15 replies to this topic

[Nightmare1]

...If you aren't going to cooperate with the team and make a real effort to win an Invasion Match, then please don't bother playing Invasion. Seriously. I just got out of a drop and only about two of the seven pugs on our team even bothered to use VOIP. Nobody helped to call targets or warn of enemy maneuvers. Nobody bothered to communicate anything at all except insults at the end of the match. It was a crushing defeat due to poor communication and an antagonistic defiance from the pugs that refused to work with the group. Yet, at the end of the match, all the pugs wanted to make the 5-man group the scapegoat.

So, please, if you're going to fight like pugs, then stay in the pugging queue. The groups would really prefer you did that instead of ruining our Invasion drops.

Thanks!

[Pat Kell]

One of the hardest things in CW is getting non-TS/voip using players to follow a general battleplan. I find that the only way to accomplish it is to make sure you are the first ones in and make sure things go well on the first push. If you can show them that you know what you are doing, the tend to get with the program much faster. And being nice helps too. If they refuse to follow orders, say "that's fine, this is what we are going to do and if you want to try something else, go for it, we will try to support it with our maneuvers." If they ignore you, just state the battleplan, get as many to follow as possible and hope for the best. If things fall apart and you lose, try not to blame anyone, just say good try guys and move on.

This all sounds real simple and easy to speak about but even I fail at this sometimes when confronted with some of the just down right silly self-destructive things that some people do.

[justcallme A S H]

You got the self-destructive part down right. Some people, no logic behind decisions...

But yeah what Pat said is pretty much the only way to do it. Get a group of the willing, proceed with the plan. I've even seen some people in the top 50 on the leaderboard not follow the program because they are purely selfish and only interested in KMDD - Just not a lot you can do in that instance but play on really.

[xX PUG Xx]

Nightmare1, on 06 July 2016 - 04:56 PM, said:

So, please, if you're going to fight like pugs...

Thanks

*ahem* Unless their wearing a kilt, holding a glass of whiskey in one hand and a bacon sandwich in the other* there is no way they are fighting like me

(*need to use my toes on the keyboard and chin/nose for the mouse )

But in all seriousness (wait this is a game, shouldn't be taken TOO seriously) if you drop as a solo and there is a group in the match with you, then it is usually a good idea to listen to them. IF they sctually communicate with you, I have came across many groups that are as silent as a graveyard at midnight.

The best you can do there is keep an eye on the mini-map, move where they move, shoot what they shoot (ste... er, secure the kills) and hope they have half a clue.

[Willard Phule]

Hilarious topic. Seriously.

It's not the solos you've got a problem with....there are lots of competent solos out there that can watch the battle and follow the herd without too much instruction.

The problem you've got has to do with absolutely no matchmaking whatsoever. When you get 7 new guys in trial mechs, you've lost. Well, unless the other side has as many incompetents as you do.

Shame nothing can be done about that.

[Good_Cat]

Even though i'm part of a Clan, if i drop solo and end up with another group, its easy enough to VOIP / Chat "Drop lead i'll follow you, i'll join X lance and follow".
Had a great match with NTEX 10man drop all i had to do was join in "I'll join Charlie lance and follow".

Smaller Lance size group might need to take more of an active role in corraling people but even then spotting a Lance Group and asking if their gonna drop call.

As a solo drop its just a matter of trying to contribute and not being ******* (LRM'ing in the rear with everyone muted).

[midwestnomad]

Ok, so here's the deal. It could have very well been me that Nightmare1 is talking about. I was on around that time and had some choice words at the end of the match for the guys I dropped with. I'm a new player (about 2 months) and I finally have a drop deck worth of mastered mechs. I figured that I would give CW a try(my first couple of days playing I did try dropping with all trial mechs. It was horrific). By the end of the third match I was done taking this "you're the reason we're losing" crap. At the beginning of each match and through out the match I would clearly state that I'm new to this and to give me some direction as to what's going on or where I should be and what to do. In each of the three drops no one took command (although there was at times some back and fourth of "you call", "no you call the match") and at the end of each match the pugs got blamed. In the third and final match, the message (that I confirmed by asking twice, and then reaffirming again after the first two waves failed) was that we needed to push hard. I pushed harder than a scene from an adult movie and the result was that I, along with maybe 2 others got annihilated at the front while our team then trickled in one at a time to effectively do nothing.

