it's funny how we saw so many OP mech statements within 24 hours. Maybe i'm getting too old but seeing how fast everyone draws conclusions just upset me. What if a small part of the playerbase, that usually does good in any mech and often run competitive builds is actually the reason why the KDK3 does looks like OP?

i mean... what if the wubshee came out with his actual quirks, and day one good players would still pull off 1000-1200 damage 4-6 kills with a 5LPL build? the badders would still cry and call the nerfbat just after the first matches...

Edited by Corrado, 18 May 2016 - 02:32 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Wintersdark, on 18 May 2016 - 10:52 AM, said:

I'm highly dubious if any are op at all. Maybe, MAYBE the 3, but even then if it is, it is the because of the quirks.

And really, if the KDK3 is op with 4 uac10's, why isn't a quad10 dwf used at all? I get that the KDK3 is running typically a 350, but even before the pilot skill nerfs (when the dwf would have comparable agility to a 350 kdk3 today) nobody really ran 4xUAC10 on it.

~375 is the typical Quad UAC10 engine

That gives it the agility of an unquirked Med/fast Heavy with that nice quirk (far better than the old Whale twist speed, on par with the XL400 WubShee twist speed, 105 VS 120, while the Whale was below 90)

Quad UAC10s is HOT, but it only has 4 hardpoints (and plenty of tonnage). Pumps damage out, and a more recent change is the AC10 ammo change (thus more damage per ton using UAC10s)

[AssaultPig]

I run it with a 400 and haven't had too much trouble. It's hot, but not un-manageable and you can fire them in pairs when you get near the heat cap. I don't even have elite talents yet.

[Bishop Steiner]

AssaultPig, on 18 May 2016 - 02:57 PM, said:

I run it with a 400 and haven't had too much trouble. It's hot, but not un-manageable and you can fire them in pairs when you get near the heat cap. I don't even have elite talents yet.

6 tons of ammo seems a little light for my tastes.

[chucklesMuch]

AssaultPig, on 18 May 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

the only thing they'd need to change about the KDK-3 would be to give clan UAC10s a bit more ghost heat, like they did with AC20s back in the day. The chassis itself does not need nerfed.

Cos... Clan UAC's need to actually be worse than they are already?

Edited by chucklesMuch, 18 May 2016 - 03:02 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

chucklesMuch, on 18 May 2016 - 03:01 PM, said:

Cos... Clan UAC's need to actually be worse than they are already?

Or, if it does prove a valid concern have it related to the Chassis, like they did wit the DWF. Didn't it have heat gen nerfs for that at one point?

[Dee Eight]

I'm running the -3 with a 350XL and quad-10s with 4 mediums and max armor. I've seen others basically run no arm armor to have the 375 engine. Given the size of the torso hit boxes, I want to keep the shields, even if they're only holding a pair of lasers each. I also went to FF armor. Its still faster than your typical atlas, kingcrab or direwolf.

[chucklesMuch]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 May 2016 - 03:03 PM, said:

Or, if it does prove a valid concern have it related to the Chassis, like they did wit the DWF. Didn't it have heat gen nerfs for that at one point?

I'm not sure as I have only been playing for the last couple of months. (created the account before it launched but only started playing recently)

The KDK seems more like a school bully IMHO

In the games I have had with KDK-3 its been great when part of a co-originated push or when the opposition runs scared; either ducking for cover (to hide) or tries running away... but when the opposition have looked to stand/twist fight back... the KDK-3 CT/ST seems to melt in no time.

(And the number of times that I have lost UAC/10 with minimal damage done to the ST is a bit silly too).

[Pjwned]

Obviously the mech would be trash without quirks to make it as agile as mechs half its weight and extra structure on a (presumably fully armored) 100 ton mech.

There's LITERALLY nothing wrong with my mech having no drawbacks whatsoever through magic space jesus quirks because I paid real money for it!

[AssaultPig]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 May 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

6 tons of ammo seems a little light for my tastes.

I'll have to get home and see what my build actually is; I have enough ammo to get through games with ~1000 damage, though

faux ed: pretty sure KDK-3 is how I have it set up

chucklesMuch, on 18 May 2016 - 03:01 PM, said:

Cos... Clan UAC's need to actually be worse than they are already?

adding most ghost heat on the fourth UAC10 wouldn't hurt anything but the quad UAC10 KDK-3s and DWFs

it's the kind of edge case that ghost heat is meant for, really; balance a specific configuration without creating consequences for other builds (and you could still run 2xUAC10 1xUAC20 if you wanted.)

[Sader325]

What'd you think was going to happen?

[chucklesMuch]

In answer to what is my fall back if they stop being fun... I will go back to using the low burn time or high velocity quirked IS mechs; BNC 3M, BK6, MAL MX90, BJ1... etc...

