597 replies to this topic

[Kuiperling]

Riffleman, on 16 July 2012 - 11:30 AM, said:

-snip-

What happened to playing a game for fun over the last 10 years?

When did playing a game as a fun simulator become an everything rides on your performance stress fest.

That is all.

[deranda]

After reading through the whole thread I get the impression that a lot of people here never really played extensively on mouse and keyboard (no offense intended). Many of the brought up issues (like the number of buttons on keyboard or mouse) are practically non-existent if you are used to nowadays' games and their requirements in terms of controls (if you aim to play competitively) - all of them resolved by simple usage of keyboard and mouse.
That being said I plan to start out with keyboard and mouse and can imagine switching over to joystick+mouse if it happens to feel superior to me. I can't see me playing purely on a joystick as of right now; I am an oldschool gamer and hated this on the good old c64.

I do think that keyboard and mouse will be the stronger setup but in the end we will see how it all plays out. I just don't get the arrogance or hostility of some people.

[maddkatt]

If your really looking to get your game on:

Natural Point's TrackIR5 http://www.naturalpo...ducts/trackir5/
OCZ's NIA http://www.ocztechno...controller.html
and Logitech's G940 http://www.logitech..../joysticks/5855

that would be crazy.
wishful thinking though,
still rockin out with the good ole force feedback pro I got with MW3. Gotta love that beast!

[Gunnerfa1]

what we really need is a joystick set up that plays like a xbox controller but with all the buttons on the sticks or how about this some one design a fully enclosed mech cockpit(like those big flight simulators the millitary uses to train pilots) so that your looking at the monitor infront of as if your looking out the cockpit window itself with two joysticks one mounted on each armrest and make the entire thing turn and tilt to the actions of the mech body turning and looking up and down how cool would something like that be for immersion

[Dredhawk]

Iv always played MW games with a Joystick mouse and key board just doesn't fit a big walking robot of death.....Could you picture siting there in the cockpit of the mech using a key board and mouse LOL

[Moodysea]

00seven, on 16 July 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

I'm old enough to remember getting blisters from the Atari 2600 joystick when Space Invaders came out. Left-Right-Fire...Nuff said.
I'll start with mouse / kb and get a feel for the game...then decide if a joystick will make it more "fun" for me. (as thontor hinted at above)
Plus I can use the joystick for PowerPoint presentations at work...who needs a wimpy presenter clicker when you have FIRE BUTTONS!

This is genius. I am doing a lecture on computer games next semester. I had not thought of using a joystick to do it with!

[Whip]

Gunnerfa1, on 16 July 2012 - 10:58 PM, said:

what we really need is a joystick set up that plays like a xbox controller but with all the buttons on the sticks or how about this some one design a fully enclosed mech cockpit(like those big flight simulators the millitary uses to train pilots) so that your looking at the monitor infront of as if your looking out the cockpit window itself with two joysticks one mounted on each armrest and make the entire thing turn and tilt to the actions of the mech body turning and looking up and down how cool would something like that be for immersion

Imersion?? What about this baby??

http://www.thrustmas...ped-speedmaster

I told the missus I need a new chair and desk for the computer....She said yes........The fool!!!

Edited by Whip, 16 July 2012 - 11:11 PM.

[Terror Teddy]

deranda, on 16 July 2012 - 10:50 PM, said:

After reading through the whole thread I get the impression that a lot of people here never really played extensively on mouse and keyboard (no offense intended). Many of the brought up issues (like the number of buttons on keyboard or mouse) are practically non-existent if you are used to nowadays' games and their requirements in terms of controls (if you aim to play competitively) - all of them resolved by simple usage of keyboard and mouse.

I played through most of MW2:Mercs/MW3/MW4 with mouse and keyboard. Depending on joystick aiming can be a ***** - especially maintaining an LRM lock on a moving target. A mouse might be more efficient MOST of the times

Ergonomically though playing keyboard+mouse plays HELL with my hands after a longer period of time (aproximately 22 years of gaming and office work with computers can do that to you).

As many said it is also about immersion and playing with a throttle and joystick literally puts the controls in your hands as you dont actually have to move them around very much so you also avoid getting cramps by holding down a button for a long period of time (BF3 im looking at you...)

Also, rudder pedals and things like TrackIr frees up more of your fingers/hands without having to fly across the keyboard.

