28 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

The first time I raised this, I noted how these tournaments have real consequences as in, those are our friends that play in them. I don't care how you, PGI, view this tournament. Maybe it's just a hype machine for you to sell additional mechs, but people that participate, whether through playing or supporting do care.

This is your announcement for this week:

http://mwomercs.com/...e-9th-10th-11th

Now, can you imagine any OTHER pro sports doing exactly what you did?

"Today on ESPN, from 1 to 9 PM, BASEBALL!"

It's a huge disrespect to tournament players, their teams, and fans. Let me repeat that. It's a straight up disrespect to anyone that have any passion about this game and supported you guys through the ups and downs. This kind of attitude? Is exactly why you only have 800 players on a weekend night.

I don't even blame this on the streamers. I think they did a hell of a job sacrificing their time and effort. I blame this solely on you. Like, you can't even fake your way out of this. We all work, so we all know how this shenanigans work. You guys found 2 volunteers that will work for free (or very low return), so you dump all the work onto them, which they clearly HAVE NOT been able to handle adequately.

This is squarely on you, a company of failure on such a grand scale. How do you have such a beautiful game at its core, but such terrible peripheries?

What you guys should have done, is come up with the schedules weeks ahead. GIVE the schedules to the streamers. All they have to do, is follow through with the motion, and do what they do best, which is stream. All those support works? That's YOUR job. I mean, I hear statements like how the streamers will pick games to cast, and I am already convinced that you guys just don't give a crap about this event.

Now, you guys are not multi million/billion dollar operations. I get that. But the core of how to run things should remain the same, no?
1: Have a dedicated person for tournament team relations.
2: Have him/her setup schedule early with feedback.
3: Have him/her select and give broadcast schedule to streamers.
4: Contact each teams on broadcasting schedules/other schedules to have backup plans.
5: Record videos/plan activities in case all options failed on broadcasting time.

None of these steps are hard. It does take effort. Effort that you, as a tournament organizer, should put into. There are no post game analysis with game boards. There are no strategy discussions. You didn't give those streams one iota of directions and tools needed.

It's honestly infuriating beyond belief.

Even now, for all your replays, you can't bother to have a time-stamp of events in the description. What happened? Who played? Who won?

You are quite literally the worst company to be running this kind of hundred grand event. Get your act together. Get a PR team. If you can't hire one, at least put in the effort from your employees. (And no, I don't mean people that volunteer for free, but people under your payrolls) Even amateurish effort is better than no effort, and you need to start showing effort before we just decide en-mass that you are not worth the trouble to support anymore.

Edited by razenWing, 11 June 2016 - 03:02 PM.

[Void Angel]

What a load of angry, entitled whine fantasy. It's just a load of abuse interspersed with clumsy nonsense that would make a Sophist blush ("we all know...") and appeals to pity.

Maybe you should stop using "passion for the game" as an excuse for bad manners and temper tantrums - and instead give meaningful feedback that's not drenched in sewage.

This, right here? This is why PGI stopped talking to the player base for a good long time.

[razenWing]

Void Angel, on 11 June 2016 - 03:12 PM, said:

What a load of angry, entitled whine fantasy. It's just a load of abuse interspersed with clumsy nonsense that would make a Sophist blush ("we all know...") and appeals to pity.

Maybe you should stop using "passion for the game" as an excuse for bad manners and temper tantrums - and instead give meaningful feedback that's not drenched in sewage.

This, right here? This is why PGI stopped talking to the player base for a good long time.

What a load of "I have no idea what I am talking about"

So you actually think PGI is doing a good job?
You support what PGI is doing?
You put money into this game?

Your reply show none of that, and is about as generic as "I CAN'T STAND LOUD NOISES!" by Brick Tamland from Anchorman.

Don't post crap replies until you can actually figure out a stance and specifics of what you have problems with.