[Mister Blastman]

This all makes me chuckle. I have no idea whether the KDK is OP or not--not a clue. But the amount of controversy surrounding it is hilarious. Threats from folks who bought it if it is nerfed, cries from people who didn't that think it should be... truth be told there are two sides with two agendas and of course the side holding the bags of money are going to shout the loudest and feel they should be heard...

But you want to know the truth?

The truth is, despite the money spent or veiled jealousy, one thing must be done with the KDK--the right thing, whatever it may be.

This means if nerfs are in order, they must be done. This means if nothing at all is wrong, then it must be left alone. There is one thing for sure, though, and that is the KDK is not underpowered.

Make it so, PGI, do what needs to be done. And make it sooner than later as the forums I don't think can... bear it... much longer.

[Corrado]

i was pushing in forest, in a KDK3 quad uac10s along with a MX90 quad uac5s. while i did strip armor off the targets, this good mauler was finishing em off with superior accuracy. i still like the mauler because can reliabily shoot anything moving or not. the kdk3 is just superior at slow targets.

[Green Mamba]

Sader325, on 18 May 2016 - 03:19 PM, said:

What'd you think was going to happen?

Trump/ Sader 2016 ..... slogan ..."We were right., deal with it"

Edited by Green Mamba, 18 May 2016 - 04:04 PM.

[Zibmo]

Gigashot, on 18 May 2016 - 10:25 AM, said:

I'm kind of at a loss for words. This is the first time I've seen anyone argue that IS are at a disadvantage in FW. Ever. I'm not even sure what to say. Clans get run over almost every match, all the Clans have 0 territory. IS are cheaper, better, tankier, produce less heat, quirkier. IS has actual Assault mechs we can't begin to compete with, until maybe, hopefully now. Our claim to fame Assault mech explodes at 95% from two side torso hits and can't twist, move, or be used on attack.

I'm not...like I don't even...what. What am I missing here. The extra few meters on ER-ML is that doing it for us? What are you talking about.

"first wave kodiaks are hard" what. like every single FW match where first wave IS Atlas's punch through everything and have no equal? what are we even talking about.

You haven't been around here long, have you?

Myj, on 18 May 2016 - 11:30 AM, said:

I piloted my KDK-3 all night last night, and I can tell you that he definitely is strong (I had one game with 6 kills and 1600 damage, most damage I've ever done), but is he OP? Not even close. My Black Widow (who has very comparable hard points to the KDK-3) is WAY stronger in almost every way than the KDK-3. He's much harder to bring down (the KDK-3 felt like paper in a few matches, literally never died so fast in an assault mech, that CT hit box must be gigantic...) and can crank out the DPS much more consistently with virtually no heat management whatsoever. The fact people complain about the KDK-3 and not the Black Widow is beyond me. And the Spirit Bear? He's built to run like an Atlus, but his speed absolutely does not make up for how fast he can be brought down. Feels 3 times squishier than an Atlus, and wants to be right in people's faces. It can work since he's much faster, but you REALLY have to work at it in this thing. Or you could just grab an Atlus and do it with barely any effort at all.

KDK a good mech? Yes, thank goodness. OP? Not even close.

How many 6 kill 1600 damage games have you had in your 'hammer?

[Silas7]

Zibmo, on 18 May 2016 - 04:07 PM, said:

You haven't been around here long, have you?



How many 6 kill 1600 damage games have you had in your 'hammer?

With so many assaults running right now damage counts are inflated. I think we all need to just settle down and give the player base some time to readjust and playtest, before something is decided. Otherwise over-correction is bound to happen.

[Mystere]

Mister Blastman, on 18 May 2016 - 03:45 PM, said:

This all makes me chuckle. I have no idea whether the KDK is OP or not--not a clue. But the amount of controversy surrounding it is hilarious. Threats from folks who bought it if it is nerfed, cries from people who didn't that think it should be... truth be told there are two sides with two agendas and of course the side holding the bags of money are going to shout the loudest and feel they should be heard...

But you want to know the truth?

The truth is, despite the money spent or veiled jealousy, one thing must be done with the KDK--the right thing, whatever it may be.

This means if nerfs are in order, they must be done. This means if nothing at all is wrong, then it must be left alone. There is one thing for sure, though, and that is the KDK is not underpowered.

Make it so, PGI, do what needs to be done. And make it sooner than later as the forums I don't think can... bear it... much longer.

Unfortunately, that's nowhere close to how the player base, and by extension PGI, operates. Those who cry loudest and the most often win -- and PGI eventually gets weak-kneed and acquiesces.

Edited by Mystere, 18 May 2016 - 04:43 PM.