In the end it is about what FEELS best, not what is 'competitive' or 'elite' as I couldnt give a rats *** about what some individual things halv across the world as he is so 'l33t' with his hipshooting sniper quickscoping rabbit jumping skills...

ok, that last part was somewhat crass but you get my point, besides...I really hate the term 'competitive' gaming as it makes it sound so very much refined like it is an olympic sport - its a game, just a game.

[Gunnerfa1]

Whip, on 16 July 2012 - 11:08 PM, said:

Imersion?? What about this baby??

http://www.thrustmas...ped-speedmaster

I told the missus I need a new chair and desk for the computer....She said yes........The fool!!!

now that is what im talking about but now make it rotate and tilt up and down and enclose it and make it look like the cockpit of a catapult mech

[Affront692]

I got this years back. I still remember it had a free copy of MW3 in the box. It is still the best PC related purchase I ever made. I was in "omg" mode cause of the "force feedback". Being able to feel my mech was awesome. One of my most memorable mechwarrior experiences

Edited by Affront692, 16 July 2012 - 11:38 PM.

[deranda]

Terror Teddy, on 16 July 2012 - 11:15 PM, said:

I played through most of MW2:Mercs/MW3/MW4 with mouse and keyboard. Depending on joystick aiming can be a ***** - especially maintaining an LRM lock on a moving target. A mouse might be more efficient MOST of the times

Ergonomically though playing keyboard+mouse plays HELL with my hands after a longer period of time (aproximately 22 years of gaming and office work with computers can do that to you).

As many said it is also about immersion and playing with a throttle and joystick literally puts the controls in your hands as you dont actually have to move them around very much so you also avoid getting cramps by holding down a button for a long period of time (BF3 im looking at you...)

Also, rudder pedals and things like TrackIr frees up more of your fingers/hands without having to fly across the keyboard.

In the end it is about what FEELS best, not what is 'competitive' or 'elite' as I couldnt give a rats *** about what some individual things halv across the world as he is so 'l33t' with his hipshooting sniper quickscoping rabbit jumping skills...

ok, that last part was somewhat crass but you get my point, besides...I really hate the term 'competitive' gaming as it makes it sound so very much refined like it is an olympic sport - its a game, just a game.

To each their own, I didn't try to convince anyone of anything

Everyone has their ergonomic preferences, I personally don't have a problem playing hours and hours at a time with my mouse and keyboard. If someone feels otherwise they should definitely play with a joystick or whatever they are comfortable with.
Regarding immersion a joystick just does nothing good for me, I feel like controlling a mech while playing on my mouse and keyboard. I just don't notice them while being focused on the gameplay.
I guess we can agree about most things, people tend to play best on what they enjoy the most and that's what most important. For the individual it doesn't matter what is statistically the most effective setup.

Edited by deranda, 16 July 2012 - 11:37 PM.

[Terror Teddy]

deranda, on 16 July 2012 - 11:33 PM, said:

To each their own, I didn't try to convince anyone of anything

Everyone has their ergonomic preferences, I personally don't have a problem playing hours and hours at a time with my mouse and keyboard. If someone feels otherwise they should definitely play with a joystick or whatever they are comfortable with.
Regarding immersion a joystick just does nothing good for me, I feel like controlling a mech while playing on my mouse and keyboard. I just don't notice them while being focused on the gameplay.
I guess we can agree about most things, people tend to play best on what they enjoy the most and that's what most important. For the individual it doesn't matter what is statistically the most effective setup.

Exactly - in the end it is more importantly that we all had fun and felt that we had an intense battle. Hopefully we will weed out the immature screaming players early and have FUN.

After all kids, war is all about having fun

[Adonnay]

I read torso twist with joystick is much less frustrating because you don't have to "wait" for the torso to follow your reticule a few times now.

This is where I think you're wrong (like a few others here as well).

a. If you move the mouse slow enough (no one says you have to cross the 30" screen in 0.000001 secs) I am sure the torse keeps perfectly aligned and that it's not lagging behind.
b. I assume you control the reticule (for arms movement you need an independent reticule) with the right joystick (that has the torso twist). How do you handle the vertical movement of the torso weapons? Right, just the same as the mouse users... you move the reticule and "wait for the torso to lign up".
c. Perhaps there is even a key that lets you "lock" the reticule to the torso movement (there was in previous Mech games an option to say right click and thus control the torso directly).

