71 replies to this topic

[RestosIII]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

He's serious.

[Alistair Winter]

FupDup, on 13 August 2016 - 12:00 PM, said:

LRMs should have...

...Their lock-on and tracking mechanisms completely redesigned.

Yep. As long as LRMs remain situational low-skill weapons that require situational awareness but no aiming skills, the players will always be butt-hurt and the LRMs will always be fantastic or terrible depending on random factors.

Has anyone ever seen anyone compliment enemies on their use of LRMs? I've never seen it. Because getting 6 kills and 1200 damage in an LRM boat is dependent on a lot of factors and as long as aiming is not involved, people have no respect for such accomplishments.

Hell, many times, even stepping in line of sight of the enemy isn't involved, if the LRM boat has good teammates.

[Pjwned]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

I look forward to further buttanguish from you getting destroyed by one of the worst weapon systems in the game.

[Kyrie]

Novakaine, on 13 August 2016 - 10:37 AM, said:

I know somebodies lurm boat abused you, but it's your freaking fault.
Let me guess no modules or AMS huh?
The absolute worst weapon in the game and your can't fight against it?
"L2P or go back to COD" catchie huh?
Serious man AMS is your friend use it.

For the record, AMS is fairly useless unless everyone uses it and stays in close proximiity of each other.

Cover > AMS by a huge margin, tons spent on AMS on other weapon systems = greater effectiveness.

[Davison]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

And nobody has to alter their own methods for you, in turn. That's a double edged sword, sweetheart. You don't decide what an "actual weapon" is anymore than you decide how others will play. I use them. I also use Gauss Rifles, PPC's, autocannon, lasers, SRM's and whatever else seems like it might be of interest on a fair variety of chassis. I've also died to every one of the above.

I'm fine with this. So are many others.

This is a subject you've tried to push before, which only took a brief look into past posts to discover. If LRM's consistently kill you, try the following:
Take cover to break LOS.
Kill or chase off the spotter.
Mount an AMS and/or stick near others who have it.
Mount an ECM if you can.
Hop into something more mobile.

If you refuse to counter your enemy properly, that's nobody else's problem at all. And if a statistically mediocre player like me can survive the "Lurmageddon", the real problem isn't the weapon. In the end, everyone here has told you different versions of the same thing, and when it's pretty much You vs. The World, they might have a point worth considering.

Davison, signing off.

[Pjwned]

Kyrie, on 13 August 2016 - 01:39 PM, said:

For the record, AMS is fairly useless unless everyone uses it and stays in close proximiity of each other.

Cover > AMS by a huge margin, tons spent on AMS on other weapon systems = greater effectiveness.

tl;dr AMS is plenty useful against LRMs unless you play so horribly that even AMS isn't enough to matter

It kind of goes without saying that cover is the best defense against LRMs, or any weapon for that matter.

The thing is that people still do get hit by LRMs, which I would hope they do since LRMs would be pretty awful otherwise, and unless you're getting rained on by a ton of LRMs (more on that in a bit) then AMS is quite effective at mitigating damage from LRMs.

Just look at this example video of somebody whining like a ***** over a 4x LRM5 Oxide of all things, on top of several other victims falling prey to...20 LRM tubes being chain fired.



Notice how the LRMs were being chain fired there? Simply having 1 AMS on any nearby mech would have completely neutered that damage, but there wasn't a single AMS to be seen there.

That said, that example is a little unusual since most of the time you're dealing with more than 5 LRMs being fired at a time, and indeed if AMS was in play then the Oxide could have just started firing all 20 tubes at once instead of chain firing, but even then AMS is quite helpful against some LRMs heading your way (presumably while you go to find some cover).

There are definitely times where your lone AMS is not enough to protect you against volleys of 50+ missiles, but if you're getting rained on like that and get destroyed then that doesn't mean AMS wasn't good enough, since obviously you were doing something wrong to get rained on so badly.

[Mcgral18]

LRMs are pretty Terribad

Unfortunately, half of your PUG BlueFor are also likely Terribad, and will die to LURMs, despite them being the better part of worthless on the majority of the maps


If they weren't Terribad, I might be inclined to take them on a select few robots, which have unfortunate hardpoints. As it stands, I'll ignore them, and not die to them.

[Gamuray]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

o/ hi there. I'm a friendly neighborhood jack of all trades pilot. I pilot all classes with all playstyles. I'm here to tell you that full lrm boating is a bad idea and easily countered by a brawl, ecm, ams, cover, radar deprivation module, speed. I never go full lrm, as the most I do is half lrm with a primary of large and medium lasers and play aggressive with lots of movement and direct fire.

