65 replies to this topic

[SamsungNinja]

Wait, let me get this straight.

1. You play an online, service-based multiplayer game with regular patches and changes.
2. You made the conscious decision to purchase 'mechs in order to master the chassis.
3. You made the conscious decision to sell those 'mechs.
4. A patch changes the way you master 'mechs.
5. You no longer have the required 'mechs due to selling them under the assumption that nothing would change in an online game with regular patches.
6. This is somehow PGI's fault and you will stop playing if they do this.

Did I miss something? This is why you don't sell 'mechs. If you didn't know that intuitively, then The Quirkening should have clued you into it. If multiple years of patches constantly tweaking the game didn't teach you that today's hotness is tomorrow's sadness (and vice versa), then I really don't know what to tell you.

You sold the 'mechs, that's on you. You made the assumption that nothing would change, and that's on you. Cutting corners to avoid buying 'mech bays? You also made that choice.

So, two take-aways: 1) Not PGI's fault. 2) Delayed consequences are a b@#$%.

Additionally, the defense of "well, how was I supposed to know" works out as well here as it does when someone finds out that they were supposed to be regularly changing the oil in their car.

Edited by SamsungNinja, 01 September 2016 - 04:20 PM.

[Chemie]

Sorry Samsung but you are wrong
PGI said "no resets" and making a mastered mech no longer master, without ability to stay master, is a reset.

[Pjwned]

SamsungNinja, on 01 September 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

Wait, let me get this straight.

1. You play an online, service-based multiplayer game with regular patches and changes.
2. You made the conscious decision to purchase 'mechs in order to master the chassis.
3. You made the conscious decision to sell those 'mechs.
4. A patch changes the way you master 'mechs.
5. You no longer have the required 'mechs due to selling them under the assumption that nothing would change in an online game with regular patches.
6. This is somehow PGI's fault and you will stop playing if they do this.

Did I miss something? This is why you don't sell 'mechs. If you didn't know that intuitively, then The Quirkening should have clued you into it. If multiple years of patches constantly tweaking the game didn't teach you that today's hotness is tomorrow's sadness (and vice versa), then I really don't know what to tell you.

You sold the 'mechs, that's on you. You made the assumption that nothing would change, and that's on you. Cutting corners to avoid buying 'mech bays? You also made that choice.

So, two take-aways: 1) Not PGI's fault. 2) Delayed consequences are a b@#$%.

Additionally, the defense of "well, how was I supposed to know" works out as well here as it does when someone finds out that they were supposed to be regularly changing the oil in their car.

It would be PGI's fault for changing the skill tree in such a way as to screw over numerous players.

Of course players who sold their mechs would be at some minor level of fault, but if PGI willingly screws people over in such a way then obviously they take pretty much all of the blame for doing that instead of doing it differently.

[MadcatX]

Chemie, on 01 September 2016 - 04:36 PM, said:

Sorry Samsung but you are wrong
PGI said "no resets" and making a mastered mech no longer master, without ability to stay master, is a reset.

If they're revamping it but are still going to use XP, which I can't see why they wouldn't, then it'll be pretty easy to refund that XP from the chassis accumulated it so that you can re-allocate it elsewheres.

Mind you, they might revamp it so that you can no longer "master" it (i.e. unlock an additional slot) but some other thing entirely.

[El Bandito]

Not gonna flip out over hearsay, but should PGI require me to re-buy the missing chassis, I will be pissed. Because this is not just about one or two mechs anymore. It will mean re-purchasing at least 30+ mechs in my case.

Eff. That.

[DovisKhan]

SamsungNinja, on 01 September 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

Wait, let me get this straight.

1. You play an online, service-based multiplayer game with regular patches and changes.
2. You made the conscious decision to purchase 'mechs in order to master the chassis.
3. You made the conscious decision to sell those 'mechs.
4. A patch changes the way you master 'mechs.
5. You no longer have the required 'mechs due to selling them under the assumption that nothing would change in an online game with regular patches.
6. This is somehow PGI's fault and you will stop playing if they do this.

Did I miss something? This is why you don't sell 'mechs. If you didn't know that intuitively, then The Quirkening should have clued you into it. If multiple years of patches constantly tweaking the game didn't teach you that today's hotness is tomorrow's sadness (and vice versa), then I really don't know what to tell you.

