91 replies to this topic

[VinJade]

When LRM boats are concerned I have a thing about not using IS XLEs as they are glass Jawed mechs and I like being able to survive losing a side torso or two.

granted my Stalker isn't the fastest thing around but I do tend to be able to move around the battlefield and I always deal around 300-500 points of damage and when I last played(month ago) I had scored 3 solo kills with my LRMs in a single match and a lot of asst, so clearly I am doing something right.

Though one thing I have noticed when it comes to some LRM boats they do tend to hang back as long as they can and then flee when they run out of ammo and didn't bring backup weapons.

Then again I see the same thing when I see players bring AC or GR only weapons with no backup energy weapons tend to do the same thing when they run out of ammo.

I seen a Cent do that along with other mechs that are ballistic only weapons so its not just LRM boats that are guilty of not bring backup weapons.

Edited by VinJade, 06 June 2016 - 10:32 AM.

[Davis Carlyle]

My LRM Bear:

[VinJade]

Nice
Just shows if done right you can be deadly.

[Chados]

LRMishing: The Art of LRM Skirmishing.

I advocate the long-range missile as a front-line weapon, akin to Napoleon's artillery or the Wehrmacht's highly mobile artillery in the Second World War. I argue against LRM boating and exclusive LRMing at maximum range. I argue for LRMing up close and personal, within 250-450 meters where possible. Suicide, you say? No. For many reasons.

These are Chados' PUG-LRMisher Maxims:

1) Thirty tubes. No more, no less. Thirty shall be the number of the counting, and the number counted shall be 30. Forty shalt thou not count, neither count thou twenty, except that thou proceedst directly to THIRTY.

I typically get here with two LRM15 or three LRM10. Why 30? Trial and error leads me to believe that a LRM-30 mech retains maximum flexibility. Twenty tubes or less is largely ineffective unless you're a heavy or assault mech using one rack as an indirect fire solution for when the enemy drops over a ridge or something. A LRM-40+ carrier leads to the issue of boating. I say that boating is a sin for the LRMisher because you need backup weapons. "But Chados," you may say, "what of the A1 Catapult or other mechs that only have missile hardpoints? Aren't they made for boating?" I answer no. The SRM is a key backup weapon. That leads me to:

2) Thou shalt not boat.

I shudder when I see a Vulture or Catapult A1 with nothing but LRM-5s. And every Spider driver in the land jumps for joy when he or she sees it. Clans get away with it because C-LRMs do damage at short range. Inner Sphere pilots are committing short-term suicide by giving up any ability to fight inside 180 meters. The dreaded LRM-5 boat is very popular. And it notches high damage, too. But it also is the most vulnerable, least armed, and requires the most standing still and shooting of all LRM packages. It takes time to pour all those chain-fired LRM-5s on target, and the one dimensional nature of the build is a prime reason why it is so denigrated. Add to this the fact that AMS is a hard counter to the LRM-5. As long as there is at least one AMS on the other side, a LRM-5 chain won't hit jack. Ten of the 15 ALRM-15 salvo WILL hit, however. In Catalina Steiner's videos in her "pro LRM boat pilot" thread, showing how advanced target delay works, you can see an AMS-equipped target wholly negating a Griffin carrying 4xLRM-5.

LRMishers are the most hated pilots in the land. The appearance of a Catapult on the field will cause every enemy mech from the Kodiak down to the Commando to drop everything it is doing and every enemy it is facing to pursue the Catapult. Driving the A1 Cat in particular, I have had light mechs mounting ER Large Lasers stalk me relentlessly across the battlefield, ignoring every other threat. They close in for the kill...and then find out I'm packing a Streak-8 with Level 5 range module along with the two Artemis LRM-15s. Surprise! Because I don't boat. They just assume that you do and it can be their undoing.

Boaters can't get in the fight and support assault and heavy mechs on the firing line. If you have credible secondaries, you can engage from brawling distance and support both with LRM salvoes and SRM salvoes together. Only ballistics cause as much fire and cockpit shake. It will give that friendly Atlas or Kodiak a chance to exfiltrate from a bad place while the enemy turns its attention to you. It can change the battle.

3) Thou shalt be mobile.

A LRMisher who is standing still is a dead LRMisher. You need to move, 65-68kph at least. Equip jump jets, because mobility needs to be in all six directions. Escaping over a rise, hiding high in buildings, dropping in behind a bad guy in a firefight to fire with your SRMs or lasers, jets make all of this possible. Standing still and LRMing 600 meters behind the fight is like hanging a neon sign over your head that says "free lunch" for every Stormcrow and Jenner on the map. Move around the edge of the scrum. Fire as you move. Step into the fight and share your armor as needed. Bad guys will shoot at you before they shoot at a Kodiak or Dire Wolf or Atlas. Distract them so your teammates rack up kills.

4) Thou shalt take one for the team.

