59 replies to this topic

[zagibu]

Lily from animove, on 30 June 2016 - 01:16 AM, said:

given that every kill also includes someone gettign killed the average K/D must eb 1

These are median values, not mean. If a player kills 5 others, doesn't die, and 5 players kill only 1 other and die 2 times, the median K/D is 0.5.

Edited by zagibu, 02 July 2016 - 01:34 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

DAYLEET, on 30 June 2016 - 12:01 PM, said:

That doesnt even make sense. How could the average be 2 lol

Where did i say the average should be 2?

I said a k/d below 2 is poor. And i'm in the same boat, i'll be struggling just keep the k/d at 1 or above in the quickplay leaderboards.

Edited by Eth3real, 12 July 2016 - 11:58 AM.

[Sjorpha]

Eth3real, on 30 June 2016 - 10:56 AM, said:

That average is actually pretty damn bad.

Imo K/D below 2 in this game is pretty damn poor.

It's impossible to have an average K/D of above 1.

Let's say everyone in the game was as good as Proton, average K/D would still be below 1.

[Tarogato]

Sjorpha, on 12 July 2016 - 12:01 PM, said:

It's impossible to have an average K/D of above 1.

Let's say everyone in the game was as good as Proton, average K/D would still be below 1.

I think what he's really trying to say is that most of the people with KDR below 2.0 in this game are hilariously bad. Even if they are still within the top 8% of players. There's something to be said for the combination of a very high skill ceiling and this game attracting a lot of people who are bad at video games to begin with.

[LordKnightFandragon]

So that means im above the average then? nice.

Its also very sad that the "average" is way the hell below 1 KDR....means that many players cant even manage to kill 1 for every death.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 12 July 2016 - 12:21 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Tarogato, on 12 July 2016 - 12:08 PM, said:

I think what he's really trying to say is that most of the people with KDR below 2.0 in this game are hilariously bad. Even if they are still within the top 8% of players. There's something to be said for the combination of a very high skill ceiling and this game attracting a lot of people who are bad at video games to begin with.

Can't help but wonder what his K.D.R would be if he wasn't dropping with all those terrible people

[meteorol]

Tarogato, on 12 July 2016 - 12:08 PM, said:

I think what he's really trying to say is that most of the people with KDR below 2.0 in this game are hilariously bad. Even if they are still within the top 8% of players. There's something to be said for the combination of a very high skill ceiling and this game attracting a lot of people who are bad at video games to begin with.

Very high skill ceiling? MWO?

[Oatbag03]

I didn't realize getting the kill was the ultimate judge of who is the most skilled. I guess that explains why everyone runs in front of each other to shoot mechs that are pretty much dead - blocking shots etc. to get those sweet sweet kills and up that KDR.

Funny enough, my best KDR is on my most worthless mech - a LRM spamming HBK-IIC-B. Can get credit for kills with those LRMs like nobody's business. Too bad for the dudes who are up front doing the work.

Edited by Oatbag03, 12 July 2016 - 01:05 PM.

[Spr1ggan]

Cathy, on 12 July 2016 - 12:31 PM, said:

Can't help but wonder what his K.D.R would be if he wasn't dropping with all those terrible people

My K/D is terrible, on the leaderboards anyway. If i hadn't been carried by my team so much to this point then my account stats page would be much much lower than it is.

What i'm saying is that most of us in this game are really bad, especially compared to the average player in most other shooters.

Edited by Eth3real, 12 July 2016 - 01:11 PM.

[Moonlight Grimoire]

K/D isn't the end all be all. Kills mean you got the death blow, doesn't have anything to do with actually playing well, someone can wildly be spraying lasers over a compromised mech and get a kill after someone else bored out their CT. The real show of skill are players (and we have no way to use data to show this) are those who Efficiently kill an enemy.

To me seeing a W/L of 1.0 is a good thing, means the match maker is actually doing it's job right as much as confirmation bias says otherwise. A K/D ratio of .80 is, to me, actually surprisingly good. Why? Because obviously really good and really bad players are extremes and should be the exception and not par. Seeing a KDR of .8 just means that we have a lot of people who are likely not getting kills before dying but the W/L shows that their death and damage dealt is actually meaningful. To say a KDR under 2.0 is shameful is silly, a KDR over 1 is doing good, over 2.0 means you are not placed where your peers are equal to you. Honestly mean damage per game is more important to me as is mean kill assists. There are a lot of different ways one can contribute to victory besides a kill, judging players specifically on ability get the killing blow is obviously flawed on a game that isn't 1v1.

