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Are Through Armor Crits A Thing?


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#1 Alexandrix

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 03:05 PM

Hey all,
So i just got out of a match where I lost a UAC20 while both sides of the containing torso still had armor.

admittedly,I don't follow MWO as closely as I used to,so was there an update that added through armor crits or something?

images attached.as you can clearly see I still have armor.I took two pics to show the time difference,and prove that it wasnt just a jam.That UAC20 remained unusable the rest of the match.

Posted Image


Posted Image

Edited by Alexandrix, 28 May 2016 - 03:06 PM.


#2 Mcgral18

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 03:22 PM

Heat damage


Every type of damage (although, no longer Arty) deals Crit damage
Falling?


Crit Damage

Weapons? Of course, Crit damage

Heat damage? Take a guess


You take up to 20 RNGeesus damage applied to a random component, and that WILL destroy the 10 HP of a UAC20

#3 Jack Booted Thug

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 03:28 PM

Yes, they are a thing. I've only noticed it with ppc's though.

Even in a fresh atlas and other well armored mechs, getting hit with dual ppc to a side torso - i've lost the occasional internal while the armor is only slightly yellowed.

It's rare, but it happens. Not sure what the actual crit chance is, but it has to be very low.

#4 Mcgral18

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 03:28 PM

View PostJack Booted Thug, on 28 May 2016 - 03:28 PM, said:

Yes, they are a thing. I've only noticed it with ppc's though.

Even in a fresh atlas and other well armored mechs, getting hit with dual ppc to a side torso - i've lost the occasional internal while the armor is only slightly yellowed.

It's rare, but it happens. Not sure what the actual crit chance is, but it has to be very low.


No, there are not Through Armour Crits


If a FLD weapon hits N-1 armour, it still deals full Crit damage, but not Through Armour.

#5 El Bandito

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 03:53 PM

LBX and maybe MGs should have had through-the-armor crits. Then they woulda been actually good picks.

#6 Jack Booted Thug

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 04:08 PM

View PostMcgral18, on 28 May 2016 - 03:28 PM, said:


No, there are not Through Armour Crits


If a FLD weapon hits N-1 armour, it still deals full Crit damage, but not Through Armour.



Not sure what you mean by not through armor. Maybe the wording here is throwing me off.

If you have an internal being destoryed while still having armor, for example a fresh mech being hit with a dual ppc and losing an internal while only having yellowed armor, obviously that one hit did not strip all the armor or even most of it, yet you still took internal damage.

So, it would have essentially penetrated the armor being that there was still quite a bit of armor covering that internal component.

Can you explain that mechanic? I've never fully educated myself on the mechanics of this game.

I'm guessing there is a crit chance, even with full armor, it just happens to be really low?


Edit: What i want to know is how do I lose a heat sink or lpl on a fresh thunderbolt from one dual ppc shot. The armor hit points should have been sufficient to prevent internal damage, but did not.

Edited by Jack Booted Thug, 28 May 2016 - 04:12 PM.


#7 Mcgral18

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 04:23 PM

View PostJack Booted Thug, on 28 May 2016 - 04:08 PM, said:



Not sure what you mean by not through armor. Maybe the wording here is throwing me off.

If you have an internal being destoryed while still having armor, for example a fresh mech being hit with a dual ppc and losing an internal while only having yellowed armor, obviously that one hit did not strip all the armor or even most of it, yet you still took internal damage.

So, it would have essentially penetrated the armor being that there was still quite a bit of armor covering that internal component.

Can you explain that mechanic? I've never fully educated myself on the mechanics of this game.

I'm guessing there is a crit chance, even with full armor, it just happens to be really low?


Edit: What i want to know is how do I lose a heat sink or lpl on a fresh thunderbolt from one dual ppc shot. The armor hit points should have been sufficient to prevent internal damage, but did not.


There should be zero chance of that happening (video evidence would be perfect, as it would indicate something is wrong)


If a PPC strikes 9 armour, it still deals full Crit damage, because it deals 1 real damage, but 10 Crit damage(per Crit)


If 2 PPCs hit 20+ armour, you should not have lost an item.



Through armor means just that, critting an item while armor is still in place, should not happen.
Only once Structure is breached.

#8 -Vompo-

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 04:29 PM

I'm sure they exist or atleast they have. Not sure if they are/were a bug though.
I've killed a fully armoured timby through it's ct front with 3 shots from a dual ppc and that shouldn't happen. (It was just me cause I was the only one there)

#9 Agent 0range

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 04:37 PM

in the SS he has taken internal damage it must be from heat. lucky it wasnt ammo that critted

#10 Johnny Z

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 04:48 PM

I had 3 LL and an AC 10 knocked out on my Orion and all armor on the entire mechs was yellow or orange. It was vrs Clan ERPPC in faction play. Every weapons disabled while still having armor on every part of the mech.

