44 replies to this topic

[Nightmare1]

Yep, Torso Twist does wonders for boosting your TTK. However, since most people can't grasp that concept, we have to have things like Ghost Heat and ED, lol.

At 4:17, another example of how Torso Twisting will let you outfight a KDK-3, lol.

[Liveish]

Maker L106, on 03 September 2016 - 03:59 PM, said:

Wait... so running an XL on a larger IS mech isn't strait up suicide. Don't get me wrong I twist on incoming. Started playing the game with a panther learning to shield side then moved on to mediums and heavys (clan / is) because i suck at lights and currently feel like i suck with assaults as well.

XL Marauder tests here I come!

YES YES YES YES XL IS suicide in most( Med +) IS mechs, Some have buffs.

Also depends on who is shooting you, anyone that can aim you will be killed fast

[Maker L106]

Nightmare1, on 04 September 2016 - 04:18 PM, said:

Yep, Torso Twist does wonders for boosting your TTK. However, since most people can't grasp that concept, we have to have things like Ghost Heat and ED, lol.

At 4:17, another example of how Torso Twisting will let you outfight a KDK-3, lol.

I actually had something similar happen during my first few outings running an XL with my SRM / Laser Marauder, worked well enough to face an already damaged KDK-3 and a Jenner (no idea what kind) and survive. I didn't get the killing blow mind you, but i stripped his armor really well in the process of losing most of mine then running away around cover. Wound up tanking another face to face engagement on what little armor i had left to get the team at his back. I felt lucky, had he fired one more time, i'd have been out regardless where it went. MY BH2 would have probably fought strait better but wouldn't have had the movement to move away. Though to be fair the Marauder treats me better than any other mech right now anyway.

live1991, on 04 September 2016 - 04:25 PM, said:

YES YES YES YES XL IS suicide in most( Med +) IS mechs, Some have buffs.

Also depends on who is shooting you, anyone that can aim you will be killed fast

I'll be sure to keep an eye on what and why I get wrecked when running these for a while and hopefully I do a good enough job for it to be worth the trouble. If not it won't hurt me to put it up until i improve.

Also about the crit padding. I'd certainly believe that based on what i've seen from running games where I bank on getting crits on weapons / ammo etc: So wouldn't surprise me if that worked.

[BabyCakes666]

it appears twist to win dose have merit to it

[SQW]

counter to torso twist: R key. On average, waiting to put your shots on vulnerable locations will kill quicker than shoot as soon as your weapons are reloaded. The latter is the reason is why torso twist works despite throwing off your own aim.

[jaxjace]

El Bandito, on 02 September 2016 - 05:30 PM, said:

One reason some people had been advocating big XL Marauders and Krabs, against popular conceptions.

This, Max XL everything or die to lack of twist and speed.

[InspectorG]

El Bandito, on 02 September 2016 - 05:30 PM, said:

One reason some people had been advocating big XL Marauders and Krabs, against popular conceptions.

Leveraging hardpoints and terrain + speed vs tanking in a brawl.

Current meta favors poking.

[SQW]

jaxjace, on 04 September 2016 - 08:21 PM, said:

This, Max XL everything or die to lack of twist and speed.

There's nothing 'new' about using big XLs. Those are your typical glass cannon builds. It's debatable whether it's even worth the risk in an IS assault mech. Twisting is suppose to protect your vulnerable CT but if you are just presenting your less armored ST, then it's just as likely a smart opponent will core you anyway through fire discipline.

An XL KGC is usually a TERRIBLE idea unless you are faced with a low tier opponent. The reason why OP survived so long is because his opponents were trying to leg him after stripping away all his ST/CT armor for some reason.

Edited by SQW, 04 September 2016 - 08:37 PM.

[Blue Boutique]

jaxjace, on 04 September 2016 - 08:21 PM, said:

This, Max XL everything or die to lack of twist and speed.

E

SQW, on 04 September 2016 - 08:36 PM, said:

There's nothing 'new' about using big XLs. Those are your typical glass cannon builds. It's debatable whether it's even worth the risk in an IS assault mech. Twisting is suppose to protect your vulnerable CT but if you are just presenting your less armored ST, then it's just as likely a smart opponent will core you anyway through fire discipline.

An XL KGC is usually a TERRIBLE idea unless you are faced with a low tier opponent. The reason why OP survived so long is because his opponents were trying to leg him after stripping away all his ST/CT armor for some reason.

Zeus, Victors, Battlemasters, Cyclops, Atlas and Banshees can go XL due to their higher engine caps and beefy arms.. Its actually better to hit back harder with good twist/turn rates rather than to suffer with a pitiful weapons DPS due to similar but heavier STD engines.

[BabyCakes666]

Blue Boutique, on 05 September 2016 - 12:04 AM, said:

E

Zeus, Victors, Battlemasters, Cyclops, Atlas and Banshees can go XL due to their higher engine caps and beefy arms.. Its actually better to hit back harder with good twist/turn rates rather than to suffer with a pitiful weapons DPS due to similar but heavier STD engines.

