521 replies to this topic

[dario03]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 07:44 PM, said:

You referring to this goalpost here on the previous page? Exactly where did I move it to?



Several people have posted about tactics to avoid light mechs doing the "circle of death" in a lone isolated assault, I'm just wondering what tactics exist for when high ping makes the "hard" impossible?

You shoot it. Hitreg not working happens but its rarely as bad as people make it out to be and there is a good chance that the lights shots are not hitting like they should either. In all the time I've played this game I've never found it all that hard to beat a light while in a assault, just shoot at it till it falls over.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 07:44 PM, said:

You referring to this goalpost here on the previous page? Exactly where did I move it to?

You aren't winning the argument in a normal situation (where connections are stable), so you are now trying to ask about if some magical warping occurs (which generally happens on both sides with bad connections) like that should factor into this balance discussion.

[Drunken Skull]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 16 August 2016 - 08:27 PM, said:

You aren't winning the argument in a normal situation (where connections are stable), so you are now trying to ask about if some magical warping occurs (which generally happens on both sides with bad connections) like that should factor into this balance discussion.

My argument was never about "winning the argument in a normal situation (where connections are stable)", which I actually find to be a rarer occurrence than you're making out.

Even in my first post about it, I SPECIFY high lag and warping as contributing factors.

It's a fairly simple and straight forward question, why can't you simply answer it istead of fluffing about trying to discredit it's validity as a question?

Edited by Drunken Skull, 16 August 2016 - 08:59 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 08:35 PM, said:

My argument was never about "winning the argument in a normal situation (where connections are stable)", which I actually find to be a rarer occurrence than you're making out.

Considering high ping issues feature on a more than regular basis, yes, I do think it should be factored in to the balancing of the game.

Lag-shielding happens far less than you think it does.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Yeonne Greene, on 16 August 2016 - 08:20 PM, said:

This is not Spiderman...

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 07:44 PM, said:

You referring to this goalpost here on the previous page? Exactly where did I move it to?



Several people have posted about tactics to avoid light mechs doing the "circle of death" in a lone isolated assault, I'm just wondering what tactics exist for when high ping makes the "hard" impossible?

[Chuck Jager]

To OP - bring seismic better exploit than Cheeta

I also know that the best legal exploit in the game is hitting back at the same time you are turning in an assault. Many a dead light. Also if they are blocking you, you can go through them backwards to get the shot too. OR put you back against a wall. JUST DO NOT HAVE ALL SHOULDER WEAPONS AND GET CAUGHT BY A LIGHT while in an assault.

I did see a light mech on my team warping 1 out of every 3-5 sec and I checked their ping it was under 120. I wonder if this person had a limited bandwidth with other users that did not show in their ping but still hit their data flow (worked as a web designer and know some it stuff but not enough about server protocols/issues)

I also know that the best legal exploit in the game is hitting back at the same time you are turning in an assault. Many a dead light. Also if they are blocking you, you can go through them backwards to get the shot too. OR put you back against a wall. JUST DO NOT HAVE ALL SHOULDER WEAPONS AND GET CAUGHT BY A LIGHT while in an assault.

[Drunken Skull]

Sigilum Sanctum, on 16 August 2016 - 08:46 PM, said:

" "{nothing of value to say here}" "

I think you've been sniffing too much gunpowder fumes bruh, you trying to get Forum Warrior nerfed?

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 09:06 PM, said:

I think you've been sniffing too much gunpowder fumes bruh, you trying to get Forum Warrior nerfed?

[MischiefSC]

dario03, on 13 August 2016 - 01:59 AM, said:

Show us the math.

Didn't you know the shell in an AC20 weighs 35 tons?

[Andi Nagasia]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 06:42 PM, said:

That's assuming that the assault mech and the light mech both have a low ping, and that the Assault mech hasn't been left behind by nascar's.

What if the ping is horrible, and the light mech is proceeding to warp, and when I say warp I mean litterally disappearing on the left, re-appearing behind, then again vanishing to be on the right and so forth, with weapons fire and damage appearing from thin air?

What is the assault mech's best course of action then? Spray and prey? Simply shut down? Shut down and then exit the game? Or just power off the whole computer by removing the power cord? Attempting to break the keyboard in half maybe?