Also, if you can't see at least 3 points of interest and a suggestion of a 5 point SOP, then it's not my fault that your teachers never taught you to read. (PS. They are literally numbered from 1 to 5. Maybe you need help on math too?)

[Void Angel]

Keep digging the hole deeper. My problem is with your abusive tantrum; your attitude of affronted, long-suffering rage. You can't even keep your bile out of your 'logical' rebuttal: "you actually think..." You hurl abuse, violate the rules of logical argument so clumsily a Sophist would weep at your incompetence, and play the pity card at the same time: "Oh, boo hoo, these are our fwends pwaying! You don't care abowt our fwiends!" And anyone who objects to this must be illiterate and unable to count! Sorry to break it to you, Tiny Tim, but spewing vitriol whilst trying to play the Poor Little Orphan doesn't work very well.

Your entire diatribe against my response both exemplifies your polemic and illustrates my objections. To borrow your own word, your argument is "crap" - and no one should be expected to snorkel through the sewage to pick up any nuggets of wisdom you allege to have hidden there.

Feel free to lose the crybaby whine, the screaming tantrum, and the dishonest arguments - and the come back and see if you have anything constructive to add.

Edited by Void Angel, 12 June 2016 - 03:04 PM.

[Tarogato]

razenWing, on 11 June 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

The first time I raised this, I noted how these tournaments have real consequences as in, those are our friends that play in them. I don't care how you, PGI, view this tournament. Maybe it's just a hype machine for you to sell additional mechs, but people that participate, whether through playing or supporting do care.

This is your announcement for this week:

http://mwomercs.com/...e-9th-10th-11th

Now, can you imagine any OTHER pro sports doing exactly what you did?

"Today on ESPN, from 1 to 9 PM, BASEBALL!"

It's a huge disrespect to tournament players, their teams, and fans. Let me repeat that. It's a straight up disrespect to anyone that have any passion about this game and supported you guys through the ups and downs.

I don't feel disrespected. What are you on about? I actually don't know what you're pointing at. The fact that the exact teams aren't being listed? If that's what you problem is, maybe you don't understand why they stopped listed the exact teams that were scheduled to fight. Although I'm speculating, I figure it is because they don't want to be all like "Tonight will be 5th Avengers vs. 3rd Peregrine Hussars" and then 5th Avengers doesn't show up, and it looks bad. Instead, the casters can (sometimes) have a backup match lined up in case somebody doesn't show up for the first one and the audience doesn't have to know or shame who no-showed.

razenWing, on 11 June 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

What you guys should have done, is come up with the schedules weeks ahead. GIVE the schedules to the streamers. All they have to do, is follow through with the motion, and do what they do best, which is stream. All those support works? That's YOUR job. I mean, I hear statements like how the streamers will pick games to cast, and I am already convinced that you guys just don't give a crap about this event.

Now, you guys are not multi million/billion dollar operations. I get that. But the core of how to run things should remain the same, no?
1: Have a dedicated person for tournament team relations.
2: Have him/her setup schedule early with feedback.
3: Have him/her select and give broadcast schedule to streamers.
4: Contact each teams on broadcasting schedules/other schedules to have backup plans.
5: Record videos/plan activities in case all options failed on broadcasting time.

But this is exactly what they've been doing already... except the casters I presume handle it themselves, which I don't see as a problem. I trust them better to communicating directly with the teams more than I would anybody at PGI.

razenWing, on 11 June 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

Even now, for all your replays, you can't bother to have a time-stamp of events in the description. What happened? Who played? Who won?

Wait, what? You mean the part where all the casted matches are uploaded to youtube and it *doesn't* tell you which team won so as to not spoil it for people that haven't watched yet?

https://www.youtube....oronline/videos

---

The only complaint I have about the streams is the 20-minute downtime between matches. I just which they could stream matches every quarter of the hour (but PGI decided to schedule official matches half-hourly).

[VitriolicViolet]

Just wow the sheer volume of logical fallacies in that post is stunning.
Im actually impressed by the amount of anger and irrationality.

