7 replies to this topic

[Nightmare1]

Hey everyone, just a quick question here. I dusted off my CN9-A(C) and am running it with 3xSRM4s + Artemis, 2xMPLs, and a Standard 275. It's a fun zombie Mech, but I started having issues with weapon crits on it lately. This week, it seems that as soon as my LT opens, all of my SRMs get critted instantly. The amount of damage dealt to the torso doesn't seem to matter either; it can be mildly yellow or become deep red. The problem is, the instant one of them is critted, all three of them become critted. I don't have this issue on any of my other Mechs.

If my CT and LT are open at the same time, then it's possible for all five weapon systems to be simultaneously critted. It's really weird. I'm used to having system critted and have been playing long enough to know how crits work. The only time I've ever seen something like this, though, was back when the HBK-GI had that RT autocannon bug that also resulted in insta-crit to everything housed in it. Is anyone else experiencing this problem?

[Jackal Noble]

If Gaining made the CN-9, crits would be a non issue


*Gaijin
wow I hate my cell phone auto correct. Went on a weird Gaijin spree on the forums this morning. meh

Edited by JackalBeast, 09 July 2016 - 03:39 PM.

[Thorqemada]

Have you Ammo there?

How many Weapons hit you?

Itt a Medium with little structure for a big target...Alphas are big out there...

Edited by Thorqemada, 09 July 2016 - 11:00 AM.

[Nightmare1]

JackalBeast, on 09 July 2016 - 08:24 AM, said:

If Gaining made the CN-9, crits would be a non issue

Who is Gaining?

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 10:59 AM, said:

Have you Ammo there?

How many Weapons hit you?

Itt a Medium with little structure for a big target...Alphas are big out there...

No ammo in the torso. The problem isn't that I'm losing the torso, it's that I'm losing all of the torso mounted weapons at the same time. For the record, in each of these cases, my torso remains solidly attached to my body after the weapons are stripped out of it.

Normally, when your Mech has components critted, it's one or possibly two at a time. It's not uncommon for that to happen, but multiple crits typically result from multiple weapon hits. In this case, the weapons that hit me shouldn't have been able to crit all of my own weapons simultaneously under normal circumstances.

Example 1: I was point-blank with an LRM Mad Dog. Clan LRMs do deal damage up close, but the damage dealt falls off precipitously the closer you get to it. In this case, I was a scant 50 meters away and closing fast when the LRM salvo hit me. instantly, all of my SRMs disappeared. They didn't crit one at a time or even trigger multiple "component destroyed warnings." There was a single warning, and they all went red. In this case, both of my MPLs also were critted. So, basically, a single flight of LRMs, at <50 meters, critted five weapon systems simultaneously. While this was certainly a case where multiple weapons hit my Mech (multiple warheads), the damage dealt should have been very low since I was close, and not enough to cause massive critting.

Example 2: I was fighting an Ebon Jag. He was being focused down by my allies and was dying very quickly. In desperation, the pilot swept his Large Laser across several of us. It wasn't focused one a single component; it was just dragged across us quickly and ineffectively. However, the moment it touched my left torso, all three of my SRM systems instantly became critted, again, with a single "component destroyed" warning message. My LT was actually pretty healthy and still had a little bit of armor on it, although it was red. The LL sweep basically stripped my armor and barely turned the torso yellow. Yet, for that minor amount of damage, I lost all of my SRMs. In this case, a single, momentary weapon hit stripped out three weapon systems despite dealing almost no damage to the internals.

That's the kind of frustrating stuff that's happening. I know that Clans have good crits because of their targeting computers, but, realistically, the amount of damage being dealt to my Mech's open torso is very small in each of these cases, usually not enough to change the shade/hue of the color. However, each time a crit occurs, it takes every weapon system with it, seemingly irrespective of which system actually received the crit.

[AnarchyBurger]

I've had issues with the cent and its glass cannon-ness also. Best advice I can give is try to keep ammo in legs and arms... maybe head. Though I've had surprise crits in legs that were insta-deaths also. I remember a long time ago I invested in a CASE for my AC20 model but don't remember if its worth it. The cent is a funny beast, it can put out some damage, but its probably one of the easiest targets out there also.

Edit: I reread, that is not necessarily the ammo. But also, it could be the ammo. U can try a case and see how It goes. Also cant ammo fed weapons explode like ammo? Or is that just gauss.

