176 replies to this topic

[Yosharian]

The LCT-1E is an excellent mech.

The others are just average.

[Chados]

Darian DelFord, on 02 July 2016 - 08:41 PM, said:

You obviously never found the joy of 3 LPL's on the Catapult C1.....

I never thought of that! I'll have to give it a go.

Bush Hopper, on 02 July 2016 - 10:57 PM, said:

You know, people like you will still be fodder for lights. Why? You haven't played them. You have no idea how they work and when you named them "griefers" you showed that your situational awareness must be terrible.

Oh and btw, have you finally followed my advice and bought a seismic mod?

LOL, Bush. Yes, I use Seismic. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it doesn't. My SA is about average. It depends on the mech, oddly. I have an affinity for Catapults, and a 20+ year history with Marauders (Multiplayer Online Battletech) so I'm comfortable there. And I have played lights. I admit it: I suck in lights. So I stick to 55 tons and up...exception, Phoenix Hawk. After all, a woman's got to know her limitations.

Edited by Chados, 03 July 2016 - 03:39 AM.

[Yosharian]

Chados, on 03 July 2016 - 03:38 AM, said:

After all, a woman's got to know her limitations.

[FalconerGray]

I jumped on the Locust train after the rescale and I'm absolutely loving it. I was curious about the size and the effect of the megaquirks (I'm a longtime Clan loyalist, this is my first IS mech in about 2 years or so). I come and go from the game and hadn't really be interested for a few months, but this has been loads of fun. (I have been playing other mechs too, but the Locust has been the most enjoyable).

I have also noticed that many people just aren't aware of the capabilities these things have. Whether it's expectations of what's possible when being attacked by a Locust, or what a Locust can do for you as a teammate. I was in a conquest match on HPG that featured one guy complaining to no end about the lack of ability demonstrated by our team. In his defense, nearly everyone on our team was playing with extreme cowardice, taking theta and then camping out in the basement and being picked off one by one. Once I figured out that was the direction the game was going in, I headed off to focus on caps. Complainer then started calling me out for "not spotting" (lol) and then for cowardice when I was the last alive. I asked if he cared about winning the game or not, which he answered with a laugh and said that there was no chance I was going to win.....and then we reached 750. Ahh, puglife.

Sorry for the coolstorybros, but I enjoyed that moment. And I've had many other superb experiences in that little beast. It does anything I ask of it. I'm definitely a Locust convert.

[Chados]

Yosharian, on 03 July 2016 - 05:37 AM, said:

Hey, I love little kittens too!

LOL

[Trauglodyte]

Darian DelFord, on 02 July 2016 - 05:50 PM, said:

Curious?

Perceived speed is different than actual speed. In other words, there times where I thought that I could go where I wanted, how I wanted, whenever I wanted. The reality vs. perception battle often was one that I didn't win. That has been very apparent in my Firestarter. The old version, especially with the max engine, it felt like I had no control over my mech. It was too loose, the JJs had me all erratic when I used them, etc. It isn't until now that I feel good about driving it. The older, smaller model felt faster than it was and it handled differently, even though it didn't, because of the illusion of size and feel. With the size change, it feels more stable. But, that change has forced me to retool how I play from being a "burn into the fray, spray, pray, and get out" to becoming more of an ambush pilot and back line protector. It requires an entirely different mind set where you don't initiate anything because you're allowing the enemy to come to you. I know that I'm easier to hit so, to survive, I've got to dink and dunk NFL style. It is very much like driving an Atlas brawler on any of the frozen maps - you can want to get into the mix all day long but getting there to do it isn't going to be easy.

Btw, my reference to "Darian DelFording my way into being better" was a /salute to how you go to a spot on the map and you wait. You're like a trap door spider waiting for the blundering target to come into your area of power. You set yourself into positions of strength. More people should take those videos, break them down, and understand the why.