You sold the 'mechs, that's on you. You made the assumption that nothing would change, and that's on you. Cutting corners to avoid buying 'mech bays? You also made that choice.

So, two take-aways: 1) Not PGI's fault. 2) Delayed consequences are a b@#$%.

Additionally, the defense of "well, how was I supposed to know" works out as well here as it does when someone finds out that they were supposed to be regularly changing the oil in their car.

They mastered the mechs under previous conditions, so yes, if PGI doesn't carry over that experience - they are screwing all those players

[Xetelian]

If I have to rebuy the HGN and AWS to get my Pretty Baby and Heavy Metal through the skill tree again I will be seriously frustrated.

They really need to drop this 3 variant bullcrap

[oldradagast]

SamsungNinja, on 01 September 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

Additionally, the defense of "well, how was I supposed to know" works out as well here as it does when someone finds out that they were supposed to be regularly changing the oil in their car.

Wrong on so many levels. You are basically using the excuse "it's an online game, and anything can happen in it" to justify PGI potentially completely hosing its customers when they know full well that the vast majority of them sell worthless or boring mech variants because they have zero interest in wasting money or time collecting junk. That is laughable logic and can be used to justify anything - "it's life, and anything can happen" - while attempting to relieve PGI of any responsibility to its customers. And if there's one thing I'm tired of, it's listening to people defend corporate BS at the expense of everyone else.

No. PGI knows full well that most players sell their extra mechs, and they also know full well that most players only bought the 3 mechs needed to master the mech. If they introduce a new system that creates totally different requirements to master a mech (which forces us to buy up and master a lot of junk again) or they simply fail to give us full credit for all the mechs we've mastered and sold, this game will die overnight as the remaining players walk away in disgust.

Edited by oldradagast, 02 September 2016 - 03:09 AM.

[KodiakGW]

Xetelian, on 02 September 2016 - 12:34 AM, said:

They really need to drop this 3 variant bullcrap

Agreed, they needed to drop that years ago. I was never a fan of the Atlas, so the only one I kept was the Loyatly one, which I can't sell (and have two). Was BS that I needed to buy two more just to get that one leveled, considering I had already mastered a number of other assaults long before working on them.

I think the people they are going to miff off the most are the ones who used MC to make GXP to level mechs. I did that once in early beta before determining that mech XP was really easy to earn, with A LOT of patience in some cases.

Man, that WVR-7D(L) is going to be rusted solid once this goes through. And I know not to have support remove it, because they will give it uber quirks the patch after I have that done.

[4rcs1ne]

An easy way to get around this would be to just allow someone to master ONE variant at a time and ditch the "Must have at least 3 variants to master" rule.

Edited by Matt2496, 02 September 2016 - 05:03 AM.

[RAM]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 01 September 2016 - 03:45 PM, said:

you now need ALL the variants. So you have to buy the heroes as well!!! bwa ha haaaa

I have long been of the view that that is how 'mastery' should work; unfortunately, I may well be the only one

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 01 September 2016 - 03:45 PM, said:

and full mastery makes all the previous skills be zx their normal value where z is the number of variants you own bwa ha haaa

This is an extremely interesting suggestion!


RAM
ELH

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

El Bandito, on 01 September 2016 - 11:51 PM, said:

Not gonna flip out over hearsay, but should PGI require me to re-buy the missing chassis, I will be pissed. Because this is not just about one or two mechs anymore. It will mean re-purchasing at least 30+ mechs in my case.

Eff. That.

Hopefully they wont be that stu-....

hmm

yeah

[patataman]

SamsungNinja, on 01 September 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

Wait, let me get this straight.

1. You play an online, service-based multiplayer game with regular patches and changes.
2. You made the conscious decision to purchase 'mechs in order to master the chassis.
3. You made the conscious decision to sell those 'mechs.
4. A patch changes the way you master 'mechs.
5. You no longer have the required 'mechs due to selling them under the assumption that nothing would change in an online game with regular patches.
6. This is somehow PGI's fault and you will stop playing if they do this.

Did I miss something? This is why you don't sell 'mechs. If you didn't know that intuitively, then The Quirkening should have clued you into it. If multiple years of patches constantly tweaking the game didn't teach you that today's hotness is tomorrow's sadness (and vice versa), then I really don't know what to tell you.