I have seen this a number of times recently, and not just with light mechs. In a recent game two of us were chasing down a lone surviving heavy that was only moderately fast, and it took a good 3 minutes for the direwolf and archer to kill him, the shot's simply weren't registering, and all the client was showing us was lag. We eventually legged and killed it, but it was quite the farce.

Speed tanking is a sketchy thing to balance and get right, especially where ping can vary from under 100 to over 500 seemingly randomly and at any time.

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 07:44 PM, said:

Several people have posted about tactics to avoid light mechs doing the "circle of death" in a lone isolated assault, I'm just wondering what tactics exist for when high ping makes the "hard" impossible?

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 08:35 PM, said:

My argument was never about "winning the argument in a normal situation (where connections are stable)", which I actually find to be a rarer occurrence than you're making out.

Even in my first post about it, I SPECIFY high lag and warping as contributing factors.

It's a fairly simple and straight forward question, why can't you simply answer it istead of fluffing about trying to discredit it's validity as a question?

Mechs should not be balanced to take in account Lag-shield/warping,
Why? because its not a one way street, lag happens both ways, for both involved,
just because you have a good ping and their ping is very high doesnt mean they can shoot you but you cant them,

if they are teleporting about you, just imagine how it must be for them, but they are also moving 150kph,
ive had many times in the past lagging out and teleporting suddenly i break one of my legs on a bump,

also if your experiencing so much lag so often then perhaps you need to get a better connection,
im running on BrightHouse Basic Internet, on a Toshiba Satellite L875D, and get 30-130ping,
i only get +600ping if their is a problem with my Traced Route, at that point its not PGIs fault,
also why bring up my computer, i play most days at 15-30Fps, & dont experience much lag,

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Drunken Skull, on 16 August 2016 - 08:35 PM, said:

It's a fairly simple and straight forward question, why can't you simply answer it istead of fluffing about trying to discredit it's validity as a question?

I discredit the question because first it's a loaded question.
Second, lag warping affects both sides, I'm not sure why everyone else sees the warping since the server should be authoritative, the only one who should see the warping effect should be the person with the laggy connection, either way, even if someone has a lagshield thanks to an unstable connection causing warping, it affects both sides negatively, so while he may be hard to hit, he is also going to have trouble hitting anything due to the limits of HSR. Having played on an unstable connection a couple times (due to someone DLing crap while playing) I can confirm that it is definitely harder to land shots while lagging.

[Febrosian R Gillingham]

Maybe lets just slow light mechs down by like 25% and maybe put a cooldown on turning? Like you can turn really fast but only once or twice and then you have to run in a straight line for a bit so assaults can shoot at you. After like 10 seconds then you can turn again. That sounds pretty fair I think. Maybe we can put this warp drive thing on cooldown too? I don't know which button lets you do it though so I'm not sure

Edited by Febrosian R Gillingham, 17 August 2016 - 04:08 AM.

[Deathlike]

Febrosian R Gillingham, on 17 August 2016 - 04:06 AM, said:

Maybe lets just slow light mechs down by like 25% and maybe put a cooldown on turning? Like you can turn really fast but only once or twice and then you have to run in a straight line for a bit so assaults can shoot at you. After like 10 seconds then you can turn again. That sounds pretty fair I think. Maybe we can put this warp drive thing on cooldown too? I don't know which button lets you do it though so I'm not sure

Alt+F4

[RestosIII]

Febrosian R Gillingham, on 17 August 2016 - 04:06 AM, said:

Maybe lets just slow light mechs down by like 25% and maybe put a cooldown on turning? Like you can turn really fast but only once or twice and then you have to run in a straight line for a bit so assaults can shoot at you. After like 10 seconds then you can turn again. That sounds pretty fair I think. Maybe we can put this warp drive thing on cooldown too? I don't know which button lets you do it though so I'm not sure

Good one, thought you were serious for a few seconds.

[L3mming2]

Baulven, on 11 August 2016 - 07:08 AM, said:

The ACH did slightly better than the other top mechs, which there is also one mech that will edge out the competition in these events. If this event happened prior to the rescale it would have been the oxide hands down, as it took a double nerf (size and movement profile) to bring it down to above average.

