289 replies to this topic

[Moldur]

Mystere, on 07 June 2016 - 10:03 AM, said:

They're freely available to anyone and everyone. Just because one chooses not to use them does not automatically mean that everybody else should also not. Otherwise, we should also be looking at the following equipment:

• cpu
  
• gpu
  
• motherboard
  
• RAM
  
• monitor
  
• keyboard
  
• mouse
  
• other gaming input devices
  
• network hardware
  
• ISP network quality
  
• distance to servers

I'm sure I missed a few but hopefully you get the point.

Lets say I download some free hacks for a different game, or download a third party program to create macros for a game where macros are bannable offences. Am I in the right? Anyone else could do it.

You are technically correct about the second half, if a pygmy in Africa doesn't have a computer, that doesn't mean that I shouldn't have a computer. That is a tenuous relation at best.

[Mystere]

Moldur, on 07 June 2016 - 10:32 AM, said:

Lets say I download some free hacks for a different game, or download a third party program to create macros for a game where macros are bannable offences. Am I in the right? Anyone else could do it.

Macros are allowed in MWO. That is what counts in this discussion. As such, your point is moot.

Edited by Mystere, 07 June 2016 - 10:36 AM.

[Chimera_]

Honestly, I'd be all for getting rid of macros if it also got rid of the idiots who macro multiple ballistic alphas together and end up spraying their teammates more than the enemies. /s

Really though, macros aren't a huge deal. They do give the users an advantage (fewer button presses = able to concentrate on actually piloting and such) but I don't believe such an advantage is really that noteworthy.

I don't use macros because I've never felt the need to get additional aid to play the game, but people who use them aren't getting such a different experience (to my knowledge) to bother even attempting to ban the use of such software.

EDIT: I also feel that the use of macros to use tag without holding the button down should've been a big sign to PGI to rework how tag works...I guess they figure if the external software does it already why bother?

Edited by Chimera11, 07 June 2016 - 10:44 AM.

[Marmon Rzohr]

I don't get this thread.

Can anyone give me an example of marcos in MWO doing anything actually useful ? Or something that might be considered a competitive edge ?

Where do ideas like this come from ?

Edited by Marmon Rzohr, 07 June 2016 - 10:48 AM.

[Moldur]

Mystere, on 07 June 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

Macros are allowed in MWO. That is what counts in this discussion. As such, your point is moot.

I was only following your logic with the downloading hacks or bannable macros, but in your response, you have inherently barred "they're available to everyone" as a legitimate answer by barring my answer as a moot point.

I was wondering when you were going to say it. All of your and anyone else's other points are false. The only thing you can bring to the table for macros in this discussion is the fact that PGI allows macros. That is the only valid point you or anyone else has given.

Bottomline: macros are ok to use in MWO because PGI says so.

Their impact on gameplay is irrelevant. It is no different from using macros in a game where they are a bannable offence, the only difference being how they are treated. Macros are allowed here. As it is written, so shall it be. Do not ask further questions, do not give further thought. Do not give any other B.S. reasons for macros being fair, or not a big deal. That is not a valid point. The one and only point, the end all be all of this discussion is this: PGI allows macros, so it is ok.

Edited by Moldur, 07 June 2016 - 11:07 AM.

[Mystere]

Moldur, on 07 June 2016 - 11:05 AM, said:

I was only following your logic with the downloading hacks or bannable macros, but in your response, you have inherently barred "they're available to everyone" as a legitimate answer by barring my answer as a moot point.

My so-called "logic" on this matter was always based on the fact that macros are allowed in MWO.

Moldur, on 07 June 2016 - 11:05 AM, said:

I was wondering when you were going to say it. All of your and anyone else's other points are false. The only thing you can bring to the table for macros in this discussion is the fact that PGI allows macros. That is the only valid point you or anyone else has given.

Frankly, it is the only indisputable valid point.

Moldur, on 07 June 2016 - 11:05 AM, said:

Bottomline: macros are ok to use in MWO because PGI says so.

Their impact on gameplay is irrelevant. It is no different from using macros in a game where they are a bannable offence, the only difference being how they are treated. Macros are allowed here. As it is written, so shall it be. Do not ask further questions, do not give further thought. Do not give any other B.S. reasons for macros being fair, or not a big deal. That is not a valid point. The one and only point, the end all be all of this discussion is this: PGI allows macros, so it is ok.

I do not know about you, but macros provide the following benefits as underlined below:

Bobzilla, on 07 June 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:

Doing it while aiming, moving, calling targets, checking minimap, fireing other weapons looking at heat..... This is where the macros help, it eliminates a large task so your brain can focus on other things.

This game's skill set is multitasking and prediction as reflexes aren't that important and aiming is pretty easy. Macros help a lot in the multitasking area allowing more thought to go to the prediction part.

As I have said previously, welcome to the 21st Century.


I'm really so glad PGI has still not succumbed and gotten weak-kneed on the regular and persistent anti-macro whining.

[Mystere]

Marmon Rzohr, on 07 June 2016 - 10:47 AM, said:

I don't get this thread.

Can anyone give me an example of marcos in MWO doing anything actually useful ? Or something that might be considered a competitive edge ?

Where do ideas like this come from ?

It's not really something specific. It's usefulness is in something very general, as Bobzilla has written below:

Bobzilla, on 07 June 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:

Doing it while aiming, moving, calling targets, checking minimap, fireing other weapons looking at heat..... This is where the macros help, it eliminates a large task so your brain can focus on other things.

This game's skill set is multitasking and prediction as reflexes aren't that important and aiming is pretty easy. Macros help a lot in the multitasking area allowing more thought to go to the prediction part.