XL means no AC20 on some mechs :/

im all for more DPS thats why im an XL guy

Edited by BabyCakes666, 05 September 2016 - 12:28 AM.

[Navid A1]

BabyCakes666, on 02 September 2016 - 06:16 PM, said:

armyunit, on 02 September 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

>XL Atlas

i run them

the only problem is no AC20

Spoiler

[BabyCakes666]

Navid A1, on 05 September 2016 - 12:19 AM, said:

Spoiler

XL atlas is great idk wtf your people are on abut

gos fast shoots hard

[sneeking]

I have never been a fan of standard engines i like speed and mobility, something i always remember seeing far to much from players is arm lock.

While not directly related to the tanking side of torso twist it still limits the speed at which you can look then shy away from a hit because when unlocked your FOV actualy leads rotation.

Players who strip arms and sacrifice them as shielding are especially prone to this mistake.

[Navid A1]

BabyCakes666, on 05 September 2016 - 12:30 AM, said:

XL atlas is great idk wtf your people are on abut

gos fast shoots hard

yup... sometimes potatoes on the enemy team or miraculous luck give new players false impressions.

just don't man... don't!

Its good for lols... but please don't say its great... just... don't

[BabyCakes666]

Navid A1, on 05 September 2016 - 02:38 AM, said:

yup... sometimes potatoes on the enemy team or miraculous luck give new players false impressions.

just don't man... don't!

Its good for lols... but please don't say its great... just... don't

i need a reason not to have an XL atlas

so far XL atlas is the best just twist and derp

[SQW]

BabyCakes666, on 05 September 2016 - 03:09 AM, said:

i need a reason not to have an XL atlas

so far XL atlas is the best just twist and derp

An atlas's right torso gets shot out faster than the back of a Rifleman. If you want speed, go with Heavy. XL on an IS assault is just asking for trouble. Yes, it works wonders against a potato team but then so would anything else.

[El Bandito]

BabyCakes666, on 05 September 2016 - 03:09 AM, said:

i need a reason not to have an XL atlas

so far XL atlas is the best just twist and derp

You are using Boar's Head, where its large amount of arm energy hardpoints ensure that having no AC20 is not that big of a deal. Try other Atlases and then come back.

Oh, and your opponents (at least in the video) were derp.

Edited by El Bandito, 05 September 2016 - 03:49 AM.

[Red Shrike]

I find torso twisting only useful when my weapons are on cooldown.

[BabyCakes666]

El Bandito, on 05 September 2016 - 03:48 AM, said:

You are using Boar's Head, where its large amount of arm energy hardpoints ensure that having no AC20 is not that big of a deal. Try other Atlases and then come back.

Oh, and your opponents (at least in the video) were derp.

going nuts in the DDC with a STD 350

i like to std engine makes the atlas more tanky

but with the torso twist i got a much longer life span

but i hate becoming a stick no weapons all i can do i cap and ram

my XL atlas S still saves the day dat sweet 85 alpha

[Nightmare1]

live1991, on 04 September 2016 - 04:25 PM, said:

YES YES YES YES XL IS suicide in most( Med +) IS mechs, Some have buffs.

Also depends on who is shooting you, anyone that can aim you will be killed fast

Uh, actually no, XL IS Mechs are not "suicide" most of the time, lol. What part of any of this looks like suicide?









There are three classic concepts in any combat game. You have speed, firepower, and health. Generally speaking, most games will allow you to choose two and force you to forsake the third. MWO is no different. Which two you choose depends on your personal play style as well as the game design and players. In MWO, it is most important to have speed and firepower. Hence, XL engines are generally more useful than Standards since they allow you to have both. Standard are only useful for when you know you will need to tank.

Personally, I run Standards in my Atlases and most of my HBKs and Thunderbolts. Pretty much all of my other 130 Mechs have XL engines. It hasn't resulted in "suicide" yet.

Maker L106, on 04 September 2016 - 04:36 PM, said:

I actually had something similar happen during my first few outings running an XL with my SRM / Laser Marauder, worked well enough to face an already damaged KDK-3 and a Jenner (no idea what kind) and survive. I didn't get the killing blow mind you, but i stripped his armor really well in the process of losing most of mine then running away around cover. Wound up tanking another face to face engagement on what little armor i had left to get the team at his back. I felt lucky, had he fired one more time, i'd have been out regardless where it went. MY BH2 would have probably fought strait better but wouldn't have had the movement to move away. Though to be fair the Marauder treats me better than any other mech right now anyway.

I know, right? Although, in the interest of transparency, that Archer was a Standard engine build and not an XL.

That being said, I run XLs in over half my IS Mechs. It's high-risk, high-reward, but it pays off more times than it doesn't.

Side note about that video, believe it or not, I actually survived to the very end and was the last man standing. It came down to me and a crippled ACH with the old, "Whoever gets in the first shot wins!" scenario. Fortunately, I was quicker on the draw.