51 replies to this topic

[TooDumbToQuit]

I like the SPL Brawler better. But remember, the TC does not help the LBX and does so little to help the SPLs that IMO, it is not worth it and I'm big on TCs.

As far as helping with Criticals, that is interesting but you get 5% with a TC1 and only 8% for the 6 tons more from the TC 7. So I'm not sure 3% is worth 6 tons. Most people say that after a TC1, the pluses are rarely worth the extra tonnage.

6 extra heatsinks again would keep you firing more and longer. But then they would not fit.....

[S 0 L E N Y A]

Arugela, on 06 September 2016 - 03:10 PM, said:

Oh, C'mon! You wouldn't want 110 damage at 1k range!! ;d

Unless you are shooting at a mech with no pilot you wont be hitting anywhere near that much damage at any range.
1) that build breaks ghost heat in the worst way 2) the regular heat will get you 3) the durration (burn time) of clan ER-LL is an eternity 4) never use regular clan ACs over ultras. They come with a size disadvantage and offer no benefit in return. Dont want your UAC to jam? Dont double tap it.

[Arugela]

It suprisingly has good recover from heat. You have to wait 2 seconds between shots too start. so it gets a little recovery. and if you do left then right so you are not fireing all 10 you don't go through as much heat. You can do 5-7 swipes without going through full heat. Only an alpha does most of the heat. And I think it only fills up most of the way on terra therma. Plus the full 10% range is nice as you can add the other range to the smalls so they get to the range of the er small lasers.

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Boogie138, on 07 September 2016 - 12:58 AM, said:

Unless you are shooting at a mech with no pilot you wont be hitting anywhere near that much damage at any range.
1) that build breaks ghost heat in the worst way 2) the regular heat will get you 3) the durration (burn time) of clan ER-LL is an eternity 4) never use regular clan ACs over ultras. They come with a size disadvantage and offer no benefit in return. Dont want your UAC to jam? Dont double tap it.

Arugela, on 07 September 2016 - 01:47 AM, said:

It suprisingly has good recover from heat. You have to wait 2 seconds between shots too start. so it gets a little recovery. and if you do left then right so you are not fireing all 10 you don't go through as much heat. You can do 5-7 swipes without going through full heat. Only an alpha does most of the heat. And I think it only fills up most of the way on terra therma. Plus the full 10% range is nice as you can add the other range to the smalls so they get to the range of the er small lasers.

I dont think ER small lasers hit out at 1k range... So i am pretty sure boogie138 is refering to your ac5 +10 er LL mech...

Arugela, on 06 September 2016 - 01:53 PM, said:

I was just messing with my one build and came up with something interesting.

Can you use two targeting computers in one build?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...755c007472b4a12
or
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...075b3e52c3927ef

NVM, got in game and it wouldn't allow it. That would be devastating if it worked.

2 heat sinks is not enough to cool 4 clan ERLL... And 10 is ridiculous... Yes you can direstar mechs... But you sacrifice your own mech in the process... Troll build is a troll build...

I dont know what yo mean by swipes but regardless of what you mean, boogie138 is completely spot on in his assessment.

If you wont listen to me, at least listen to what others are saying... And before you smurfy up another monstrosity... Please do some research first... Take a look at other (non-troll... Non-joke) mechs people have made and look for reasonings on why they equiped what ever it is thats on their mechs.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

With something like 4-6 C ER L, PPC or L pulse I have 15-20 extra heatsinks. 10 could hardly be enough unless you intend to carry those lasers for nothing.

[Arugela]

Swipes mean 5 lasers or one hand at a time. I set my hotkeys to each hand so I can do them separate to reduce heat. I don't normally fire them all at once. Think like one two punches in boxing. I hit left then right. I can do 5-7 or even more individual punches without maxing heat. This also means I don't fire the other hand until the other hand is done fireing. Because that would spike heat more than normal. I always fire one side(5 lasers) then wait for the lasers to finish then do the other side. Wait for cooldown and repeat. The same would apply to the ERlarge lasers. It reduces heat drastically compared to firing them all at once.

BTW, does anyone know if having Mk7 TC 75%target gathering, 25 from CAP, and 25 from Target gathering mech mod would do anything beyond the norm? I wonder if stacking them all would be useful.

Edited by Arugela, 07 September 2016 - 03:16 AM.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Arugela, on 07 September 2016 - 02:57 AM, said:

I can do 5-7 or even more individual punches without maxing heat. This also means I don't fire the other hand until the other hand is done fireing. Because that would spike heat more than normal. I always fire one side(5 lasers) then wait for the lasers to finish then do the other side. Wait for cooldown and repeat. The same would apply to the ERlarge lasers. It reduces heat drastically compared to firing them all at once.

It avoids ghost heat, are you familiar with what it is? You need to know if not.

Anyway with assult you will need ballistic. Lasers won't alone do no matter how you build it, close range, mid- or long-.

If you try to fight another assult with something like (clan) medium pulse, you will be able to fire few times until you are limited by heat, where as enemy assult can pump 50-100 damage in just few seconds without building much heat. You will not survive that.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

As you suspected, there's something odd about flamers. I tried 7 with DW, the longer I fired them, the faster the heat built up. Just shooting the ground or air. Taken account effect of acceleration by staying still.

You can test them on testing grounds, or academy for that matter too. The heat generated by them, to my mech, accelerated about 20% / 40 / 60% and 80% positions. It depends of how long I'm firing the flamers, if I build up heat with lasers to like 70%, at first they fire for long time with slow heat buildup.

The same effect works with just one flamer, but it takes much longer time to even get the first "accelerated" heat phase.