One thing you should start your argument with the actual issue as opposed to making me, and I quote Void Angel, 'Snorkel through the sewerage' to even try to understand what your issue is.

[razenWing]

Tarogato, on 11 June 2016 - 05:15 PM, said:

I don't feel disrespected. What are you on about? I actually don't know what you're pointing at. The fact that the exact teams aren't being listed? If that's what you problem is, maybe you don't understand why they stopped listed the exact teams that were scheduled to fight. Although I'm speculating, I figure it is because they don't want to be all like "Tonight will be 5th Avengers vs. 3rd Peregrine Hussars" and then 5th Avengers doesn't show up, and it looks bad. Instead, the casters can (sometimes) have a backup match lined up in case somebody doesn't show up for the first one and the audience doesn't have to know or shame who no-showed.





But this is exactly what they've been doing already... except the casters I presume handle it themselves, which I don't see as a problem. I trust them better to communicating directly with the teams more than I would anybody at PGI.





Wait, what? You mean the part where all the casted matches are uploaded to youtube and it *doesn't* tell you which team won so as to not spoil it for people that haven't watched yet?

https://www.youtube....oronline/videos

---

The only complaint I have about the streams is the 20-minute downtime between matches. I just which they could stream matches every quarter of the hour (but PGI decided to schedule official matches half-hourly).

O, you mean, these too?

https://www.twitch.tv/piranhagames

Like, how the official page linked you to TWITCH, and apparently, YOUTUBE is where I should be going? So this is all ok? Because you know, checking one platform is not good enough, now I need to follow 5 different platforms?

And most of you have made zero arguments toward any rebuttals. It's all "I have problem with your tone."

Yea, in case you didn't notice the title, it's SUPPOSED to be an angry post. In another word, if I wrote, "Oh PGI, pretty please like this 100k tournament that you are running like a 3rd grade project, can you please turn it around? PLEASE?"

So if I did that, that would be better? You all want to talk logic fallacy? That's logic fallacy. (PS, that's a direct quote to violet"

Actual issues? WTF? Just because you all lack reading comprehension does not mean that I didn't raise any issues. I raise issues with how schedules and info are erratic, scattered, and downright hectic. If that wasn't communicated enough, well, as I said, I am not responsible for your lack of ability to read.

But yea, rather than focus on the issues, I guess you all find it more worthwhile to attack me personally. Good to know how fanboys like you guys will not allow their numbers to go below 800 a night. But unlike you guys, maybe I don't find it satisfactory for this game with fantastic potential to draw that number? Maybe it could be a game that draws 8000?

But nah, it's ok. None of those are issues. You guys just have issues with my "tone."

-----------------

PS Never make the argument that it's satisfactory to YOU. The plain simple fact is, NO ONE runs 100 grand tourney this way. No one promotes 100k tourney this way. ESPECIALLY not a niche closed off community like this, where I say at least 80% of the remaining population still got a chip in one of these teams, whether you are a fan of b33f, a friend in particular unit, heck... your family might in there too.

When it's a community this tight, it's NOT satisfactory to be sub-par. Which is what I find the most disturbing about your acceptance. Also, clearly, that's NOT what they've been doing. I watched all the cast from week 1, and that's not the message that's communicated. Also, as I quote from their official announcement, it degrades every week. At least in week 1, they announced the schedule, albeit in a hectic manner. So by same trend of degradation, can you imagine what will happen 4 weeks? 2 months? When even more time has passed and less hype generated?

"Today, sometimes... some games."

Or maybe we don't even get updates anymore?

Yea yea, maybe you guys with 1000 hours in the book have gotten used to the fact that you need to follow 5 social medias to get all the info, but that's not my prerogative. The fact is, I should be able to log onto the main webpage, and find all the info that I wanted. But because they didn't do 1 through 5, and let streamers handle it themselves, that's the mess we have today.