Darian DelFord, on 02 July 2016 - 05:50 PM, said:

The one advantage that the FS and Wolf hound have over the Jenner and the Raven is the ability to torso twist sooooo much better. The speed is the only thing that keeps lights alive. Without it we are smoldering slags of metal. If a Jenner is eating you alive then you are doing something wrong. Granted I do not know the context I am assuming locust vs Jenner... currently there really is not a contest unless you allow the Jenner to get a full burn on your CT. A locust 3M or 1e can CT a jenner in 3 alphas much quirker than the Jenner can... and lets face it... CT'ing a Jenner is not that tough

Take "...great Jenner pilot...." and replace it with "...great Jenner pilot and an amazing gunnery player..." Light vs Light always comes down to the better pilot/better gunner combination. Locusts are hard as Hell to kill but, if you can aim and routinely hit legs, you're going to do just fine. It is those players that eat me up. I've been torching bad Light pilots for years in my Cicadas, my X-5 being my favorite Light hunter. But, the great Light pilots still give me nightmares. Wispsy was one of the best and I hate that he no longer plays. I spent 4 years trying to battle and beat him and I never once did. Though, he had a lot of advantages over the years. He still was the better pilot.

Now, what I will say is that I've been chomping on a lot of Jenners lately. And, what I'm seeing is the same thing over and over again. The 275XL is going to get you killed. Accept it, down size your weapons or be more cognizant of your heat and remove some heat sinks. Do something, anything, but if you're not running at max speed, you're giving your opponent the ability to kill you faster and easier. Never be the first person in front, never be the only person up front, never go it alone against an enemy, and don't stick in the same area for too long. If you see more than one red diamond, get out. The game has changed to self preservation mode and we win more by attrition and less about trading a Light for an Assault. Lights are now in the business of eroding the enemy and forcing them into a state of unease.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 03 July 2016 - 07:05 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 08:28 PM, said:

I excuse you. But it did. Those VCRs on the ears? Yuge damage magnet. There's a giant salt thread on here about it. Those are gone now. And there was much rejoicing.

Oh, and Yeonne...primo job of Locust driving tonight on HPG. Nice work. I legged a Jenner up on the platform a couple minutes before you got me (I was the red PHX-1B) and he jumped off to get away from me and right into the sights of a Mauler with AC5s. LOL.

My heart was pounding there. Before the Jenner went down, I knew there was another PHX I had put into the deep red CT and that the Mauler and Kodiak were fairly fresh. The Kodiak made the mistake of staying on the edge of the top section, so I got him into deep orange in no time with no chance for him to return fire. The other PHX kept trying to poke me from outside his effective range, but scurried off before I could get serious damage back onto him. As I was running to go cap your base, you ambushed me. I thought you were the other PHX, and when you didn't go down to one CT shot I was like "wat, there's two?" After you went down, the other one showed up and also went down. Then the Mauler popped up on that large ramp where the Jenner spawns in TG, and I started to game my arm actuator advantage so he couldn't hit me. He dropped down to try and compensate, so I ran up to his legs and double legged him, remaining under his guns. I feel kind of dirty about the leg-humping since I don't usually do it, but I was playing for dat almighty "W" and the d-bag inside all of us took control. The Kodiak went for the base and was summarily booped; in all fairness there wasn't much he could've done at that point.

[Bishop Steiner]

Trauglodyte, on 03 July 2016 - 07:00 AM, said:

Perceived speed is different than actual speed. In other words, there times where I thought that I could go where I wanted, how I wanted, whenever I wanted. The reality vs. perception battle often was one that I didn't win. That has been very apparent in my Firestarter. The old version, especially with the max engine, it felt like I had no control over my mech. It was too loose, the JJs had me all erratic when I used them, etc. It isn't until now that I feel good about driving it. The older, smaller model felt faster than it was and it handled differently, even though it didn't, because of the illusion of size and feel. With the size change, it feels more stable. But, that change has forced me to retool how I play from being a "burn into the fray, spray, pray, and get out" to becoming more of an ambush pilot and back line protector. It requires an entirely different mind set where you don't initiate anything because you're allowing the enemy to come to you. I know that I'm easier to hit so, to survive, I've got to dink and dunk NFL style. It is very much like driving an Atlas brawler on any of the frozen maps - you can want to get into the mix all day long but getting there to do it isn't going to be easy.

Btw, my reference to "Darian DelFording my way into being better" was a /salute to how you go to a spot on the map and you wait. You're like a trap door spider waiting for the blundering target to come into your area of power. You set yourself into positions of strength. More people should take those videos, break them down, and understand the why.


Take "...great Jenner pilot...." and replace it with "...great Jenner pilot and an amazing gunnery player..." Light vs Light always comes down to the better pilot/better gunner combination. Locusts are hard as Hell to kill but, if you can aim and routinely hit legs, you're going to do just fine. It is those players that eat me up. I've been torching bad Light pilots for years in my Cicadas, my X-5 being my favorite Light hunter. But, the great Light pilots still give me nightmares. Wispsy was one of the best and I hate that he no longer plays. I spent 4 years trying to battle and beat him and I never once did. Though, he had a lot of advantages over the years. He still was the better pilot.