Everything that came close to the arctic cheetah also outscored the bad lights by about 50% you realize that right?

No one is saying ACH isn't a fairly good light mech, but the other mechs should be brought up to its level. Lights need a lot of love after the movement profile and rescale changes which gutted a large portion of the class usefulness. Jenners (other than the oxide), mist lynx, commando and more all need love.

not realy thru, the oxide douse not have the ammo to put down leaderboard worthy scores.. it will have good maches but no 1200+ damage games..

[Quicksilver Aberration]

RestosIII, on 17 August 2016 - 04:11 AM, said:

Good one, thought you were serious for a few seconds.

Maybe he is serious? After all, he is only 7.....or maybe he finally turned 8.

[MischiefSC]

We've got 3 options.

1. Hope that PGI creates and implements a new, rich and complex mechanism, be that PvE or far more complex mission types or a deep Information Warfare system that provides another value leg to balance mechs on and as such lights are weak in combat but just as viable because they play into specific roles that win matches consistently and have just as rewarding a payout.

2. Realize that the game, as it is now, is as rich and complex as it will ever be and PGI is flat out never going to do any of the stuff from #1, in which case lights need balanced up to match any other mech in combat. In which case we need to look at mechs not as value by tonnage but by character classes so to speak - if you give a mage low HP and armor he needs AoE spells, crowd control stuff or super-buffs for his teammates. If lights have such weak armor give them insane mobility to make up for it. They need balanced 1 to 1 with every other mech in the game.

3. Accept that PGI isn't going to do #2 either, will give us some vague promises about future content that will never get made or that we will at best get a shallow skeleton of that is never fleshed out and balance for lights will always be total **** because PGI knows we are spineless sheep who will rage over bad balance - then go buy an $80 mech pack.

I'd gamble on #3 myself. It's got a lot of historical precedent.

[Baulven]

L3mming2, on 17 August 2016 - 05:05 AM, said:

not realy thru, the oxide douse not have the ammo to put down leaderboard worthy scores.. it will have good maches but no 1200+ damage games..

Oxides pre rescale were a bit above average difficulty to hit (like all jenners), because of size and movement profile. What made them ridiculous is the insane amount of structure (which is why they are still viable while other manners aren't) is the reason they were considered ungodly on the field.

The way to fix the other jenners is going to be change their mobility profiles or give them structure. If they give out mobility buffs though the oxide will still be clearly the best.

[Drunken Skull]

Andi Nagasia, on 16 August 2016 - 09:17 PM, said:

Mechs should not be balanced to take in account Lag-shield/warping,
Why? because its not a one way street, lag happens both ways, for both involved,
just because you have a good ping and their ping is very high doesnt mean they can shoot you but you cant them,

if they are teleporting about you, just imagine how it must be for them, but they are also moving 150kph,
ive had many times in the past lagging out and teleporting suddenly i break one of my legs on a bump,

also if your experiencing so much lag so often then perhaps you need to get a better connection,
im running on BrightHouse Basic Internet, on a Toshiba Satellite L875D, and get 30-130ping,
i only get +600ping if their is a problem with my Traced Route, at that point its not PGIs fault,
also why bring up my computer, i play most days at 15-30Fps, & dont experience much lag,

Again, not quite what I asked, can you think of any tactics an assault mech might use when faced with a warping light mech pecking them to death? was my question(Note this is NOT a two way street, as Assault mechs hardly have the speed to warp at any ping).

I have the best Internet connection possible in my backwards country, that coupled with low population count mean there are NO Drops on the Oceanic Server 70% of the time, so, yes, I am FORCED into higher ping games than I like, I am not the only one however.

@ Sigilum Sanctum; I find posting children's content that has had Adult content added to it in a forum where children may frequent rather distasteful, you, and all those who liked that post, might want to think about what will happen when they see it.

Edited by Drunken Skull, 17 August 2016 - 02:08 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Drunken Skull, on 17 August 2016 - 01:55 PM, said:

(Note this is NOT a two way street, as Assault mechs hardly have the speed to warp at any ping).

It isn't about the assault warping, it is about a light being unable to hit much while warping. A light that warps around everywhere is a lot less likely to land shots because they are warping, especially if the server is constantly warping them the whole time due to server sending corrective data.