If you're not measuring your success by assists rather than damage or kills, then you're not a true LRMisher. The point of and goal of LRMing is team support. The LRMisher is the ultimate team player. You depend on your teammates for recon and locks. Pay it forward by putting missiles on their target. Don't ask for locks, you shouldn't need to. Shoot at what they are locking up. Carry UAVs and use them. If you can use TAG and have the energy slot to spare, then pack it. I've given thought to carrying NARC over one of my secondary weapons, even. Also, no LRM is going to have a hit rate higher than about 35%. Too many things cause them to miss. Lost locks, bad terrain, ECM, radar deprivation...LRMs have more hard counters than any other weapon system and aggressive play is mandatory with them. And get used to the fact that your team will hate you and your contributions won't be recognized. That's life with LRMs. They're glad when you're with them, but they'll never tell you.

5) Thy modules and peripherals are all-important.

I carry a LRM range module, a range module for my secondary weapons, radar deprivation, and advanced target decay. I also carry an active probe, and I use Artemis. I carry the LRM range module because in the opening stages of some matches, ringing the enemy's missile alarm will cause them to play cautious and give my team the initiative. Domination on Polar Highlands is the greatest example. The secondary weapons to me are all-important and I want to hit with them as far out as I can. Advanced target decay is a no-brainer, as with it you can hold locks for a time even in an ECM environment and do missile tricks like shooting over or around obstacles. And go Artemis or go home. An Artemis-LRM15 gets locks faster and holds them longer. And if you have a sight lock (you can see the bad guy), it will tighten your groups. The Beagle Active Probe will negate one ECM inside 360 meters and extend your sensor range. Combine it with the Advanced Seismic Sensor and credible secondary weapons like the Streak SRM8 (4xSSRM2), and ECM carriers like the Spider, Commando, Locust PB, and Raven 3L go from hunter to hunted. Artemis helps even SSRMs with lock timing.

LRMishing is fun. It's fast paced, and it's a challenge. Good LRM use is difficult in MWO, especially as you rise in tier and play with better players. But the system is viable if properly used and can be a force multiplier if the pilot isn't hiding at the end of the map. Leave that to the gauss snipers.P

Edited by Chados, 06 June 2016 - 03:37 PM.

[Lyoto Machida]

Apnu, on 31 May 2016 - 10:22 AM, said:

LRMs aren't optimal from a min-maxing solo play perspective, and they're the least competitve weapon in the game. Despite that there are players who like to run LRMs.

I've been here since the earliest days of CB. And I like to run LRM builds from time to time. I do very well in them, most of the time and I like to observe LRM players using them to see how they're doing it. Generally I see what I call "the wrong way" to use LRMs.

The wrong way is sitting back 600+ meters away lobbing LRMs, from cover, praying for solid locks from the SOBs at the front line, and holding armor back that the team sorely needs. I still see a lot of LRM builds with little to no backup weapons. Also LRM players tend to cement their feet in one spot and get ditched by the team as the fight moves around the map. Clan players can spit LRMs under 190m, but the damage return diminishes greatly the closer the target is.

The right way to play LRMs is this:

1) Trail the back end for the death ball. Stay with your team. Never stop moving.

2) Look for your own locks as much as possible.

3) Bring and use TAG and UAVs. BAP too. Artemis is optional and dependent on LOS.

4) Use LRMs at < 500m for best travel time.

5) Have backup weapons to defend yourself and/or not be useless when the LRMs are out. 3-
4 medium lasers late in the game when everybody's beat up is killer.

6) Have a speedy engine and re-position often. Be ready to move fast for a better target in optimal range (again < 500m), or dive into the middle of the death ball for cover from a harassing light mech.

7) Watch the reticle go red for hits. If lobbing LRMs, and you don't see red, the target has cover and you're firing into it.

8) Let the quirks define your build. LRM5 and LRM10 have the lowest spread. Only take LRM15 or LRM20 if the mech has quirks for them specifically.

9) Optimize your tubes. Don't put a LRM15 in a 6 tube launcher, the cooldown doesn't start until after the last missile leaves, so DPS takes a hit.

If anybody else has suggestions, let's hear them.

Nice tips but this thread has been made over and over so many times that I don't see the point of it.

[Lykaon]

Jables McBarty, on 02 June 2016 - 09:26 AM, said:

During Kodiak release I had a blastie running my MDD with 2xALRM15 2xSSRM6 4xSL + cAP. Walked about 90m behind my bear friend and Lurmed whatever he was firing at. When the lights came to tear up is RT, I could chase them off with the Streaks and SLs.

It was highly effective and I suggest that anybody with assault-pilot, brawling friends do the same.

During Kodiak release I ended up using an LRM based Stormcrow for KILLING KDKs.

Stormcrow D with a Stormcrow B right arm

3x LRM15
6 tons LRM ammo
NARC
1 ton NARC ammo
5 x ER Sml Lasers
CAP

The technique: flank the KDK so you don't have to face it. Pop out of cover very brielfly to stick a NARC on it and retreat to cover and rain the LURMs on them.