Now, what I will say is that I've been chomping on a lot of Jenners lately. And, what I'm seeing is the same thing over and over again. The 275XL is going to get you killed. Accept it, down size your weapons or be more cognizant of your heat and remove some heat sinks. Do something, anything, but if you're not running at max speed, you're giving your opponent the ability to kill you faster and easier. Never be the first person in front, never be the only person up front, never go it alone against an enemy, and don't stick in the same area for too long. If you see more than one red diamond, get out. The game has changed to self preservation mode and we win more by attrition and less about trading a Light for an Assault. Lights are now in the business of eroding the enemy and forcing them into a state of unease.

Best way to beat Wispy was with an AC20 packing YLW.

He still beat me more than I beat him, but I put more than a few Pontiac 100 rounds up his tail pipe (there were a few things he did that were predictable, which allowed a patient gunner to sometimes get in an easy shot at his back, if you survived his initial pass without panicking).

Had the guy as a teammate for over a year (taught me a lot about Light mechs..including that I prefer mediums!) and fought him when he went Lords, regularly. Insanely good Jenner (and then FS9 and ACH, etc pilot) and probably to this day still the best actual Jenny Jock I have fought. But not immortal. Even when he and Adiuvo were teamed together, I still managed to get him a couple times. Good memories. Hard fights. Harder at that time because I was running my HBK primarily, and so lost both the speed and the tankiness of the YLW, and so it was about positioning, patience, etc.

Good points about perception and reality, btw... there are a few mechs, the taller ones that I have that actually go faster than their shorter counterparts in my Mechbay (Grasshopper for example) and yet feel like they are moving so much slower because the higher cockpit perspective changes one's perceived speed.

Obviously agility is further impacted by Size Profiles, etc. But a 35 ton Jenner should be closer in movement and size to a 40 ton Cicada than to a 20 ton Locust (which may be a little too nimble)

[Trauglodyte]

Bishop Steiner, on 03 July 2016 - 07:16 AM, said:

Best way to beat Wispy was with an AC20 packing YLW.

He still beat me more than I beat him, but I put more than a few Pontiac 100 rounds up his tail pipe (there were a few things he did that were predictable, which allowed a patient gunner to sometimes get in an easy shot at his back, if you survived his initial pass without panicking).

Had the guy as a teammate for over a year (taught me a lot about Light mechs..including that I prefer mediums!) and fought him when he went Lords, regularly. Insanely good Jenner (and then FS9 and ACH, etc pilot) and probably to this day still the best actual Jenny Jock I have fought. But not immortal. Even when he and Adiuvo were teamed together, I still managed to get him a couple times. Good memories. Hard fights. Harder at that time because I was running my HBK primarily, and so lost both the speed and the tankiness of the YLW, and so it was about positioning, patience, etc.

Good points about perception and reality, btw... there are a few mechs, the taller ones that I have that actually go faster than their shorter counterparts in my Mechbay (Grasshopper for example) and yet feel like they are moving so much slower because the higher cockpit perspective changes one's perceived speed.

Obviously agility is further impacted by Size Profiles, etc. But a 35 ton Jenner should be closer in movement and size to a 40 ton Cicada than to a 20 ton Locust (which may be a little too nimble)

Wispsy used to just give me fits for years. Pre-release, it was me in the Cicada 2A and him in his Jenner F. Both had 6x Medium Lasers. BUT, he had the broken single JJ that equaled max JJs (oh, the horrors) which meant that he had more DHSs than me. Add in the fact that he was just that much better than me and it was bad, bad, and more bad. I got him every now and then but the old school Jenner vs Cicada was never a match in my favor.

Good days gone by... <sigh>

[Bishop Steiner]

Trauglodyte, on 03 July 2016 - 07:23 AM, said:

Wispsy used to just give me fits for years. Pre-release, it was me in the Cicada 2A and him in his Jenner F. Both had 6x Medium Lasers. BUT, he had the broken single JJ that equaled max JJs (oh, the horrors) which meant that he had more DHSs than me. Add in the fact that he was just that much better than me and it was bad, bad, and more bad. I got him every now and then but the old school Jenner vs Cicada was never a match in my favor.