[Deathlike]

Eth3real, on 12 July 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

My K/D is terrible, on the leaderboards anyway. If i hadn't been carried by my team so much to this point then my account stats page would be much much lower than it is.

What i'm saying is that most of us in this game are really bad, especially compared to the average player in most other shooters.

Well, I shouldn't agree with this ideally, but it's true.

I remember when I was much worse than I am now (I'm still a scrub ) and I remember having a terribad sub 1 k-d ratio. Those were sad days.

Nowadays, my k-d ratio is like .3 more than I used to have a year or two ago, but maybe I prefer to be a glutton for punishment running Lights.

Whatever I guess.

[LordNothing]

my wl is around 0.99. game does a really good job of keeping that value as close to 1 as possible, so that is what psr is aiming for. im not sure if this is a good target to aim for though, id rather have a hard fought loss than a stomp victory any day. a hard fought victory would be better though.

now my kd is only 0.61 its utterly terrible but still i managed to make it to teir 2. it doesnt feel like this in game though, seems i get kills a lot more than this though, so i figure its counting a lot of older games around the time i started playing. if i go to my archived stats, its 0.48, however there are less than 20 games on that chart, so i must have just started playing before they archived the stats. id like to see what my stats would be with periodic resets. i have 6636 games on my chart, still being weighted down by my 20th game.

[H I A S]

LordNothing, on 12 July 2016 - 09:37 PM, said:

my wl is around 0.99. game does a really good job of keeping that value as close to 1 as possible, so that is what psr is aiming for.

That only means that you dont gimp your too often.

[LordNothing]

at least i dont words out of my sentance.

i do admit im usually a very aggressive player. sometimes to the point of insanity (my therapist says im psycho). most of the time my aggression pays off for the team, opening up a flank or at least distracting the enemy while they get camped to death from mechs hiding behind rocks. once i pick a target i think i can stomp to the curb, i commit and go in and most of the time it dies, and if i die, it usually helps the team. somone gets a killing blow and i get an assist and a kmdd. this is fun. i dont know what people who hide behind rocks get out of this game.

Edited by LordNothing, 12 July 2016 - 09:56 PM.

[meteorol]

Eth3real, on 12 July 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

My K/D is terrible, on the leaderboards anyway. If i hadn't been carried by my team so much to this point then my account stats page would be much much lower than it is.

i really can't tell if you are being serious here.

Eth3real, on 12 July 2016 - 01:06 PM, said:

What i'm saying is that most of us in this game are really bad, especially compared to the average player in most other shooters.

I can second that. I'd imagine a big part of MWOs "upper third" part of the playerbase wouldn't even make it out of silver ranks in CS:GO.

Edited by meteorol, 12 July 2016 - 11:03 PM.

[Spr1ggan]

meteorol, on 12 July 2016 - 11:01 PM, said:

i really can't tell if you are being serious here.



I can second that. I'd imagine a big part of MWOs "upper third" part of the playerbase wouldn't even make it out of silver ranks in CS:GO.

Yes and no. My current K/D might be considered decent but it's not close to the top players so i consider it bad. As for the carried bit i just say that to get it outta the way cos someone is gonna say it anyway. Regardless of whether it's true or not.

Your CS comment is on the mark. I can't hit the broadside of a barn in CSGO but i'm probably one of the most accurate shots in MWO and get accused of aimbotting etc. Then again i have 1000's of hours in MWO compared to 17 in CS.

[XX Sulla XX]

Moonlight Grimoire, on 12 July 2016 - 01:45 PM, said:

K/D isn't the end all be all. Kills mean you got the death blow, doesn't have anything to do with actually playing well, someone can wildly be spraying lasers over a compromised mech and get a kill after someone else bored out their CT. The real show of skill are players (and we have no way to use data to show this) are those who Efficiently kill an enemy.

To me seeing a W/L of 1.0 is a good thing, means the match maker is actually doing it's job right as much as confirmation bias says otherwise. A K/D ratio of .80 is, to me, actually surprisingly good. Why? Because obviously really good and really bad players are extremes and should be the exception and not par. Seeing a KDR of .8 just means that we have a lot of people who are likely not getting kills before dying but the W/L shows that their death and damage dealt is actually meaningful. To say a KDR under 2.0 is shameful is silly, a KDR over 1 is doing good, over 2.0 means you are not placed where your peers are equal to you. Honestly mean damage per game is more important to me as is mean kill assists. There are a lot of different ways one can contribute to victory besides a kill, judging players specifically on ability get the killing blow is obviously flawed on a game that isn't 1v1.