Only happened once and it was quite a while ago.

Edited by Johnny Z, 28 May 2016 - 04:50 PM.


#11 Jaeger Gonzo

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 05:03 PM

View PostVompoVompatti, on 28 May 2016 - 04:29 PM, said:

I'm sure they exist or atleast they have. Not sure if they are/were a bug though.
I've killed a fully armoured timby through it's ct front with 3 shots from a dual ppc and that shouldn't happen. (It was just me cause I was the only one there)

He could forgot to take armor in mechlab or something.

#12 Alexandrix

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 05:22 PM

Heat damage is the only thing I can figure,unless there's some weird deal going on with the splash/spread damage on clan ppc's,because my ct was open.

But,prolly heat dmg.

#13 Deathlike

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 06:10 PM

Heat damage can cause crits.

Even if the heat damage doesn't actually kill a component outright, crits are generated so that tiny bit of ammo in a torso or head can go off... simply due to internal heat damage.

While your head has natively "15 structure", it only takes 10 damage from heat damage to be enough for that ammo (which has 10 health) to go off.

#14 Nightmare1

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Posted 28 May 2016 - 06:10 PM

You're not supposed to be crittable when you have armor on your torsos. Crits can only happen once your armor has been stripped. If, say, you have five points of armor and an AC/20 round hits that component, then five points will be deducted from the AC/20, leaving 15 points to damage your internal structure. That overflow of damage can trigger a crit at that point, since you no longer have armor. However, if an AC/2 hits you instead, then you will have 5 - 2 = 3 points of armor left, and no crits will be triggered.

Now, it is possible to crit internals due to heat. If you hit override and then build up heat in your gauge above the 100% threshold, you will begin to deal damage to your Mech's internals. This damage can trigger a crit on any components. since all of your internals are showing damage, despite the fact that you still have armor, I am assuming that you were using override. This is the most likely explanation for how your weapon was critted.

That being said, there are also glitches. A while back, the Grid Iron was infamously plagued by a glitch where any damage dealt to its right torso would insta-crit whatever weapon was housed within it. As someone who ran the Grid Iron frequently, I found the bug debilitating to the point where I had to stop running the Mech entirely until it was fixed.

Hope this helps!

#15 -Vompo-

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 11:47 AM

View PostJaeger Gonzo, on 28 May 2016 - 05:03 PM, said:

He could forgot to take armor in mechlab or something.


He was a player who used to post rage threads to these forums back in the day so he was/is rather experienced. I don't think he would have made a mistake like that but suppose everything is possible. :D

#16 Ronan

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 02:52 PM

Maybe all your ammo was in other locations, and it was destroyed? When the ammo is gone, the gun its for looks destroyed like that.

#17 BumbleBee

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 05:25 PM

I had something similar happen in my spirit bear last night. LBX20 was disabled with armour yellow both front and back and 21 shots remaining, CT and other torso were yellow internals and missing all armour. I dont use override BTW, and I cant remember shutting down at all that game

#18 Naduk

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 06:22 PM

There are no through armour crits

The only things that will damage you through armour is self inflicted injuries

Overheating, abusing masc are the most common ways

Overheating is by far the worst thing you can do to yourself
When you overheat past the 100% threshold , your Mech shuts down and cools off
Most the time it cools you before anything to terrible happens

However the more time (in seconds) spent over 100% the more damage that is done to your insides
Heat however does not discriminate and will anything inside you
Most the time your structure will soak the damage but sometimes items can take more than 10 damage and will be destroyed
Including weapons, equipment , ammo , even the pilot

Overheating is very risky business
The damage can cause crits and also set off ammo explosions
All critical systems like the pilot , gyro , computers and other systems crucial to battle Mech operation still only have 10hit points
Fastest way to end yourself is with heat

If a external attack breaches your armour , even if only by 1 point , it can still cause crits
But it cannot bypass armour

#19 Vxheous

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 07:34 PM

It shouldn't happen, but I wonder if this is another product of bad PGI coding. This is purely hypothetical, but say you have no armour on your CT, but armour on both STs, and a Clan ERPPC (with the 2.5 splash damage either side) hits the CT. The 2.5 splash should strip armor off both STs, but maybe due to bad coding, because the CT had NO armor, maybe the splash damage also went to ST components? Purely hypothetical of course.

Edited by Vxheous Kerensky, 29 May 2016 - 07:35 PM.


#20 Mole

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Posted 29 May 2016 - 08:25 PM

Looks to me like someone got a little cuddly with his override button and melted his UAC/20.





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