61 replies to this topic

[Yellonet]

Right now your PSR score goes up more when you win than if you lose, even if you perform the same. That is why the current system is more like an experience gauge than actual skill level; you can perform quite badly, but get carried by the team and thus increase your PSR.

I think the solution would be to change PSR exactly the same no matter if you win or lose, and the points for increasing PSR should likely be a bit higher, as well as the limit for redusing PSR.

That way YOUR PSR is up to YOU, as it should be.

The terribads would not get to higher tiers. This coupled with a bit stricter MM or perhaps an option to choose which tiers you want to get matched against I think it could work well.
Players would get to the tier where they belong and stay there, more players would have better matches.

[El Bandito]

What you just said had been suggested by numerous people, myself included, for many months, but PGI had failed to do anything about it.

So, what now?

[NoiseCrypt]

Zero-sum PSR and opt-in for higher tiers would be great

[Yellonet]

El Bandito, on 23 July 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

What you just said had been suggested by numerous people, myself included, for many months, but PGI had failed to do anything about it.

So, what now?

I've said it before too... It just needs to be said over and over and over...
Take it to twitter?

[sharknoise]

Quote

but get carried by the team and thus increase your PSR

I am pretty bad and generally have more losses than wins (1,343 / 1,453 total, even my recent mechs have similar ratio). Yet my PSR is steadily rising (soon to be Tier 2). So it's not because the team keeps winning games for me, it's just the fact that losses seem to influence PSR less than wins. PGI can keep the win-loss based rating to reward effective team players, just make losses count for more.

Edited by sharknoise, 23 July 2016 - 05:25 AM.

[Macster16]

The whole PSR/tier system is broken and needs to be overhauled. I don't know why PGI made it the way it is and not realise that over time, the upper tiers would get diluted as lower tier players inevitably make their way into the higher tiers, causing the matchmaker to serve up games which are an absolute mess. It's why matches have been becoming noticeably less balanced and more derpy.

[Queen of England]

If it were up to me:

The top 8 match scores go up in PSR;
The middle 8 match scores don't move;
The bottom 8 match scores go down in PSR.

[Monkey Lover]

The system is setup this way because they want people to play as a team. Over all it still has to do with some skill. You go up higher when you do better you can even go up when you don't win. I have gone up or at least stayed even often when I didn't win.

[Yellonet]

After PSR is changed to actually reflect skill I would like something like this:

I'm T2, therefore I cannot uncheck my own and higher tiers, but can opt out of tiers below me (and here I've opted out of being included matches with T4 and T5).

Edited by Yellonet, 23 July 2016 - 05:39 AM.

[Bud Crue]

In the "a question for PGI" thread where Tina responded to Bishop, she seemed to suggest that the devs make an effort to respond to "big" discussions regarding specific topics. My read on that is "we respond when the community goes ballistic and if their rage is directed to a specific change or feature." Suggesting a broad rework of the PSR seems a bit too broad of a topic, and the outrage is a bit lacking, relatively speaking. So I would expect the issue to continue to be ignored...at least based on the community manager's comments in this regard. That said, we may as well yap about it amongst ourselves.

[NoiseCrypt]

Yellonet, on 23 July 2016 - 05:36 AM, said:

After PSR is changed to actually reflect skill I would like something like this:

I'm T2, therefore I cannot uncheck my own and higher tiers, but can opt out of tiers below me (and here I've opted out of being included matches with T4 and T5).

Opt-out wont work since you will be imposing that restriction on 23 other people.

Being able to opt-in on higher tiers would be a good idea though. IMO.

[ImperialKnight]

win loss should not factor into whether your PSR goes up or down. unfortunately, we need some math guru to figure out how to normalise the performance of the losing team to the winning team and then compare it to your past results to see whether you have moved up in skill or have remained about the same skill level or have deteriorated

there is also a way to temporarily fix the problem, which is to periodically reset the current PSR Tier system. given how it actually kind of worked initially. just that the upper tiers are now getting diluted.