All the decent players will have KDR that is around 2.0 and up. And I am talking about tier 1 players playing other higher ranked players not smurf accounts killing new players. They will also all have good average damage. And they will be doing the other things needed to win. Granted tier one and the way group play works means a wide range of skill are facing each other. But generally there are not very many decent groups playing at any given time. And even less so now with so many doing the tournament.

And its not that they are great compared to other games its just the average on this game is really low.

[Lily from animove]

zagibu, on 01 July 2016 - 01:50 AM, said:

These are median values, not mean. If a player kills 5 others, doesn't die, and 5 players kill only 1 other and die 2 times, the median K/D is 0.5.

and how did those 2x death on those 5 palyers occured? these will also go onto someone elses killcoutn unless they are dropship/turret suicide or teamkills.

because in your case,

the one guy has a K/D of 5
the other 5 have a K/D of

0.5
0.5
0.5
0.5
0.5

So this would mostlikely mean a lot people are missing here who has gotten kills, or soemone truly took a emdian, but that is the most supid way to get the "AVERAGE" K/D.
but the title talsk about AVERAGE, and when it comes to that, AVERAGE =/= MEDIAN. because they are both defined values of how to be aquired.

Eth3real, on 13 July 2016 - 12:44 AM, said:

Yes and no. My current K/D might be considered decent but it's not close to the top players so i consider it bad. As for the carried bit i just say that to get it outta the way cos someone is gonna say it anyway. Regardless of whether it's true or not.

Your CS comment is on the mark. I can't hit the broadside of a barn in CSGO but i'm probably one of the most accurate shots in MWO and get accused of aimbotting etc. Then again i have 1000's of hours in MWO compared to 17 in CS.

yeah funny isn't it, the mechs are large enough to actually make a lot people with fishy medicore aimin (like I am myself) aim be "good" at aiming in MWO, thats why I always find it strange when people talk about how some mechs or sections are hard to hit (take the rescaled NVA). because compared to CS levels of targetsize those sections are still HUGE. Which then surely means people having issues hitting them are just REALLY BAD at aiming.

Edited by Lily from animove, 13 July 2016 - 01:34 AM.

[Spr1ggan]

Lily from animove, on 13 July 2016 - 01:25 AM, said:

and how did those 2x death on those 5 palyers occured? these will also go onto someone elses killcoutn unless they are dropship/turret suicide or teamkills.

because in your case,

the one guy has a K/D of 5
the other 5 have a K/D of

0.5
0.5
0.5
0.5
0.5

So this would mostlikely mean a lot people are missing here who has gotten kills, or soemone truly took a emdian, but that is the most supid way to get the "AVERAGE" K/D.
but the title talsk about AVERAGE, and when it comes to that, AVERAGE =/= MEDIAN. because they are both defined values of how to be aquired.




yeah funny isn't it, the mechs are large enough to actually make a lot people with fishy medicore aimin (like I am myself) aim be "good" at aiming in MWO, thats why I always find it strange when people talk about how some mechs or sections are hard to hit (take the rescaled NVA). because compared to CS levels of targetsize those sections are still HUGE. Which then surely means people having issues hitting them are just REALLY BAD at aiming.

I put it down to the skill level required to be good at CS. I have had good accuracy in most shooters i've played and have great accuracy in Overwatch currently. CS is on another level though and i can't get the knack of the counter strafing to straighten aim up etc.

The other issue is that i haven't played CS much so i don't know which angles or positions to hold and whre people are gonna peek from. Whereas in MWO with so much time played you pretty much know where players will peek and can pre-fire them accurately.

Edited by Eth3real, 13 July 2016 - 02:03 AM.

[meteorol]

Eth3real, on 13 July 2016 - 12:44 AM, said:

Yes and no. My current K/D might be considered decent but it's not close to the top players so i consider it bad. As for the carried bit i just say that to get it outta the way cos someone is gonna say it anyway. Regardless of whether it's true or not.

Dunno, from what the leaderboards tell you got a 3.75 K/D on a 1.81 W/L over 20 matches. Which indicates you probably played solo matches. Many "top" players with a significantly higher leaderboard k/d also have a w/l that clearly shows they have been rolling the group queue which heavily inflates k/d. I'll just go ahead and mention kaffeeangst as exception because if i won't he will fling around his stats the moment he reads this post anyway. The other exceptions probably don't care what others think about their k/d, so i'll leave it at that. IMO, comparing leaderboards and profile stats even between top comp players is kind of pointless without knowing what the ratio for solo/group drops for each player is. That aside, it really somewhat comes down to who you compare yourself to. If you only measure yourself against the very few "top of the top" players, it's pretty hard to have anything but a bad k/d.

In the end, i don't think you got a HoL invite for being dogsh*t at this game.