(I'm also generally in the top quarter of a match's match scores... when I'm not in a wolfhound or enforcer)

I noticed you wanted developer responses. I'm sorry, but the only developer that would respond to you on the forums would be Tina, and she's not exactly a good pilot (no offense to her, not many of the dev's are). If you want a response, tweet one of them and you might have a 10% chance of a serious response to your complaint.
I also noticed you did not want people without an idea of how to aim or shoot to respond. It seems that not many of those people have responded, because nobody else seems to have had trouble with lrm's, which that would if they didn't know how to move and shoot. So it's obvious that most of your respondents must be able to move and shoot and not die from lrms.

Furthermore...

Listen to them. They're all correct with their statements. And the developers are not the ones you want the opinion of on mwo gameplay... they only occasionally play.

[Novakaine]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

Unless you are a rocket scientist which I highly doudt.
Then I can only assume you have absolutly no idea what you are talking about.
Luckily for you I am but, instead of a boring soliloquy about missle ballistics I will simply leave you with this.
I definitely overuse and abuse this one.

[Mystere]

Deethree, on 13 August 2016 - 10:26 AM, said:

only isis supporters would use lrm. DO YOU SUPPORT TERRORISM?

Did ISIS force you to wear a burka? Or did they touch you in that "special" place?

Edited by Mystere, 13 August 2016 - 02:56 PM.

[FuhNuGi]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 09:48 AM, said:

PGI has obviously been very busy improving the game for LRM users for the past few years but it is time to stop!

LRMs should not be directing themself around objects to its target - they should fire directly at given target without any change in direction.

There is a technique some experienced LRMers use referred to as "bending". (works great in frozen city) One example.of bending would be for you to rely on your teammates for target acquisition while standing behind cover. Then as you fire, torso twist off and the missile actually arc around to the side while remaining in cover... this does not always work, but is a fun mechanic to work with.

Think of a LRM more as a guided rocket mortar, surprisingly easy to defend against, very low damage spread over a broad area, in many cases more of a psychological weapon than a physical one. Try running a boat for a while and see how they work and the spinoff is you will learn it's weaknesses.

[Emden]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 09:48 AM, said:

PGI has obviously been very busy improving the game for LRM users for the past few years but it is time to stop!

LRMs should not be directing themself around objects to its target - they should fire directly at given target without any change in direction.

LRMs should not be in abundance on any mech - one or two per mech is sufficient.

LRMs should not be firing so many rounds per second - they should have a prolonged cooldown period between each shot. (longer than gauss)

So please... stop reducing cover on maps, stop making it easier for mass LRM abusers and start making the game fairer for everyone again.

Hate to see his "House Rules" for Battle-Tech..... No, LRMs are just fine as they are. Working an LRM mech is not easy, just like it is not easy for a Brawling Atlas. It seems fair and good as is...... if anything, LRMs should be fire and forget.... hehehe

[Kyrie]

Pjwned, on 13 August 2016 - 02:18 PM, said:

tl;dr AMS is plenty useful against LRMs unless you play so horribly that even AMS isn't enough to matter

It kind of goes without saying that cover is the best defense against LRMs, or any weapon for that matter.

The thing is that people still do get hit by LRMs, which I would hope they do since LRMs would be pretty awful otherwise, and unless you're getting rained on by a ton of LRMs (more on that in a bit) then AMS is quite effective at mitigating damage from LRMs.

Just look at this example video of somebody whining like a ***** over a 4x LRM5 Oxide of all things, on top of several other victims falling prey to...20 LRM tubes being chain fired.



Notice how the LRMs were being chain fired there? Simply having 1 AMS on any nearby mech would have completely neutered that damage, but there wasn't a single AMS to be seen there.

That said, that example is a little unusual since most of the time you're dealing with more than 5 LRMs being fired at a time, and indeed if AMS was in play then the Oxide could have just started firing all 20 tubes at once instead of chain firing, but even then AMS is quite helpful against some LRMs heading your way (presumably while you go to find some cover).

There are definitely times where your lone AMS is not enough to protect you against volleys of 50+ missiles, but if you're getting rained on like that and get destroyed then that doesn't mean AMS wasn't good enough, since obviously you were doing something wrong to get rained on so badly.

AMS would be absolutely wonderful if TT type mechs were actually played... mechs that use single LRM10, single LRM5s and so on. Usually LRMs are boated, and the actual protection offered by 1 AMS against a barrage of LRM 30, multiplied out by however many LRMboats are locked on to you or more is negligible. To that negligible end you have sacrificed a minimum of 1 ton to perhaps 3t plus (to have coverage for the entire match), tonnage that could have been applied to larger engine for faster speed, more cooling, more lazors, (insert your favorite weapon type here).

[adamts01]

Drunken Skull, on 13 August 2016 - 10:32 AM, said:

OP needs to take a break for the rest of the Assault Mech tournament and come back once matches have calmed down and returned to the usual 3/3/3/3.

? You mean 1/3/6/2.


