37 replies to this topic

[Davegt27]

I spent 25MC because I wanted to speak first hand

what I got was Clan active probe (I have plenty of those already)

seems strange and probably illegal in the USA

[Dracol]

Just to throw another perspective log onto the fire....

When you recieve a supply cache, its contents are already decided.

The only time the patch notes mention anything about randomness is at the begining, talking about who recieves the crate. After that, it only states a player will use a key to unluck a crate and recieve one of the items shown as possibilities.

Looking at it from the business side of things, the design question that maybe running the show might be "how often do we need to give out large payouts for these 9 cent purchases to keep people interested?"


Simpliest way to manage it, in my opinion, would be making a list, each item having a number of positions equal to the desired ratio. Example: md laser, md laser, dire wolf. After each game, the crate released recieves the next reward in the list. When a crate is viewed, use aimple ui representation of 7 items on the list, as well as the item in the crate. Show animation of spinning items and reward player the item choosen when the crate was recieved.

Simpliest solution with the least amount of network chatter or data recording required.

The only random part is who gets the crate, its contends are predetermined.

[Dracol]

Davegt27, on 20 July 2016 - 03:50 PM, said:

I spent 25MC because I wanted to speak first hand

what I got was Clan active probe (I have plenty of those already)

seems strange and probably illegal in the USA

Doubt it would illegal, its a simple transaction.

For 0 cents, you get 50k cbills
For 9 cents, you get an item that is either sellable for more than 50k or can only be purchase for more than 9 cents worth of mc.

For 9 cents, you are buying an upgrade to an item worth 50k cbills. No gambling required.

[Deathlike]

Dracol, on 20 July 2016 - 04:23 PM, said:

Doubt it would illegal, its a simple transaction.

For 0 cents, you get 50k cbills
For 9 cents, you get an item that is either sellable for more than 50k or can only be purchase for more than 9 cents worth of mc.

For 9 cents, you are buying an upgrade to an item worth 50k cbills. No gambling required.

Flamers and Medium Lasers (when selling the latter) are not in that category.

Edited by Deathlike, 20 July 2016 - 04:29 PM.

[Johnny Z]

I just got another supply crate. Unlike the first one I opened with a 300k reward(CERPPC), I sold this one for 50k. I can see what all the panic is about the supply crates is about though. Not.

This is a great addition for when Solaris comes out. Fits the Solaris/Vegas/ Gladiator games theme even.

Edited by Johnny Z, 20 July 2016 - 04:35 PM.

[GreenHell]

I've already had both myself and a team-mate get the EXACT same supply cache within 10 minutes of each other. This suggests to me that the crates are NOT random, but pulled from a pool of pre-determined crates.

If they were truly random, then I'd still be wary of them. Knowing that they aren't even random just puts them on my list of total scam non-sense to avoid.

My advice? DO NOT BUY

[Boulangerie]

GreenHell, on 20 July 2016 - 04:38 PM, said:

I've already had both myself and a team-mate get the EXACT same supply cache within 10 minutes of each other. This suggests to me that the crates are NOT random, but pulled from a pool of pre-determined crates.

If they were truly random, then I'd still be wary of them. Knowing that they aren't even random just puts them on my list of total scam non-sense to avoid.

My advice? DO NOT BUY

Now, both of you should open them to see if you get the same reward. While this wouldn't prove that they are predeterming (due to you both rolling the same item chance if that's possible), if you did get different items, it would definitely prove that the item gained is rolled for when cache received/opened.

[Rhialto]

Dracol, on 20 July 2016 - 04:03 PM, said:

When you recieve a supply cache, its contents are already decided.

Maybe the prize you get is already decided... unless it's all done server-side.

Everyone know the well established Blizzard company? Reminds me of Diablo II maphack thing, the server already sent all the map data to client so the maphack thing was reading the map data on client side and exposing it. Maybe it's the same with those crates, they are sent on your computer and you decide if you open or sell like any item. If it's client-side then maybe one day someone will find how to read crate prize before opening it. But I doubt it's client-side as we must be connected for any action anyway.

[Lostdragon]

A wise man once told me the lottery is a tax on the mathematically impaired. So are loot crates with real money keys.

[TLBFestus]

I wonder if, because of where PGI is (which is also where I live), if they aren't breaking some laws for not disclosing the actual odds of winning a mech.

The BC Lottery Corp has to disclose the odds on all their scratch and win cards, and this is somewhat similar.

Perhaps I will check into that.

(Addendum: inquiring with local authorities about this issue)

Edited by TLBFestus, 20 July 2016 - 06:52 PM.