You sold the 'mechs, that's on you. You made the assumption that nothing would change, and that's on you. Cutting corners to avoid buying 'mech bays? You also made that choice.

So, two take-aways: 1) Not PGI's fault. 2) Delayed consequences are a b@#$%.

Additionally, the defense of "well, how was I supposed to know" works out as well here as it does when someone finds out that they were supposed to be regularly changing the oil in their car.

I'd agree if the old skill tree had been used for... idk 6 months? It's 4 years later.

I hope PGI maintains the XP cost of mastering each variant (currently 60000+ XP points) and allow variants mastered under the old system to stay mastered.

If they try to force me to rebuy all the mastered variants, my reaction would be:

1) ROLF
2) ggclothes PGI
3) Stop playing until the next patch.
4) If there are no changes in that patch, uninstall.

[MrJeffers]

Chemie, on 01 September 2016 - 04:36 PM, said:

Sorry Samsung but you are wrong
PGI said "no resets" and making a mastered mech no longer master, without ability to stay master, is a reset.

not quite - they said no more account resets, which is a completely different thing.

The XP on existing trees will be refunded, the problem arises in how to re-apply that XP in the new tree if you no longer have the mech which is something that can't currently be done.
But that really should be a relatively simple change from just Owned/Not Owned (today) to Owned/Formerly Owned/Non Owned (skill tree 2.0), and allowing XP to be applied in both the Owned/Formerly Owned status types for mechs. But then again, with PGI nothing is easy...

[C E Dwyer]

Prosperity Park, on 31 August 2016 - 02:46 PM, said:

What I foresee...

All XP invested into your variants will be refunded as MechXP specific to those variants, regardless if you used MechXP or GXP to level them. Mechs you have sold will still have the MechXP pool refilled, but you will have to buy them back to level them. Once you buy them back you don't have to play them again, since their XP will be waiting there for you to reinvest it into the new skill tree.

The 3 variant rule will be "reinvented" in the context of the new skill trees, but we don't know enough about the new trees to even guess how the 3 Mech rule will be modified to fit the new tree environment.

Older, established players will both rejoice at the new trees and complain about having to re-buy their sold mechs. New players will like it, as they are not selling Mechs after leveling. The biggest complaints will come from people that used exhaustive amounts of GXP to level their mechs, as they feel entitled to have their GXP refunded as GXP, whereas it will only be refunded as MechXP specific to those variants they were invested into.

Actually I used my GXP to open the modules (pilot skills)

[Appogee]

I haven't sold a single Mech since Paul introduced QuirkLotto.

But unlike real world lotto, there's a better than average chance that yesterday's unpopular variants will be tomorrow's must-have meta-tastic uberquirked variants.

(So, hang in there, Vindicator fans.)

[LT. HARDCASE]

If PGI is keeping the 'Basic -> Eliite -> Master' format, they aren't going to undo the levels you've already earned. At most they'd refund the XP and let you spend it again within the revamped tree.

Such an idiotic thought from the OP, but of course people ran with it.

[Mechteric]

With whatever new system they should just let you spend your mech XP without owning the mech, just makes sense

[MadcatX]

LT. HARDCASE, on 02 September 2016 - 12:40 PM, said:

If PGI is keeping the 'Basic -> Eliite -> Master' format, they aren't going to undo the levels you've already earned. At most they'd refund the XP and let you spend it again within the revamped tree.

Such an idiotic thought from the OP, but of course people ran with it.

I sure as heck hope they don't reveamp the placeholder skills with another set of placeholder skills.

[Tsar Bomba]

My concern is that the end result will be an increased need to convert XP. Either to make up for the difference in the conversion, or as a generic aspect of the new system. I really hope this isn't their intent, and I am not so jaded (and I'm now a jade statue over this game) to think that will be their final goal. Ah well, they let HBS use their mech models so I started playing again and am giving them more money.

KodiakGW, on 02 September 2016 - 04:42 AM, said:

Man, that WVR-7D(L) is going to be rusted solid once this goes through. And I know not to have support remove it, because they will give it uber quirks the patch after I have that done.

LOL, I am trying to master this right now. Not a pleasant experience. (Also, does the jam chance quirk actually increase the chance it will jam? Sure seems that way. =D)