OP: No. Part of the problem with MWO is it's limited gameplay options. Turning our only indirect fire weapon in to a direct fire weapon would yield fewer options and make things even more stale. I think LRMs need a significant indirect boost, which gives small and fast spotters a larger role as well. Also mines, more artillery options and other things that can kill you that e-sports kids would hate. I am sorry you got narced on Polar, which I imagnie is what happened, that does suck, and with such selfish gameplay your ECM mech probably didn't even think about giving you cover. I also don't like how LRMs are spammed. I think they should be powerful as ****, but you only get a few salvos per ton. That way they can't be spammed, and you need a good spotter to make them work, and reward sticking your face out to get a lock yourself. Right now they're just a mess, but over powered in any way? Nope.

Edited by adamts01, 13 August 2016 - 05:36 PM.

[El Bandito]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

Typical LRM (L)user comments. I do not need to justify nor explain my game play methods. Accuse at will. Fact is, LRMs are over used and abused and need to be fixed. You all jump to their defense as it is you who has no idea how to use an actual weapon or move. I want a response from the game makers, not the LRM fools.

The developers are so sucky at MWO and so distanced from the reality of the game, I simply pity you for thinking you are so smart.

[Revorn]

Saskia, on 13 August 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

I want a response from the game makers

Wow Sweety now we are realy impressed, lol. Good Luck with that.

[Pjwned]

Kyrie, on 13 August 2016 - 05:03 PM, said:

AMS would be absolutely wonderful if TT type mechs were actually played... mechs that use single LRM10, single LRM5s and so on.

That actually would happen more to an extent if LRMs were more reliable.

Quote

Usually LRMs are boated, and the actual protection offered by 1 AMS against a barrage of LRM 30, multiplied out by however many LRMboats are locked on to you or more is negligible.

You shouldn't be getting rained on by multiple LRM boats like that though, like I said, and even in the case of getting rained on AMS does mitigate a pretty good amount of damage considering how many missiles are hitting you if it's raining LRMs.

Quote

To that negligible end you have sacrificed a minimum of 1 ton to perhaps 3t plus (to have coverage for the entire match), tonnage that could have been applied to larger engine for faster speed, more cooling, more lazors, (insert your favorite weapon type here).

You really shouldn't need more than 2 tons total for AMS (0.5 ton AMS, 1.5 tons of ammo; or even just 1 ton of ammo) for most mechs considering a ton of ammo is 2,000 rounds, which is a lot. Also, for some mechs/builds (assault mechs in particular) it can be difficult to find a better use of that tonnage when upgrading the engine is inefficient (e.g going from 300 to 305 rated engine) or when adding more firepower means running too hot; more cooling is a bit of a different story but it's also possible to not have enough crit space for 2-3 tons of heatsinks yet have barely enough crit space for 2-3 tons of AMS & ammo.

Anyways, people who apparently need to use AMS don't even try to use it ever on top of being complete scrubs because they get demolished by LRMs, and then we get threads like this whining about how LRMs are so OP and unfair and the scrub in question can't possibly be at fault for being a huge scrub.

[KHETTI]

Hey OP if you are struggling against LRM boats here is 3 tips to help you not be so frustrated....
1.Use cover, always be aware of where there is cover and never be to far away from it, don't ignore missile warnings, get into cover pronto.
2.Consider using mechs with ECM (never pass up ECM on mechs that can equip it), not only does it give you immunity from LRMs, you can provide this immunity to friendlies too.
3. Consider buying a Radar Deprivation module, its like a toned down version of ECM and the best part is you can put it on anything.

PS. Seriously guys, no need to be so toxic.

Edited by KHETTI, 13 August 2016 - 06:28 PM.

[El Bandito]

KHETTI, on 13 August 2016 - 06:25 PM, said:

Hey OP if you are struggling against LRM boats here is 3 tips to help you not be so frustrated....
1.Use cover, always be aware of where there is cover and never be to far away from it, don't ignore missile warnings, get into cover pronto.
2.Consider using mechs with ECM (never pass up ECM on mechs that can equip it), not only does it give you immunity from LRMs, you can provide this immunity to friendlies too.
3. Consider buying a Radar Deprivation module, its like a toned down version of ECM and the best part is you can put it on anything.

PS. Seriously guys, no need to be so toxic.

I would add that the current LRM proliferation is for the event duration only. Once the event ends, so will most of those Assault LRM boats. OP needs to chill the **** out until the event ends, or jump onto an ECM mech.

[Kael Posavatz]

Kyrie, on 13 August 2016 - 01:39 PM, said:

For the record, AMS is fairly useless unless everyone uses it and stays in close proximiity of each other.

Step 1) Get a Kit Fox, 3xAMS, overburst, and range modules
Step 2) Fine enemy King Crab acting as missile boat
Step 3) Climb on top of King Crab (or just walk behind it)
Step 4) Laugh

There is a video of this somewhere. Needs to go find it.