But nah, I guess because of my tone (which frankly, is directly at PGI, not you guys) and your acceptance of sub-par mediocrity where scattered and disorganized information is satisfactory, and you can't even comprehend how NOT mentioning you guys if you guys are chosen is somehow NOT a sign of disrespect... Because of all that, now I gotta have a flame war with you fanboys instead of with the corporate entity that's running this into the ground.

Yup, sounds about right, you guys sure got me there.
------------------

Edited by razenWing, 11 June 2016 - 06:33 PM.

[Aresye]

Tarogato, on 11 June 2016 - 05:15 PM, said:

The only complaint I have about the streams is the 20-minute downtime between matches. I just which they could stream matches every quarter of the hour (but PGI decided to schedule official matches half-hourly).

One of the more recent casts actually showed recorded games that weren't previously casted in-between officially casted drops.

Not sure how many they have doing this, but some of the refs are actually recording footage for the casters to use in-between official matches.

[Tarogato]

Aresye, on 12 June 2016 - 12:56 AM, said:

One of the more recent casts actually showed recorded games that weren't previously casted in-between officially casted drops.

Not sure how many they have doing this, but some of the refs are actually recording footage for the casters to use in-between official matches.

Actually, bandit&mdm beat me to the punch. Saturday's stream had a match every 15 minutes. It was great.

[McValium]

Its easier in the NA bracket to get Matches done in 15 minutes increments since there are generally more matches scheduled for the evening. during the EU bracket it often boils down to 1-3 possible matches with only 1-2 8v8 actually happening.

[Davegt27]

What I would like to see is a number in the twitch title
To show which broadcast (Broadcast 1 thru XXX)

That way I could quickly go to the broadcast I want to see
Last week I watched all the twitch broadcasts then counted the Mech types and damage done
That way I would know the Avg. damage done for each Mech type entered in the tournament

After Wednesday I gave up could I not find my place and kept watching the same broadcasts over again

[Rushin Roulette]

razenWing, on 11 June 2016 - 06:24 PM, said:

O, you mean, these too?

https://www.twitch.tv/piranhagames

Like, how the official page linked you to TWITCH, and apparently, YOUTUBE is where I should be going? So this is all ok? Because you know, checking one platform is not good enough, now I need to follow 5 different platforms?

How about a little more brainz and a little less Ragez?

Try at least a LITTLE teensy weensy bit of research before you go all full apeshit crazy?

https://www.twitch.t...hagames/profile

How about that part then?

It is a direct link from the one you posted above... just click the name "PiranhaGames" and you get right there with all saved streams including split off parts...

The only thing I personally would liek changed in the Twitch/youtube videos is the name of the games. Add the region (US/EU/AUS) or whatever and teh date of the game.

[Stoneblade]

I would like to add: twitch accounts have a setting to upload videos to youtube. The reason for this is that twitch has limited video storage on it.

I feel the ignorance of the OP has generated most of their rage. I also feel the ignorance of the meaning of ignorance will generate more.

[Afuldan McKronik]

I can't find where my friends and unitmates matches are. Can someone give me a video name and a timestamp for MDKZ matches?

[VVonka]

PGI released a schedule but the schedule was not workable for many teams so they allowed for teams to reschedule their matches. Many matches are taking place at different times and different places (like Tuesday fight nights on MRBC server). Bandit and PGI often dont know about these until they are already fought.


Bandit and CO are doing a great job and working their butts off. PGI is listening and allowing these matches to happen when the teams can actually fight which is helping to keep the drop out lower than what it would of been. Could it of been different? Could aspects of been better? MAYBE but your core point is primarily caused because PGI had to adjust to a demand by the competitive community. The very first week they had matches, the announcement said what teams would be fighting. When Bandit tried to get those matches it didnt work out, so they changed it. Nobody knows what matches are going to happen on a given night so how can they tell you?