Edited by AnarchyBurger, 09 July 2016 - 01:55 PM.

[Thorqemada]

Well, Artemis doubles the internal size of your SRM4s, that per se doubles the chance that the weapon is critted out.
SRM4 do not need Artemis to be used effectivey - only SRM6 need Artemis.

I yet have no idea why they would all disappear simultaneously but again, the HP is so low and they could somehow be already damaged (the Mech Paper Doll would not show that) but not critted out yet so that only a fraction of damage is needed to make them disappear.
Also if that is the case it could either have something to do with damage ´transfer from the CT to the LT or a weird behavior in regard with the rescaling of the Mechs that may have borked the crit mechanic of that mech.

Try SRM4 without Artemis if that helps.

Do you not use a U/AC5 in the RA of the Mech?
The Tonnage should allow that (with FF+ES).

Edited by Thorqemada, 09 July 2016 - 01:58 PM.

[Nightmare1]

AnarchyBurger, on 09 July 2016 - 01:51 PM, said:

I've had issues with the cent and its glass cannon-ness also. Best advice I can give is try to keep ammo in legs and arms... maybe head. Though I've had surprise crits in legs that were insta-deaths also. I remember a long time ago I invested in a CASE for my AC20 model but don't remember if its worth it. The cent is a funny beast, it can put out some damage, but its probably one of the easiest targets out there also.

Edit: I reread, that is not necessarily the ammo. But also, it could be the ammo. U can try a case and see how It goes. Also cant ammo fed weapons explode like ammo? Or is that just gauss.

It's definitely not the ammo. And to answer your question, no, only the Gauss can explode. All other systems just get destroyed peacefully, lol.

Now, ammo and Gauss explosions can travel through components, so if the ammo in my LL was critted, then the damage could transfer to the LT. The problem is, my legs rarely get stripped. In each of these cases where all the SRMs were critted, I'm pretty sure that I had at least partial armor on the LL still. It might not have been 100%, but it would easily have been over 50%. Since crits can't happen without all of the armor being gone, it's impossible for my ammo to have been critted and then travel north to the torso.

[Nightmare1]

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

Well, Artemis doubles the internal size of your SRM4s, that per se doubles the chance that the weapon is critted out.
SRM4 do not need Artemis to be used effectivey - only SRM6 need Artemis.

This is true. However, the odd thing is that I rarely lose multiple systems. In my Atlas, for example, even after my torso has been opened and Mechs are whaling on it, the SRMs + Artemis in the torso get critted slowly and singly. It's incredibly rare to have multiple SRMs critted out of it. The same goes for my SRM + Artemis Zeus and my SRM + Artemis Timber Wolf. Individual crits, or in very rare cases dual crits, do happen, but I've never seen a triple-weapon-crit until I started running my CN9-A again. Even back when I ran it frequently, pre-quirks, I never had this sort of thing happen. That's why I'm befuddled over what to make of it.

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

I yet have no idea why they would all disappear simultaneously but again, the HP is so low and they could somehow be already damaged (the Mech Paper Doll would not show that) but not critted out yet so that only a fraction of damage is needed to make them disappear.

That was my thought with several of these cases. However, the LRM Mad Dog made me sit up a bit and frown. Five simultaneous crits is really weird. Then there was the Ebon Jag that barely scratched through my armor but somehow managed to rip out all three systems. That made me decide that it couldn't be health/damage related.

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

Also if that is the case it could either have something to do with damage ´transfer from the CT to the LT or a weird behavior in regard with the rescaling of the Mechs that may have borked the crit mechanic of that mech.

I was wondering if it had to do with the rescale. I used to run this Mech and build very frequently pre-quirk, and I've run it intermittently post-quirk without any of these kinds of issues. It's only been post-rescale where I started having problems.

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

Try SRM4 without Artemis if that helps.

I may do that, although I love how tight a punch it is with the Artemis. I know the 4s don't really need it, but it does make a humorous enough difference.

Thorqemada, on 09 July 2016 - 01:57 PM, said:

Do you not use a U/AC5 in the RA of the Mech?
The Tonnage should allow that (with FF+ES).

Naw, I hate UACs. Stupid things always jam, even on the first click. I've no use for a weapon that won't function right. I think the only Mech I have that still has them equipped is a single Dire Wolf, and even then it's only because it can boat so many that having 3 jam at once is no big deal.