The only advantage I really see is the smoother leg control that is definitely better than just WASD.

[Thaygood]

Keyboard/mouse or joystick whatever works for you be happy and have fun, plus I don't see keyboards in any mech cockpit pictures even the ones on this site have (Now say it with me) a "stick" and "throttle". It's not a job and our lives don't depend on it, just have fun

Edited by Thaygood, 16 July 2012 - 11:53 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Harabeck, on 16 July 2012 - 11:34 AM, said:

It was designed for joysticks, but that was in the age where everyone had one. That isn't the case anymore, so you can't design a game around it. And as neat as they are, they really are crap for anything except flight sims.



In other words, the days before multiplayer. Any competitive multiplayer game ever had these things, and MWO is a competitive multiplayer game.

Kinda funny since to this day I generally have no trouble smoking the mouse and keyboard crowd with my inferior, primitive Microsoft Sidewinder precision Pro... that just happens to stay dead on, have all the controls right where I need them and such.

And since the Artemis Razer,
http://www.geeky-gad...zer-Artemis.jpg
is a jumbo joystick designed just FOR Mechwarrior Online, I think to butcher Mark Twain: "Reports of my joysticks death have been greatly exaggerated".

PS: I never play flight sims.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 16 July 2012 - 11:55 PM.

[Whip]

Is there going to be a "Server Side" cross hair option??

Make this whole thread kind of mute if there is in regards to "Super Accurate", especially those who don't reside in the US or next door to the servers.

Most of us will play with the "Server Side" cross hairs, which if you haven't used before, have a "Floating" movement about them.

Mouse or Joystick will make no difference, other than it will feel more natural with the joystick, chasing a floating cross hair and trying to land it on a moving fast light mech.

If I could land shots using a Joystick on a server with an average of 350 M/S against a running light crossing at 500+ in MW4, then I am pretty sure I can do it again in this game.

Edited by Whip, 16 July 2012 - 11:57 PM.

[Drenar]

light487, on 16 July 2012 - 03:30 PM, said:

If I had all the money in the world.. I would have pedals for joystick for turning legs, pedals for torso (I know right...) and headset tracking for arms/aiming..

but I don't.. so I have joystick for turning and mouse for aiming.. and torso twist is coupled with the aiming..

See, I'm looking to get pedals to go with my X52, but I would run with chassis on pedals, torso on stick. This is the way I run it in Virtual World's Tesla 2 pods, and it feels more natural to me.

(Apologies if someone else brought this up, I haven't read the rest of the thread from the post I'm quoting down, I just had to pause to say this.)

[Drenar]

Oy of MidWorld, on 16 July 2012 - 05:55 PM, said:

Using a hotas with pedals feels very natural, at least in mechwarrior living legends. just use the pedals for turning the mech. the stick controls torso movement, x and y axis. That way, aiming is very smooth. You can stay on target in turning fights, as twisting the torso is automatically done while aiming. It just feels natural. And pulling the mech into a high speed turn using the rudder is actually fun and intuitive. I'll play MWO the same way.

Ah, so someone else did mention it, my bad.

[Drenar]

Rejarial Galatan, on 16 July 2012 - 09:22 PM, said:

What I think this all boils down to is: did you grow up playing computer games and using a joystick to do this? if yes, then, you are probably like me, in your 30's or older, and are pretty much wired to use a joystick. Did you grow up gaming on consoles like the PS2/3 or XBOX/360, yes that / is there to distinguish between the original and the 360, if you didnt know there WAS just an XBOX, then, wow, I just suddenly felt very old lol. ANYWAY, if you grew up on the newer consoles or PC games that did NOT need a mouse, then, you are more likely 20-25 at most, and are wired to use a mouse. Its a matter of age I think, and how we spent our youths.

heh

I'm 23 and prefer the joystick. I remember playing games before mouse control was added to shooters (Doom 1/2, Duke 3D, ROTT, etc.)

I do have a PS3 (and both the PS2 and PS1 before that) btu I tend to play different types of games on the console. For an FPS, absolutely go with keyboard and mouse. For a racing game, I prefer the DS3. For a flight sim, it's joystick, for a mech game, I want a Tesla II pod, but failing that, a HOTAS with rudder pedals will do fine.

[Rejarial Galatan]

I am just guessing at the age ranges here lol, i am sure, there are a lot of others who are your age who still remember the way it was