I figured the best way to handle 4 UAC10s was never be there to get shot by them.

When you burned through all the ammo you still have some potent close up firepower to handle dispatching the enemy (most likely heavily damaged) mechs end game with the 5 ER sml lasers on the right arm.

[Apnu]

Lyoto Machida, on 06 June 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

Nice tips but this thread has been made over and over so many times that I don't see the point of it.

Because threads fall off and die. Because new players come into the game and the forums all the time and they may have not seen or learned these tips yet.

Obviously I was prompted to create this thread after watching LRM noobs be a hindrance to their team. Its painful to watch.

If its boring to you, why not skip it and let it die lie all non-sticky threads do?

Lykaon, on 06 June 2016 - 07:12 PM, said:

The technique: flank the KDK so you don't have to face it. Pop out of cover very brielfly to stick a NARC on it and retreat to cover and rain the LURMs on them.

I figured the best way to handle 4 UAC10s was never be there to get shot by them.

When you burned through all the ammo you still have some potent close up firepower to handle dispatching the enemy (most likely heavily damaged) mechs end game with the 5 ER sml lasers on the right arm.

I LIKE IT!

[wanderer]

NARCs on assaults (heck, on anything) is always a good way to at least pin a target down if your LRM tossers don't have to deal with something else on priority. LRMs may be less swift on killing a big target, but if you can keep hitting it and it can't hit you, it's a great trade.

[Corrado]

1- Push with LRMs. share your armor with the team.
2- rain down already focused mechs.
3- dedicated LRM boats with enough speed to reposition and keep hammering
4- with abundance of hardpoints, carry a NARC with 2 tons of ammo, NARC your targets
5- again, push with your team and dont be afraid to get close to 200-250 meters.
6- dont spam on bad targets. a overheated LRM boat when it's needed, is not useful.
7- i'll type again, SHARE YOUR ARMOR.

i play few lrm mechs but the best and funny builds i did run are

- NARC+4LRM10 scrow
- NARC+3LRM15 hunchie-B
- 2AMS+5LRM5 summoner

i dont like to waste more than a 65 ton mech. a slow 100tonner with LRMs will hardly be better than a 100 tonner with direct fire load.

my 2 cents

[Apnu]

Corrado, on 08 June 2016 - 02:57 PM, said:

1- Push with LRMs. share your armor with the team.
2- rain down already focused mechs.
3- dedicated LRM boats with enough speed to reposition and keep hammering
4- with abundance of hardpoints, carry a NARC with 2 tons of ammo, NARC your targets
5- again, push with your team and dont be afraid to get close to 200-250 meters.
6- dont spam on bad targets. a overheated LRM boat when it's needed, is not useful.
7- i'll type again, SHARE YOUR ARMOR.

i play few lrm mechs but the best and funny builds i did run are

- NARC+4LRM10 scrow
- NARC+3LRM15 hunchie-B
- 2AMS+5LRM5 summoner

i dont like to waste more than a 65 ton mech. a slow 100tonner with LRMs will hardly be better than a 100 tonner with direct fire load.

my 2 cents

^^^ This post is a thing of beauty! ^^^

[wanderer]

I generally draw the line at 70-75 tons: For IS chassis, you can get a solid LRM-5 lobber pushing 80kph or so, and larger launcher types around 70kph- easily over the 64kph or so I'd call the minimum mobility for an LRM heavy.

[Apnu]

wanderer, on 09 June 2016 - 10:30 AM, said:

I generally draw the line at 70-75 tons: For IS chassis, you can get a solid LRM-5 lobber pushing 80kph or so, and larger launcher types around 70kph- easily over the 64kph or so I'd call the minimum mobility for an LRM heavy.

Before the quirks I had great success with the TDR-5S and ON1-Protector. Now, the Protector's quirks aren't great for missiles (Missile Cooldown: 5.00 % Missile Velocity: 10.00 %) but its 10% laser duration is nice for the LL on the build. However the TDR-5S still packs a good assortment of quirks for LRMs and some secondary weapons, especially the 15% missile cooldown but the energy quirks make for good secondary/defensive weapons. I know its heresy, but the TDR-5S still is a great go-to heavy LRM boat.

Lately, since the MAD dropped I had great success with the MAD-5D. Strong body shape, tough, 20% missile cooldown quirks and tubes for 2xLRM15s. The TAG and missiles are mounted at cockpit level, so it hill humps like a champ, and the racks are pointed kinda up to start, so the arc of the missiles is pretty good out of the tubes. It is almost unfair when I run that mech.

Of them all, the T-Bolt is fastest. I found 80-85 KPH is fast enough to reposition quickly if necessary. The Orion and MAD tend to plod along and require more prediction of where it needs to be and less 'johnny-on-the-spot' of the TDR or HBK-4J.

Edited by Apnu, 09 June 2016 - 11:42 AM.