60 replies to this topic

[ScarecrowES]

So the pauldrons ARE ST and not arm... and here I remember saying this prior to release and being told that it wouldn't be so. Hmmmph.

[El Bandito]

Banshee hitboxes to compare with. Cause it also has big and asymmetrical CT.

ScarecrowES, on 22 May 2016 - 04:45 PM, said:

So the pauldrons ARE ST and not arm... and here I remember saying this prior to release and being told that it wouldn't be so. Hmmmph.

Seems like it. Doesn't really matter though; with the way people shoot at the mech (at chest level, where ST hitboxes are narrower, rather than head level where the ST hitboxes are the widest), Kodiaks generally do not lose ST easily. Especially the right one, as seen from Mcgral's pic.

Edited by El Bandito, 22 May 2016 - 05:09 PM.

[Mcgral18]

unFearing, on 22 May 2016 - 04:25 PM, said:

mcgral, do you have the hitboxes for the rear of the KDK?

Have the video, but not too conclusive.

rCT is pretty massive, and the ST leg plates hold true as well

It's kinda hard to differentiate the rST from the rCT, because it doesn't always follow the plates/lines (but some do) when you reach mid back.


I'd need to do more testing (with more than 5 rear armour)

[Xetelian]

When I lead a push into the enemy and get hit with LRMs, they all find my CT, I need to twist the other direction or they need to address the hitboxes.

[cazidin]

So, what I gather from this is I should shield with my left side and tweet Russ about this?

[kapusta11]

El Bandito, on 22 May 2016 - 04:58 PM, said:

Banshee hitboxes to compare with. Cause it also has big and asymmetrical CT.

Here, made a better pic for comparison. IMO Banshee has it worse because of protruding head and would die just as fast giving how many mechs double tap for 80 damage right now.

Still would change it to something like this:



And then remove quirks.

Edited by kapusta11, 23 May 2016 - 12:55 AM.

[Corrado]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

Lol....

I twist both ways, and while I eventually die to CT, really my only complaint is I can't seem to lose my arms if I try! At least not without my ST attached to it....

dunno.. i do lose arms frequently and rarely got cored with over 50% HP left, no issues in spreading damage. Just some really good shooters are able to hit the rear or front ST CT at an extreme angle, but rarely.

[Rayden Wolf]

I lass an arm exactly two times without ST destroyed. You have to twist like crazy. A shadowcat was hitting my CT while i twistet to the end(left side).
I even got reardmg while lurms rained on my CT from the front
In no other mech i have problems to lose a ST, but in the Kodiak its really hard work to loss one of them

[Bishop Steiner]

Corrado, on 23 May 2016 - 01:25 AM, said:

dunno.. i do lose arms frequently and rarely got cored with over 50% HP left, no issues in spreading damage. Just some really good shooters are able to hit the rear or front ST CT at an extreme angle, but rarely.

wanna hit those more often, aim high. I usually aim about pauldron level on KDKs and can put 90% of fire into the torsos. Been pretty rare I seen the arms able to stop high fire.

Also while I cannot confirm or deny personally, many wonky hitbox regs reported, with arm hits in game registering torso, etc. But without extensive testing and video, dunno if actually occurring, or HSR related, etc.

Regardless, as I said, I avg just about 700 dmg before dying, and have only a couple sub 350 dmg games even in early death/stomps, so it's not like it's a huge detriment IMO, but more like a needed balance.

But I freely admit, IMO, every mech should be designed with as optimal of Hitboxes as possible, then Quirks assigned to bolster those that Geometry or Hardpoints fails, like the Archer or Scat/Summoner. (Or upcoming Cyclops), not used as some hackneyed balancing tool. Intentionally giving gimp hitboxes is the antithesis to achieving proper balance.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 23 May 2016 - 04:15 AM.

[Duke Nedo]

100% subjectively it feels like I take hits to the rear armor more easily than in other similar sized mechs, anyone else?

[Corrado]

Bishop Steiner, on 23 May 2016 - 04:11 AM, said:

wanna hit those more often, aim high. I usually aim about pauldron level on KDKs and can put 90% of fire into the torsos. Been pretty rare I seen the arms able to stop high fire.

Also while I cannot confirm or deny personally, many wonky hitbox regs reported, with arm hits in game registering torso, etc. But without extensive testing and video, dunno if actually occurring, or HSR related, etc.