[Yellonet]

Bud Crue, on 23 July 2016 - 05:36 AM, said:

In the "a question for PGI" thread where Tina responded to Bishop, she seemed to suggest that the devs make an effort to respond to "big" discussions regarding specific topics. My read on that is "we respond when the community goes ballistic and if their rage is directed to a specific change or feature." Suggesting a broad rework of the PSR seems a bit too broad of a topic, and the outrage is a bit lacking, relatively speaking. So I would expect the issue to continue to be ignored...at least based on the community manager's comments in this regard. That said, we may as well yap about it amongst ourselves.

But this wouldn't be a very big change, at least from a development perspective; it should literally be to just change a few values on how PSR is changed after a match.

NoiseCrypt, on 23 July 2016 - 05:49 AM, said:

Opt-out wont work since you will be imposing that restriction on 23 other people.

Being able to opt-in on higher tiers would be a good idea though. IMO.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. How would a personal option like this impose on others?

[Yellonet]

knightsljx, on 23 July 2016 - 05:52 AM, said:

win loss should not factor into whether your PSR goes up or down. unfortunately, we need some math guru to figure out how to normalise the performance of the losing team to the winning team and then compare it to your past results to see whether you have moved up in skill or have remained about the same skill level or have deteriorated

there is also a way to temporarily fix the problem, which is to periodically reset the current PSR Tier system. given how it actually kind of worked initially. just that the upper tiers are now getting diluted.

I'm not sure we need some math guru, the reward for winning is and should be more C-bills and XP, and now getting the chance for a crate, PSR score should not be one of the rewards, that should only be based on the players personal contribution.

[NoiseCrypt]

Yellonet, on 23 July 2016 - 05:59 AM, said:

But this wouldn't be a very big change, at least from a development perspective; it should literally be to just change a few values on how PSR is changed after a match.


I'm not quite sure what you mean. How would a personal option like this impose on others?

The mm collects players as they become available. So lets say that you are the 15th player that becomes available for a Tier 2 match. Everyone in that match is now forced to opt-out on tier 4 and 5 players, even though tier 4 and/or 5 players might normally have been added due to mm time restrictions.

[Stone Wall]

sharknoise, on 23 July 2016 - 05:23 AM, said:

I am pretty bad and generally have more losses than wins (1,343 / 1,453 total, even my recent mechs have similar ratio). Yet my PSR is steadily rising (soon to be Tier 2). So it's not because the team keeps winning games for me, it's just the fact that losses seem to influence PSR less than wins. PGI can keep the win-loss based rating to reward effective team players, just make losses count for more.

Ok so it takes about 3000 games to get to Tier 2.

[Yellonet]

NoiseCrypt, on 23 July 2016 - 06:04 AM, said:

The mm collects players as they become available. So lets say that you are the 15th player that becomes available for a Tier 2 match. Everyone in that match is now forced to opt-out on tier 4 and 5 players, even though tier 4 and/or 5 players might normally have been added due to mm time restrictions.

Who says it would work like that? I wasn't thinking that at all, If I opt out of some tiers I will obviously have to wait until there's a match where others have opted out as well, either by choice or by the built in "opt out function".

[NoiseCrypt]

Yellonet, on 23 July 2016 - 06:15 AM, said:

Who says it would work like that? I wasn't thinking that at all, If I opt out of some tiers I will obviously have to wait until there's a match where others have opted out as well, either by choice or by the built in "opt out function".

That would of course be fair.

[Yellonet]

NoiseCrypt, on 23 July 2016 - 06:18 AM, said:

That would of course be fair.

I thought so too But I'd be willing to wait a bit to get a better match, at least a higher chance for a better match. But this all depends on PSR actually reflecting skill, which it currently does not

[Yellonet]

Stone Wall, on 23 July 2016 - 06:06 AM, said:

Ok so it takes about 3000 games to get to Tier 2.

How fast you get to higher tiers actually depends on skill. If you get there, not so much.