Good days gone by... <sigh>

Yup. He was that good, JJs were that broken (still are, just not as bad) and the CDA was pretty much always inferior to the Jenny... thought the ECM one had it's place.... just not in a 1v1 duel with Wisp's Jenny.

I miss seeing guys like him on here, even though after Dv8, Lords, etc, he really did start to pick up some of the bad personality traits like Crunk and others. Darn shame. Cocky but fun loving Wispy was a heck of a lot more interesting than arrogant and Meta-Angry Wispy. :/

[East Indy]

After a few weeks' absence I came back to play my Ember for a couple matches, my Jenner D for a bunch of matches, then recently flipped to my Locust 1V.

Lower-third tonnage (up to 50) strikers require much more effort for consistent results, and now key 35-tonners have joined them. But it's the why that's important, if we can get past the what.

I think the re-scale has made it obvious how much undersize was masking the issue of alphas. Once you get past 30 points for lasers, 20ish points for FLD and 30-40 points for missiles, you either need to be 1) small, 2) able to trade from far away, 3) able to trade a few volleys directly, or 4) able to fire a more devastating alpha first. Lighter strikers don't do any of these things.

This would be a rare instance of foresighted cleverness on PGI's part, here, spotlighting a problem that has a conspicuous solution.

[Chados]

Yeonne Greene, on 03 July 2016 - 07:07 AM, said:

My heart was pounding there. Before the Jenner went down, I knew there was another PHX I had put into the deep red CT and that the Mauler and Kodiak were fairly fresh. The Kodiak made the mistake of staying on the edge of the top section, so I got him into deep orange in no time with no chance for him to return fire. The other PHX kept trying to poke me from outside his effective range, but scurried off before I could get serious damage back onto him. As I was running to go cap your base, you ambushed me. I thought you were the other PHX, and when you didn't go down to one CT shot I was like &quot;wat, there's two?&quot; After you went down, the other one showed up and also went down. Then the Mauler popped up on that large ramp where the Jenner spawns in TG, and I started to game my arm actuator advantage so he couldn't hit me. He dropped down to try and compensate, so I ran up to his legs and double legged him, remaining under his guns. I feel kind of dirty about the leg-humping since I don't usually do it, but I was playing for dat almighty &quot;W&quot; and the d-bag inside all of us took control. The Kodiak went for the base and was summarily booped; in all fairness there wasn't much he could've done at that point.

Yeah, right at the gate. That was me. I got one good hit in, then you two-stepped me and I missed an alpha-strike, overheated, and shut down and it was "good night nurse." Great piloting there, we all thought you did a tremendous job.

[Jables McBarty]

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 03:26 AM, said:

Ah. Another Jennerpologist, heading right to ad hominem attacks (calling me "ignorant," nice) because his or her griefer toy got righteously nerfed. Want a little pepper with that salt, my friend?

Just to clarify, I wasn't calling you ignorant, I was calling your argument ignorant. Because reducing an Oxide's alpha to 25 is only reducing it by 7 points from the standard viable build, which sounds to me like you don't know how big of an alpha an Oxide actually has. And particularly the argument that that you should hardlock ES and FF--doing so wouldn't affect 99% of IS light builds.

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 03:26 AM, said:

Look, I agree the J2C can be taken out. If you can hit one. Which now, you can. And it's nice to axe one with SSRMs even if we are limited to SSRM2 in the IS. But when they are behind you and nail you with that 72 point alpha, you're done. No 35 ton mech ought to be able to pack a 72-point alpha strike. Even the Butterbee, in full-on splat configuration with all hardpoints accounted for, is running at just under 71. And it's 30 tons heavier, with no significant offensive quirks. A1 Cats packing 6xASRM6 are at 75.6 and are maxed out as well. In what universe does it make even the remotest amount of sense that a bug-sized mech moving at highway speed can haul that kind of firepower? And any Jenner can get behind you faster than a standard-engine SRM Catapult can turn to keep up. I run 15 armor in rear torsos, typically. I can survive a reasonable ambush by your usual Locust or Raven. But life getting pounded by 72 points of SRMs in the back and rear side, in a mech that's all torso anyway, is, as Thomas Hobbes said, nasty, brutish, and short even if your mech is fresh. And you assume a fresh mech. You get hit once or twice, then some nimrod in a tiny Jenner gets behind you and stays there, it soaks the fun out of the game like a sponge because you're insta-dead and you can do precisely zip about it. It is worse than getting ranged by some drooling neckbeard in a Dire Wolf with gauss rifles and Clan ERLL from 1500 meters away. At least against a sniper you can duck behind cover and wait him out, or if you get lucky and get an indirect lock, lurm him a little and make him hide.