Regardless, as I said, I avg just about 700 dmg before dying, and have only a couple sub 350 dmg games even in early death/stomps, so it's not like it's a huge detriment IMO, but more like a needed balance.

But I freely admit, IMO, every mech should be designed with as optimal of Hitboxes as possible, then Quirks assigned to bolster those that Geometry or Hardpoints fails, like the Archer or Scat/Summoner. (Or upcoming Cyclops), not used as some hackneyed balancing tool. Intentionally giving gimp hitboxes is the antithesis to achieving proper balance.

then could it be that:

Geometry department: "hey guys, we know the kodiak ships tomorrow, but we really need a break. geometry is so so.
Quirks department: "no prob bro, just 2 minutes we fix it."

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Ha ha! another mech falls to plan shoot it in the crotch.

[Wintersdark]

kapusta11, on 23 May 2016 - 12:46 AM, said:

Here, made a better pic for comparison. IMO Banshee has it worse because of protruding head and would die just as fast giving how many mechs double tap for 80 damage right now.

Still would change it to something like this:



And then remove quirks.

... on the 3. The 2 and 4 are not monsters.

I'd be right behind that.

[Metus regem]

Ultimax, on 22 May 2016 - 02:00 PM, said:

This seems like a goof up.

I sent a tweet to Russ: https://twitter.com/...499866244612096

Perhaps it was an oversight on PGI's part, just like with the Hellbringer hit box on release issue.

[MerryIguana]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 May 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

I twist both ways

So the rumor is true!

[Mister Blastman]

Mcgral18, on 22 May 2016 - 03:34 PM, said:

Looks intentional when I look at the exported model. RT is a solid mass, while the LT has a removable blank





The RT blank is just the empty missile/Dakka slot on the shoulder.


Not to say the hitbox couldn't be adjusted, just that this seems intentional when looking at this.

Hmmmmm removable blank? Are those treated as holes by the game?

I seem to remember seeing elsewhere on here once holes in 'mechs that translated to lasers/ppcs/etc. going through them in the game. The holes were due to either model errors or hitboxing laziness.

[Mcgral18]

Duke Nedo, on 23 May 2016 - 04:27 AM, said:

100% subjectively it feels like I take hits to the rear armor more easily than in other similar sized mechs, anyone else?

It does have a jutting back (sticks out) and is quite large in the rCT at the top

Mister Blastman, on 23 May 2016 - 07:09 AM, said:

Hmmmmm removable blank? Are those treated as holes by the game?

I seem to remember seeing elsewhere on here once holes in 'mechs that translated to lasers/ppcs/etc. going through them in the game. The holes were due to either model errors or hitboxing laziness.

Well, the missile entirely replaces that lower section (which does not include that lower panel I was curious about...)
It just swaps out the same part, but one has no weapon, the other has the Missile launched tacked on.
The LRM20 has some tubes on the ST part of it

Edited by Mcgral18, 23 May 2016 - 07:44 AM.

[cazidin]

Mcgral18, on 23 May 2016 - 07:44 AM, said:

Well, the missile entirely replaces that lower section (which does not include that lower panel I was curious about...)
It just swaps out the same part, but one has no weapon, the other has the Missile launched tacked on.
The LRM20 has some tubes on the ST part of it

The missile hard points on this mech are ugly. Has Russ tweeted a response on this yet?

[MauttyKoray]

kapusta11, on 23 May 2016 - 12:46 AM, said:

Here, made a better pic for comparison. IMO Banshee has it worse because of protruding head and would die just as fast giving how many mechs double tap for 80 damage right now.

Still would change it to something like this:



And then remove quirks.

Yeah, Banshee has a reason due to physical weapon placements, but you'd think with the weird part on the Kodiak is the ST is entirely asymmetrical based on major contour lines and don't simply follow weapon geometry as the Banshee's do.

This is more how I imagine the hitboxes should be (and other have pretty much made the same. I am confused however by the weird groin hitboxes... Plus as marked, it may just me but I think the cockpit hitbox is placed a little odd/off.

[Roadkill]

kapusta11, on 23 May 2016 - 12:46 AM, said:

Still would change it to something like this:



And then remove quirks.

Yes, this. Except I'm not sure it needs the quirks removed... the thing is a slug. Maybe reduce the turn/twist quirks and add the reduction to accel/decel instead?