[Dee Eight]

Let's break this down.... angry ranty whinefest from the guy who's been here for 2 months...and responses from folks who've been here 3 or more years....followed by more anger directed at the long timers by the newbie telling them they don't know anything.

Okie fine... move along...nothing to see here.

[Tarogato]

Dee Eight, on 12 June 2016 - 04:50 PM, said:

Let's break this down.... angry ranty whinefest from the guy who's been here for 2 months...and responses from folks who've been here 3 or more years....followed by more anger directed at the long timers by the newbie telling them they don't know anything.

Okie fine... move along...nothing to see here.

To be fair, you don't have to be playing MWO long to make an observation/criticism about something in MWO being shjt relative to other games.

Edited by Tarogato, 12 June 2016 - 09:02 PM.

[QuePan]

while i dont completely agree with everything the op stated , but there are some things that have been handled wrong with the streaming of matches , the fact that teams can avoid being streamed by rescheduling games that the commentators cant pick a match if they have a need to fill a time slot due to a forfeit ,or postponement im sorry they need permission from the teams to choose to broadcast ARE YOU KIDDING ME ?? this happened this weeks broadcasts , lucky they got permission from the teams if not there would be nothing to watch . im sorry you sign up for the tourney then your at the discretion of the tourney should be able to be spectated and aired period . PGI needs to step up the game of this tourney and take better responsibility of making sure that there scheduled air times are covered completely . the commentators job is for that and that only , they shouldn't have to do anything else other than show up and commentate a match and talk about matches between matches there is no reason that they have to find something to air , IE commentator 1V1s
listen i adore Tina and the PGI staff , i enjoy the commentary work by Bandit and Zero i enjoy the Game as a whole but as someone watching this and routing for teams and players it feels very lackluster and sorry to say unprofessional IMO

[Appogee]

Is the OP upset that the livestream isn't making him famous by listing his or his team's name?

Or that he can't find a replay of himself playing?

Or something else?

I couldn't work it out amongst the vitriol. But whatever it is, it certainly sounds entitlement-driven.

[Davegt27]

Appogee, on 13 June 2016 - 01:18 PM, said:

Is the OP upset that the livestream isn't making him famous by listing his or his team's name?

Or that he can't find a replay of himself playing?

Or something else?

I couldn't work it out amongst the vitriol. But whatever it is, it certainly sounds entitlement-driven.

What the OP is referring to is the simplistic way the $120,000 tournament is being implemented


Basically it’s just lack of experience on PGI's part

They should have done a number of small tournaments then they would know what areas to make improvements


The errors are blatantly obvious to the OP and others as well

To be a bit more specific PGI needs to

1) Get a specific schedule so that people can plan to show up and watch and it needs to be pinned in every forum

This might be every other day or maybe on the weekends or what ever


We know the upcoming football/soccer schedule at the beginning of the season)

2) We have two volunteer shout casters that are doing a great job but the official PGI representative
Should be mentioned so people know things are on the up and up
Also MDMzero0 seems to be doing double duty as a shout caster and a PGI official
Nothing wrong with that but people, teams and other need to know there is a PGI official on hand


3) Stats need to be made available to the shout casters so they have a little more than there opinion
When the say stuff (like we have seen a spider XX time and it does not seem to be a go to Mech for most teams)


4) broadcasts need to have as little dead air time as possible people don’t mind adverts for Mech pack as long as its
Mixed in with other good content

After I watched these events I am glad I supported the tournament and I highly recommend people check it out

But also it’s a pretty ham fisted effort it could be a lot better

Love to see poopenshire and his co caster (sorry forgot his name but he is from Europe) do like a pre or post event show

Anyway the OP is salty but mostly correct

5) The tournament needs its own playlist on YouTube and it needs to be in order the same with twitch

6) Speaking of order anyone have any idea how the tournament is going are we done with the 1st round

What are the standings you know something you might see for a NCAA or even little league tournament

Edited by Davegt27, 14 June 2016 - 11:55 AM.