This is just boilerplate fatty qq. They are not the same--try managing heat on a 6x6 JR-IIC. It's a completely different beast from your Cat.

Next.

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 03:26 AM, said:

I'd love to drop the XL and add CASE gear. A 65 tonner hasn't got the tonnage if you want to bring any weapons or ammo for missiles-even SRMs need ammo. On standard engine heavies or assaults I do try to bring it, and I as a rule don't run XLs on the Zeus though you have to on Victors, and those are my two assault chassis. On XL heavies, why bother? You're dead from any shot-through torso anyway. When we get the LFE, if we ever do, I'll certainly be trying to upgrade for CASE equipment.

...and yet, clearly you understand what it is like to have to work with limited tonnage to eke the most out of a chassis. So I am wondering why you are calling for additional restrictions on how other chassis should be built out?

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 03:26 AM, said:

I don't think your Oxide build necessarily is unreasonable. I do think that the Oxide's durability quirks are unreasonable. Jenners shouldn't tank like a Cataphract. I thought giving it a "tiny" movement archetype when it puts out the firepower of a stock Marauder 3R at waaaay more speed was ridiculous, and moving it up to "small" was a good idea. And I thought its size also was unreasonably small. The size and movement problems have been addressed and at least you stand a chance of hitting one now. Part of the problem now, in all seriousness, is that Jenner hitboxes were borked from Day One and the larger size means that you can CT most Jenners from all aspects. And the resize has IS Jenners paying for the power-creep sins of their Clanner brethren.

Ah. So it's the Oxide's durability quirks that has you all worked up. That is a topic worthy of debate. But locking FF or ES, restricting tube counts or alphas on the Oxide won't change its durability.

Chados, on 02 July 2016 - 03:26 AM, said:

I don't mind the Locust buffs. I've said it before. Let 'em be tiny and fast. They're one-shot death traps that can't kill you in a single alpha strike. With them, it's the death of a thousand cuts. If I have any teammates anywhere close I can live long enough to get a bug-zapper on my side assuming he doesn't hurt me worse than the Locust trying to get him off me. But that tradeoff, I can live with. Even if they get behind you and stay there, they have to orbit for awhile to do hardcore damage unless you're already cored. Sooner or later I'm gonna get turned into him just enough to get an SSRM lock and then it's good night, nurse. You fix a Jenner so it's just an annoying little pest instead of an overpowered 55-tonner masquerading as a light, then I won't complain if it's made small again.

I'm in the "the re-scale was a good idea" camp, but I am also in favor of an additional quirk pass--across all chassis--to address performance post-rescale. But I have to take exception to your final sentence. Some 'mechs punch above their weight, and should.

Bush Hopper, on 02 July 2016 - 10:57 PM, said:

You know, people like you will still be fodder for lights. Why? You haven't played them. You have no idea how they work and when you named them "griefers" you showed that your situational awareness must be terrible.

Oh and btw, have you finally followed my advice and bought a seismic mod?

Isn't that the truth? I love how any light that happens to be viable is only piloted by "griefers" because all the "real pilots" are facing each other like good soldiers trading blows in a manly way.

[Darian DelFord]

Jables McBarty, on 05 July 2016 - 02:06 PM, said:

Isn't that the truth? I love how any light that happens to be viable is only piloted by "griefers" because all the "real pilots" are facing each other like good soldiers trading blows in a manly way.

This is the majority of assault and heavy pilots that come to the forums because a light touched them wrong.

[Darian DelFord]

Source Mystic, on 05 July 2016 - 04:35 PM, said:

If you have not bought a locust wait and see what pgi does are they going to nerf it into the ground because of complaints or are they actually going to just leave it alone and try to rebalance some lights. If they nerf it there is no reason to play locust any more nor will there be any reason to play lights at all because the complaints will just roll to the next best light the fact that people are complaining about the locust is absurd. It is the weakest mech in the game. The only thing more absurd is if pgi listens to this bs and nerfs it. If that happens I may just look for another game.

Unless some significant changes comes to lights.... as well as the game over all in the next 6 months, i will be posting my farewell thoughts.