23 replies to this topic

[nehebkau]

Don't get me wrong, I really enjoy scouting and like that it adds benefits to the team that actually scouts. This is not about OP mechs or imbalances either -- i can kill a streakcrow or wub-crow. What this is about is POPULATION.

I have come to the realization that scouting is just another queue-split in faction play. What have we learned from splitting up queues? It increases wait times all around. I have really, granted this is a subjective observation, noticed that wait times for matches in faction play have gone up significantly. When all else is taken away, scouting is just a 4 v 4 queue and when we asked PGI why we couldn't have 8 vs 8 quick-play queues they cited population and wait times. Well guess what affect a 4 vs 4 queue is having on 12 vs. 12 queue wait times?

It makes me a little sad to say it -- I do love the fast paced play of scouting -- but more and more I am seeing 5-10 minute waits for drops in both scouting and invasion.


Thoughts?

[nimdabew]

I would be in favor of just scrapping quick play and scouting alltogether and making the "quick play" queue be a 12v10 clan v IS quick play game. Bam. Done. Roll both game modes together. If you drop in a clan mech, you go to one side. If you drop in an IS mech, you go to the other side. This would also allow people to try and "help" one faction by going to the map, clicking on a planet, and doing a quickie instead of this scouting queue crap we have now.

One more thing to add, as a quick match, you can play either side that you want to, but no mix/matching sides together. Just you are on the clan team or the IS team. Don't use tonnage restrictions, but keep the 3/3/3/3 or 2/3/3/2 for the IS/Clans respectively.

[adamts01]

Ditching scouting makes sense. It's just another sad example of PGI putting their resources towards the wrong project.

I'd be in favor of scrapping group que, but only of they changed CW to an open map design instead of their current rush the gates linear play. There needs to be a separation of the group-minded and CoD players. But, there's no CW4, none of this will happen. I'm so disappointed in this game.

[Tangelis]

"What this is about is POPULATION" Nail meets head.

Scouting is fine IMO. FW too... sadly without an event to fuel interest it's always the second or third choice for the bulk of the player base.

I enjoy FW... but I'm guilty of not really giving a crap outside of something to play it for.

[LordNothing]

the population is there to make this a working game mode, but its too shotgunned all over the place. what the game needs is 'population concentration features'. not to burn what little that pgi has done over the past several months.

[Helene de Montfort]

The problem is that the scouting and the invasion occur at the same time. There should be phases to an invasion, first scouting, then, invasion... This way, there should be the max number of people available for both modes, otherwise, you have to chose, either you go scouting, or you go invasion, but it's harder to do both.

To be honest the whole FP doesn't really make sense to me. It doesn't feel at all like an important event, like i believe a planet invasion should be.

[Kanil]

I'd rather see Invasion removed, to free up more population for the Scouting queue.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

I'd go the opposite direction: PGI needs to add a third format - Raiding.

Invasion is for big grinding battles. Scouting is for lights and mediums to employ small-unit tactics and do a lot of objective-focused gameplay. Raiding should be for big mechs in small numbers, involving destructible environmentals (maybe even a dropship). Give us 4v4 without the weight restrictions and with pure destruction as the objective and I think the population will fill itself out. The more people play one FW mode, the more they'll play the others, by simple osmosis.

[no one]

LordNothing, on 22 May 2016 - 05:20 PM, said:

the population is there to make this a working game mode, but its too shotgunned all over the place. what the game needs is 'population concentration features'. not to burn what little that pgi has done over the past several months.

This. There's no reason I shouldn't have a little check box somewhere that says "launch me into whatever game of x, y or z type that needs a pilot" Hell, there's no real reason for Quick launch and FW to be separated beyond a possible group/quick-play queue. Make it an option and people will make the population condense sufficiently on their own.

[Khobai]

game has 10 factions when it should only have 2

playerbase is way too split up and it makes all the queues suck

[Iron Buccaneer]

There are enough people playing the game to make FP works but unfortunately it is not appealing to enough of the player base. They need to make it better without killing the lore. Without the factions this is just a stompy robot FPS.

[nehebkau]

The game doesn't have the population to adhere to LORE and scouting simply draws away people who would otherwise play the 12-man invasion queue.

[Bud Crue]

Iron Buccaneer, on 23 May 2016 - 06:41 AM, said:

There are enough people playing the game to make FP works but unfortunately it is not appealing to enough of the player base. They need to make it better without killing the lore. Without the factions this is just a stompy robot FPS.

What Lore? Seriously what actual lore is in this game? The little blubs of faction descriptions. The occasional planetary description other than "unknown". The little vignettes that PGI puts out for new heroes. I'm not aware of anything else.

But the mechs are "lore" you say? Okay, tell me where the lore of the Battlemaster mech is without leaving the mwomercs.com website. How about the origin of the Clans and their motivations for "invading" the IS? Where is that at? It isn't in this game as far as I can tell.