At the end there were a couple messages in the chat blaming the pugs for the loss. Being that I'm still new to the game I didn't catch who were the ones not following the team, but from my point of view it was more than the 4-6 pugs that were in the match.

If this was you Nightmare1 my apologies. If this is happening in your matches I suggest that you call the match even if you have no experience because more than likely there is a new player with a lot less experience that needs direction on what is happening.

P.s. thanks Pat Kells and xX PUG Xx for your comments.
Good luck everyone and Have fun

[Palfatreos]

xX PUG Xx, on 06 July 2016 - 10:55 PM, said:

*ahem* Unless their wearing a kilt, holding a glass of whiskey in one hand and a bacon sandwich in the other* there is no way they are fighting like me

(*need to use my toes on the keyboard and chin/nose for the mouse )

omg teach how to do that (evrything beside the kilt part i refuse to wear that).

Edited by Palfatreos, 07 July 2016 - 11:25 AM.

[Pat Kell]

Dropping solo in CW is 2 things for me.

1. A self inflicted form of torture and punishment designed to keep me thankful for all my KCom buddies that I get to drop with. Nearly every time I do this, the matches are a struggle and incredibly frustrating unless I manage to pull some sort of organizing team.

2. It helps remind me that CW is not designed for solo players who are feint of heart and aren't willing to push with the team. In order to win CW frequently, people must be able to group up, push through a narrow gate all together and maintain fire on any enemy present (I see a lot of players just run in without shooting at all and wonder how they get burned down so quick). People who are afraid to get their paint scratched or think that they serve the team more by providing cover fire are a detriment to your team. Nearly every match that I play solo have players that do this. I try to get some organization going, I manage to herd us all to the same gate and almost without fail, 2-6 players will absolutely not go in the gate or push more than within 100 meters of the rear line of your main force.

Midwest, it's people like you who KCom looks to recruit. People who are willing to follow a call to push through a gate, even in the face of what seems like overwhelming fire power. There are some incredibly good players out there that I wouldn't vote to allow into KCom because they are so good that they won't push with a team, they will just sit at long range and snipe away 3K+ damage. This may be fun for them and they are good enough to help carry their team to victory quite often but in the grand scheme of things, when they fight good organized teams, they lose because they are unwilling to get their paint scratched and are essentially using their team mates as meat shields. This is basically just like being that 1 aggravating PUG in your 11 man group that brings a light or medium sniping mech to the first wave despite you asking them not to and after 2 waves of dead mechs you realize that you have 22 mechs dead and are wondering "what the heck" you hit your tab key and sure enough, that guy has been sitting up high somewhere for 2 full waves thinking that he was doing something effective by spitting out a wee bit of damage and maybe distracting a mech or two. In fact all he has done is rob his whole team of the armor he has that would have allowed ALL of them the potential of living just a little bit longer...maybe getting out 1-2 more alphas. When combined, those alphas will almost always add up to more than any amount of sniping or LRM damage that one solo player could have mustered.

Edited by Pat Kell, 07 July 2016 - 11:50 AM.

[justcallme A S H]

Where is Medved when you need him...

[Appogee]

It's frustrating, isn't it?

You can get 8-10 guys working well together to try and win, but 2-4 derping around becomes an impossible burden to carry.

I remember a match not long ago where we were ahead by 1 Mech just prior to the match finishing, and we told everyone to just take cover and stay alive (VOIP and chat) and this idiot PUG just ran straight into the enemy guns, levelled the kill count, and we lost by default.

Super frustrating to have a half hour game thrown away like that.