[Ace Selin]

Davegt27, on 20 July 2016 - 03:50 PM, said:

I spent 25MC because I wanted to speak first hand

what I got was Clan active probe (I have plenty of those already)

seems strange and probably illegal in the USA

Nope doubt its illegal anywhere, as for why, see below.

TLBFestus, on 20 July 2016 - 06:35 PM, said:

I wonder if, because of where PGI is (which is also where I live), if they aren't breaking some laws for not disclosing the actual odds of winning a mech.

The BC Lottery Corp has to disclose the odds on all their scratch and win cards, and this is somewhat similar.

Perhaps I will check into that.

(Addendum: inquiring with local authorities about this issue)

Again probably not. required.

See youre technically not playing a lottery, well not with real money.

See your real money buys MC and that MC is a virtual good.
So no gambling with real money, you knew exactly what you were getting when you purchased it and you actually got exactly that thing.
Now the next bit is up to you. What do you want to do with your virtual goods (MC in this case).
You can use it to trade for other in game items/virtual goods and you can now do it in two distinct ways.
One, when you trade a known amount of MC for a known item (ie make a purchase) & the second is to trade your virtual goods for an unknown in game item (lottery / supply cache).

Not a lawyer & this is not legal advice but i believe this is the loophole that allows for these things to occur in all games across the world.

[Kalleballe]

That they use loopholes like this to circumvent the clear intent of the law speaks volumes about them as a company.

[Johnny Z]

This is a statement from guys that want a beaucratic institution formed to regulate hockey game raffles and bingo at churches and other such tiny bits of fun in the world. Who will then turn around and do nothing but collect their pay cheques while on vacation in the Bahamas.

Getting a supply pack as a reward for winning a match and then being able to sell it for 50k creds or open it for 7 cents is not gambling.

ROFL clowns.

If it ever does get to the point where it looks like gambling I would agree. But its not even close at the moment.

It will always be a tough call because many offline games have had gambling in them. card games and such. No way that's real gambing. But if its online with in game creds? that's not gambling either really. Online with premium paid for creds? Tough call at higher amounts but most likely it is close to gambling.

That no real money is being won is how it has been declared not gambling even at higher amounts in other games. But it is close to gambling I think when it comes to selling random items in crates even if players would rather just buy the item itself. Some games make it random to make those items harder to get to make more profit off them... so even then, its not about gambling as much as it is about consumer protection.

Edited by Johnny Z, 21 July 2016 - 12:50 AM.

[TercieI]

Deathlike, on 20 July 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

I'd rather throw a dime or two to some other game (more like $10+ worth) instead of spending my 2 cents here.

m

Then take the 50K, no problem. <shrug>

Saw a GHR last night and thought "man that head looks different than I remember." Then realized it was a Wolfhound. Supply caches aren't moving my rage needle at all.

[Bud Crue]

TercieI, on 21 July 2016 - 05:37 AM, said:

m

Then take the 50K, no problem. <shrug>

Saw a GHR last night and thought "man that head looks different than I remember." Then realized it was a Wolfhound. Supply caches aren't moving my rage needle at all.

Not moving the rage needle, but this slot machine mechanism, along with clown faced mechs with di@ks painted on, has cranked the "this just doesn't seem to be something that belongs in this game" knob way past 11.

[TercieI]

Bud Crue, on 21 July 2016 - 06:01 AM, said:

Not moving the rage needle, but this slot machine mechanism, along with clown faced mechs with di@ks painted on, has cranked the &quot;this just doesn't seem to be something that belongs in this game&quot; knob way past 11.

Well, I'm not a lore guy, so I'm not gonna get worked up about either of those things, especially in the face of actually regressing balance.

[Bud Crue]

TercieI, on 21 July 2016 - 06:04 AM, said:

Well, I'm not a lore guy, so I'm not gonna get worked up about either of those things, especially in the face of actually regressing balance.

I hear ya, and I fully agree. But honestly I feel like most folks who have been here for more than even a year are almost used to PGI dinking around with balance and mucking things up, to the point where we are almost used to it. These seemingly trivial things -like some of the more hideous/inappropriate dekals and the goodie crates- are the kind of things though, while being perhaps merely silly distractions, can nevertheless cause a relative new comer to think: "huh, I thought this was a mechwarrior (or BT or robot combat or mech based shooter, etc.) game, but this stuff is just stupid. Screw this I'm going to go play Warframe or Overwatch or WoT."

Population feels so low as it is, that anything that might cause folks to leave the game, however trivial I think need serious evaluation. I hope PGI knows what it is doing with these new features, but I have my doubts.

[MeiSooHaityu]

cazidin, on 20 July 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

...I can get Mechs from this?!

Can...Yes! Will?...well.....