In the game we actually have: Clans are not OP they way they are in Lore. There is no asymmetric warfare, like in the lore. In the lore, the great houses control the inner sphere; in this game mercenary units do. In the lore mechs are rare and hard to maintain, in the game most players have several. Etc.

So again what lore are we seeking to avoid killing? There is no lore. This game is in fact just a "stompy robot FPS". Sure it is advertised as "a BattleTech game", and the theoretical underpinnings of the mechs themselves and their weapons are similar to that game, but the lore of that game? I don't see no stinking lore.

In the game we actually play here, If PGI can do something to improve game play, attract more players and/or in anyway improve wait times -and if some how such actions would harm "the lore"- I say screw the lore. Seriously, why not? It was never here in the first place. Make decent game modes and the lore will be brought in by the players...just like it is now.

Edited by Bud Crue, 24 May 2016 - 06:29 AM.

[nehebkau]

Bud Crue, on 24 May 2016 - 06:28 AM, said:

In the game we actually play here, If PGI can do something to improve game play, attract more players and/or in anyway improve wait times -and if some how such actions would harm "the lore"- I say screw the lore. Seriously, why not? It was never here in the first place. Make decent game modes and the lore will be brought in by the players...just like it is now.

QFT! +1 bud

[no one]

Bud Crue, on 24 May 2016 - 06:28 AM, said:

if some how such actions would harm "the lore"- I say screw the lore. Seriously, why not? It was never here in the first place. Make decent game modes and the lore will be brought in by the players...just like it is now.

That would be a valid sentiment if there were no ways to make things work with the lore. That isn't the case. Lore isn't getting in the way of matchmaking. Poor matchmaker design is getting in the way of matchmaking.

Lore inclusion is something to work towards, not around.

[Bud Crue]

no one, on 24 May 2016 - 11:43 AM, said:

That would be a valid sentiment if there were no ways to make things work with the lore. That isn't the case. Lore isn't getting in the way of matchmaking. Poor matchmaker design is getting in the way of matchmaking.

Lore inclusion is something to work towards, not around.

Yep. Sure. Would love it if there was more lore. My tirade (tantrum) was in response to the statement that PGI needs to make things better without killing the lore. I'm just saying I would settle for PGI trying to make things better...period. How can they make changes that would hurt the lore, when there is none to speak of? Certainly there is a passing wiff of the scent of BT and MW titles of old; but show me where all this lore that people are so concerned about losing by PGI's potential future actions.

Edited by Bud Crue, 24 May 2016 - 12:06 PM.

[Iron Buccaneer]

I would not play this game at all if it was not Battletech/Mechwarrior. It's not a good enough game to hold my attention otherwise. It could be but it would require a lot more work. People aren't playing FW because it isn't deep or interesting enough. Because there isn't enough investment and there isn't enough reward.

I'm sure a significantly large group of people either play or have played this game because it is a Battletech game and would not play it otherwise. Especially those who engage in "Faction" warfare.

[Appogee]

I think the solution is relatively simple. So simple in fact that even PGI will probably arrive at it sooner or later.

The attack/defence options need to be dynamically reduced and expanded based on the number of people playing at the time.

Start with a single attack/defence lane for all IS vs all Clans. See how many queue up.

Got more than 3 teams in the queue on each side...? Then split into two attack/defence lanes.

And so on.

In this way, Invasion and Scouting Modes can continue to be supported, players always have opponents, and wait times are as short as they can feasibly be.

[Cy Mitchell]

nehebkau, on 24 May 2016 - 05:19 AM, said:

The game doesn't have the population to adhere to LORE and scouting simply draws away people who would otherwise play the 12-man invasion queue.

Maybe a few but a lot of the players that play scouting would otherwise just play QP rather than FP. Scouting is the only innovative, interesting and fun part of FP IMO.

[Bud Crue]

Rampage, on 24 May 2016 - 12:56 PM, said:

Maybe a few but a lot of the players that play scouting would otherwise just play QP rather than FP. Scouting is the only innovative, interesting and fun part of FP IMO.

And this is the quandary. Scouting is the most novel thing, perhaps the best thing, PGI has added to the game within the last year. Nevertheless it is splitting the queue.

Certainly there are some QP players that are playing scouting mode too, but in re invasion mode: from my own experience I know Neb is right in that there are a lot of otherwise regular FP (invasion mode) players who have gone largely over to playing scouting, thus reducing the invasion mode population even further (already at less than 10% of the player base according to PGI).

I really enjoy scouting mode too, but I don't think there is much debate that it has indeed drawn players away from invasion mode; and if invasion mode is going to be viable it needs all the population it can get. No idea what the solution is (other than for PGI to stop f-ing it up that is).