[xX PUG Xx]

Quote

P.s. thanks Pat Kells and xX PUG Xx for your comments.
Good luck everyone and Have fun

You're welcome and apologies for the lack of coordination this afternoon; 5 hours of sleep and a house full of screaming weans does not allow for great playing/drop calling. At least we gave them a bit of a fight

Quote

omg teach how to do that (evrything beside the kilt part i refuse to wear that).

But the kilt completes the "look" *pffft*

[Nightmare1]

Sorry guys, I don't mean to not participate on my own thread, I just haven't had a chance to post today, lol.

xX PUG Xx, on 06 July 2016 - 10:55 PM, said:

*ahem* Unless their wearing a kilt, holding a glass of whiskey in one hand and a bacon sandwich in the other* there is no way they are fighting like me

(*need to use my toes on the keyboard and chin/nose for the mouse )

That's got to be the best reply yet!

Willard Phule, on 07 July 2016 - 02:04 AM, said:

Hilarious topic. Seriously.

It's not the solos you've got a problem with....there are lots of competent solos out there that can watch the battle and follow the herd without too much instruction.

The problem you've got has to do with absolutely no matchmaking whatsoever. When you get 7 new guys in trial mechs, you've lost. Well, unless the other side has as many incompetents as you do.

Shame nothing can be done about that.

Actually, my frustration is more with the solo pilots than it is with new players. Most of the pug pilots that have been grouped into my team have Unit tags, and some of them are recognizable names. As a result, I have high expectations. The reality is far different though; I find that the newer players tend to actually be more cooperative while the solo pugs with Unit tags who should know better tend to be more caustic and disagreeable. The "me first!" mentality is very prevalent among these kinds of pilots, I'm afraid.

midwestnomad, on 07 July 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

Ok, so here's the deal. It could have very well been me that Nightmare1 is talking about. I was on around that time and had some choice words at the end of the match for the guys I dropped with. I'm a new player (about 2 months) and I finally have a drop deck worth of mastered mechs. I figured that I would give CW a try(my first couple of days playing I did try dropping with all trial mechs. It was horrific). By the end of the third match I was done taking this "you're the reason we're losing" crap. At the beginning of each match and through out the match I would clearly state that I'm new to this and to give me some direction as to what's going on or where I should be and what to do. In each of the three drops no one took command (although there was at times some back and fourth of "you call", "no you call the match") and at the end of each match the pugs got blamed. In the third and final match, the message (that I confirmed by asking twice, and then reaffirming again after the first two waves failed) was that we needed to push hard. I pushed harder than a scene from an adult movie and the result was that I, along with maybe 2 others got annihilated at the front while our team then trickled in one at a time to effectively do nothing.

At the end there were a couple messages in the chat blaming the pugs for the loss. Being that I'm still new to the game I didn't catch who were the ones not following the team, but from my point of view it was more than the 4-6 pugs that were in the match.

If this was you Nightmare1 my apologies. If this is happening in your matches I suggest that you call the match even if you have no experience because more than likely there is a new player with a lot less experience that needs direction on what is happening.

P.s. thanks Pat Kells and xX PUG Xx for your comments.
Good luck everyone and Have fun

To be honest, I don't think we dropped together since all my matches the other night were "Defend Omega!" during CounterAttacks. The one match that I was referencing as an arbitrary example was also a defensive battle, so we weren't pushing so much as getting pushed. We were defending Omega during a CounterAttack with my 5-man, a 3-man, and four pugs (only one had no Unit Tag). Against us was an MS 6-man and a mixed bag of 2-mans and pugs. The teams were reasonably even in terms of potential. However, we got steamrolled because of the pug behavior. The four pugs on my team pretty much gave us the finger when I asked them to cooperate with us. The pugs on Red Team coordinated very closely with MS. The 3-man on my team coordinated within itself very well, but didn't make any effort to work with my 5-man.

As a result, the match went like this: 3-man pushes on its own without regard for the game mode or team coordination and gets wiped out. My 5-man bears the brunt of the Red Team onslaught, desperately holding them at bay for as long as we can. The four pugs hid on the flanks and sniped constantly, racking up high damage but never really doing anything since their damage was badly spread across enemy Mech components and unfocused with respect to targets that were being called. After Red Team would finally grind through my 5-man, half of them would be the walking dead, so then our fresh pugs would basically mop up the crippled, then get demolished by the other half that was fresh. After two waves of this, Red Team opened up enough of a lead that we would never be able to recover.