Lostdragon, on 07 June 2016 - 09:19 AM, said:

The problem is that if no one says anything contrary to the regular and incessant whining about macros, PGI just might eventually get weak-kneed and succumb to these demands.

Frankly, I think that is the objective of some of these regular anti-macro folks.

Edited by Mystere, 07 June 2016 - 11:31 AM.

[Fut]

Marmon Rzohr, on 07 June 2016 - 10:47 AM, said:

Can anyone give me an example of marcos in MWO doing anything actually useful ? Or something that might be considered a competitive edge ?

Sorry for not getting specific, like you clearly asked, but here's how I see it - .

Macros must give some kind of advantage to those using them, otherwise they wouldn't bother using them at all. It's fairly interesting/entertaining to me to see people continually try to downplay the advantages, as it all just seems like a ruse to allow their continued use. An advantage is an advantage, regardless of how little it may seem.

Personally I don't really care if people use them, I don't use them myself because I'm one of the crazy people who thinks it's more fun for the human to play for themselves. Isn't part playing MWO that there's a lot going on and you, as the Mechwarrior, have to keep track of so many things? To me that's all part of the fun. I don't want my mouse to eliminate Ghost Heat, or eliminate UAC jams - I want to be doing that stuff on my own.

Anyhow, like I said, I don't care if people use them. Having said that though, if there was a vote I'd be on the "No Macro" side.

[Bobzilla]

They could easily add a simple macro UI and everyone would be happy.

[Fut]

Bobzilla, on 07 June 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

They could easily add a simple macro UI and everyone would be happy.

Or they could eliminate the Jam chance on UACs, and have the weapons fire at the exact optimal rate that users' set their Macros to, right?

[Queen of England]

Fut, on 07 June 2016 - 12:02 PM, said:

Or they could eliminate the Jam chance on UACs, and have the weapons fire at the exact optimal rate that users' set their Macros to, right?

That's wildly out of date. Macros haven't helped UAC jam chance for over a year.

[Mystere]

Bobzilla, on 07 June 2016 - 11:58 AM, said:

They could easily add a simple macro UI and everyone would be happy.

Providing a link to AutoHotKey is easier, especially if they do not even have the staff needed to build a capable macro system. Doing so requires no development and debugging time.

[Fut]

Queen of England, on 07 June 2016 - 12:17 PM, said:

That's wildly out of date. Macros haven't helped UAC jam chance for over a year.

lol. Like I said, I don't use them, so I don't keep up to date with what's currently trending in the MWO Macro World.
My apologies if the UAC issue has been taken care of, as that is one of the only things i can think of where Macros are giving a decent advantage (although, even with the jam quirks in place, I can't imagine Macros not helping with it. Could be a failure to understand on my part).

Anyhow, carry on.. Macros are cool because PGI hasn't said they aren't.

[Revis Volek]

Fut, on 07 June 2016 - 12:23 PM, said:

lol. Like I said, I don't use them, so I don't keep up to date with what's currently trending in the MWO Macro World.
My apologies if the UAC issue has been taken care of, as that is one of the only things i can think of where Macros are giving a decent advantage (although, even with the jam quirks in place, I can't imagine Macros not helping with it. Could be a failure to understand on my part).

Anyhow, carry on.. Macros are cool because PGI hasn't said they aren't.

It does NOT help with or circumvent the JAM CHANCE, it just keeps it as minimal as it can be.


I can achieve the same results with just my fingers though...Never needed a macro for it just takes a few mins in testing ground to practice and get warmed up.

[Fut]

Revis Volek, on 07 June 2016 - 12:35 PM, said:

It does NOT help with or circumvent the JAM CHANCE, it just keeps it as minimal as it can be.

I can achieve the same results with just my fingers though...Never needed a macro for it just takes a few mins in testing ground to practice and get warmed up.

Again, apologies. Bad word choice on my part. Should have said that the Macros mitigate the Jams.
Of course you could practice and get the hang of it, but why bother when a Macro can do the work easier/better?

[Ghogiel]

PGI should just add better features to make the game better. Like better weapon grouping and chain fire timing settings.

[Revis Volek]

Fut, on 07 June 2016 - 12:38 PM, said:

Again, apologies. Bad word choice on my part. Should have said that the Macros mitigate the Jams.
Of course you could practice and get the hang of it, but why bother when a Macro can do the work easier/better?

Because to me, thats more things to go wrong mid match that i then have to find out what happened. I just never had luck with macros more then likely User error im sure but its more trouble then it worth in this game IMO.

Macros fail as well, they are more reliable until they arent and being as lazy i am that sounds like way to much like work.

Edited by Revis Volek, 07 June 2016 - 02:25 PM.

[ExplicitContent]

Ace Selin, on 06 June 2016 - 11:42 PM, said:

Marcos is a pretty chill dude, ive played a few games with him. He is always happy to lead and usually will go in first on the big pushes. Leave Marcos alone, i like playing with him.

logged in just to like this lmao

[Moldur]

Mystere, on 07 June 2016 - 11:24 AM, said:

My so-called "logic" on this matter was always based on the fact that macros are allowed in MWO.




Frankly, it is the only indisputable valid point.

So, what would this discussion look like if PGI banned macros from the start? Would I be sitting here saying "They are banned because PGI banned them, look at my circular logic."? Would I still be giving the same points that they confer an unfair advantage? What would you say to support macros? The 1 fulcrum of your current argument is that they are ok because they are allowed. Frankly, that is a piece of **** reason.

[Helene de Montfort]

If it is to play against macros, we could as well make the game pve.

If something is authorized, it should be made available to all players. Otherwise it should be forbidden for all players. Or game mechanics should be made so it become pointless.

But i must admit that seeing so many high tier players defending macros made me laugh. If they want to keep macros, i suggest they remove all kind of ladderboards. Either FP ladderboards, or PSR.