The frustrating thing was, had either our 3-man or all four pugs cooperated, it would have been a very close match! Had both groups cooperated, it probably would have been a win for us. Instead, it wound up a bad loss. Then the pugs started harassing our 5-man for not carrying hard enough, lol.

That's the kind of stuff I'm talking about here. I don't mind new players getting their feet wet and learning some tough lessons about CW; that's just part of gaming. What I can't stand are the prima donnas that deliberately refuse to cooperate, insult you for trying to cooperate, and then insult you and blame you for the team's loss. That's solo queue pug behavior and, I say, keep it in the solo queue.

[Pat Kell]

Nightmare1, on 07 July 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

Then the pugs started harassing our 5-man for not carrying hard enough, lol.

Yea, I've had more than one person call me a noob or an idiot or whatever else you can think of when I lay a battle plan out, they all agree to it and only about half follow through with it. Yet somehow it's my fault for not recognizing the fact that 4-6 people weren't really planning on following through with the plan and just wanted to sit back and farm damage at our expense. I hate cowards btw.

Edited by Pat Kell, 07 July 2016 - 06:57 PM.

[Nightmare1]

Pat Kell, on 07 July 2016 - 06:57 PM, said:

Yea, I've had more than one person call me a noob or an idiot or whatever else you can think of when I lay a battle plan out, they all agree to it and only about half follow through with it. Yet somehow it's my fault for not recognizing the fact that 4-6 people weren't really planning on following through with the plan and just wanted to sit back and farm damage at our expense. I hate cowards btw.

Yep.

[Jables McBarty]

xX PUG Xx, on 06 July 2016 - 10:55 PM, said:

But in all seriousness (wait this is a game, shouldn't be taken TOO seriously) if you drop as a solo and there is a group in the match with you, then it is usually a good idea to listen to them. IF they sctually communicate with you, I have came across many groups that are as silent as a graveyard at midnight.

I've had this problem before--group of 6 or 8 in a TS and don't really communicate anything to the PUGs or smaller groups on the team.

midwestnomad, on 07 July 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

Ok, so here's the deal. It could have very well been me that Nightmare1 is talking about. I was on around that time and had some choice words at the end of the match for the guys I dropped with. I'm a new player (about 2 months) and I finally have a drop deck worth of mastered mechs. I figured that I would give CW a try(my first couple of days playing I did try dropping with all trial mechs. It was horrific). By the end of the third match I was done taking this "you're the reason we're losing" crap. At the beginning of each match and through out the match I would clearly state that I'm new to this and to give me some direction as to what's going on or where I should be and what to do. In each of the three drops no one took command (although there was at times some back and fourth of "you call", "no you call the match") and at the end of each match the pugs got blamed. In the third and final match, the message (that I confirmed by asking twice, and then reaffirming again after the first two waves failed) was that we needed to push hard. I pushed harder than a scene from an adult movie and the result was that I, along with maybe 2 others got annihilated at the front while our team then trickled in one at a time to effectively do nothing.

At the end there were a couple messages in the chat blaming the pugs for the loss. Being that I'm still new to the game I didn't catch who were the ones not following the team, but from my point of view it was more than the 4-6 pugs that were in the match.

If this was you Nightmare1 my apologies. If this is happening in your matches I suggest that you call the match even if you have no experience because more than likely there is a new player with a lot less experience that needs direction on what is happening.

P.s. thanks Pat Kells and xX PUG Xx for your comments.
Good luck everyone and Have fun

I've also had this problem before, and it's especially virulent during these FW events, which is sadly when most new players are introduced to the mode (as was I back in December). You get teams where 10 of 12 are new to the game mode and have no idea what to do. So nobody wants to call, and if someone does step up, it's just guesswork, and when they're wrong the salt and rage flow.