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Arugela, on 07 September 2016 - 02:57 AM, said:

Swipes mean 5 lasers or one hand at a time. I set my hotkeys to each hand so I can do them separate to reduce heat. I don't normally fire them all at once. Think like one two punches in boxing. I hit left then right. I can do 5-7 or even more individual punches without maxing heat. This also means I don't fire the other hand until the other hand is done fireing. Because that would spike heat more than normal. I always fire one side(5 lasers) then wait for the lasers to finish then do the other side. Wait for cooldown and repeat. The same would apply to the ERlarge lasers. It reduces heat drastically compared to firing them all at once.

BTW, does anyone know if having Mk7 TC 75%target gathering, 25 from CAP, and 25 from Target gathering mech mod would do anything beyond the norm? I wonder if stacking them all would be useful.

You are still talking nonsense... 2 heat sinks cannot cool two different sets of 5x clan ER Large Lasers... Especially not 5 to 7 times...

5x ER Large lasers incure MASSIVE amounts of ghost heat. So please stop trolling!

[TooDumbToQuit]

Teer5, on 07 September 2016 - 04:17 AM, said:

As you suspected, there's something odd about flamers. I tried 7 with DW, the longer I fired them, the faster the heat built up. Just shooting the ground or air. Taken account effect of acceleration by staying still. You can test them on testing grounds, or academy for that matter too. The heat generated by them, to my mech, accelerated about 20% / 40 / 60% and 80% positions. It depends of how long I'm firing the flamers, if I build up heat with lasers to like 70%, at first they fire for long time with slow heat buildup. The same effect works with just one flamer, but it takes much longer time to even get the first "accelerated" heat phase.

OMG, someone finally answered me after 3 months about asking about Flamers. I cannot believe that with so many people here understanding every little thing, they cannot or will not explain Flamers and the way they ALL heat up at the same time even if you are only using 1 out of 10 mounted.

I do not have a stopwatch but "counting it off" you get 6 seconds of firing them before they reach full heat (their bar goes all the way red). And it takes 10 seconds without using them for them to come down.

Using my KDK-1 FlameBear, I did find that I could use only one Flamer and I was able to keep heat at 4% for a while. I guess I was using them on smaller Mechs with fewer heatsinks and that made even one go up quicker.

My Flamer use goals are to 1) Get the enemy Mech up to 90% as quick as possible. And 2) (and this is harder) to keep him there. I think you need at least 4 Flamers to get the Enemy to 90% within 3-4 seconds but I'm not sure because I can't freaking Flame myself to try it.

But thank you so much for mentioning them. I was wondering if there was some legal reason no one could talk about them. (I got a message yesterday that I had violated the code of conduct or something like that)

Arugela, on 07 September 2016 - 02:57 AM, said:

Swipes mean 5 lasers or one hand at a time.

I knew at once what he meant by "Swipes" and I loved it, he is getting into it.

I hate to ask what a "Troll build" is. I guess it means "stupid" so many of mine would, I'm sure, fit in there.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky, on 07 September 2016 - 08:40 AM, said:

You are still talking nonsense... 2 heat sinks cannot cool two different sets of 5x clan ER Large Lasers... Especially not 5 to 7 times...

5x ER Large lasers incure MASSIVE amounts of ghost heat. So please stop trolling!

He's not trolling, he's new to game and assults. And with 5 lasers he referred to (clan) medium or small.

"Swipes mean 5 lasers or one hand at a time. ******I always fire one side(5 lasers) then wait for the lasers to finish then do the other side. The same would apply to the ERlarge lasers."

The same for ERL refers to grouping the lasers by side, not having 5 in same group and firing them at same time.

[TooDumbToQuit]

From what he is saying, he is not getting the chance to test his builds. I think if he went to a hot map and started firing, he would go....."oooo, this will not work".

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Arugela, on 06 September 2016 - 01:53 PM, said:

I was just messing with my one build and came up with something interesting.

Can you use two targeting computers in one build?
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...755c007472b4a12
or
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...075b3e52c3927ef

NVM, got in game and it wouldn't allow it. That would be devastating if it worked.

Teer5, on 07 September 2016 - 09:24 AM, said:

He's not trolling, he's new to game and assults. And with 5 lasers he referred to (clan) medium or small.

"Swipes mean 5 lasers or one hand at a time. ******I always fire one side(5 lasers) then wait for the lasers to finish then do the other side. The same would apply to the ERlarge lasers."

The same for ERL refers to grouping the lasers by side, not having 5 in same group and firing them at same time.

As you can see in the build he posted (http://mwo.smurfy-ne...755c007472b4a12)... There are 5x Clan ER Large Lasers in each hand which equals 10x ER Large Lasers.

So if he fires a swipe (5x Clan ER Large Lasers), he will incure massive amounts of ghost heat. 2 heat sinks cannot cool this five to seven times... And I am not even counting the non-ultra Ac5.

This is a troll build because posting garbage like this trolls other new players. They will come to these forums and copy peoples mechs... They will go into a real battle and accidentally suicide them selves!

I dont want new players to use a mech like this, as their first mech they saved their recruit money for... Suicide and then quit the game because they cant afford a new mech...

But this Arugela person is desperatelly trying to make people quit the game by frantically posting all these troll builds all over the forums.

[TooDumbToQuit]

Hmmm, Ok, I see your point.

But IMO, anyone that does not take a new load out to the testing grounds first is a fool and often a hazard to his teammates as he shoots them in their backs while he is testing things out 20 seconds after a drop.

What would pick me off would be the money I sunk into a Build that does not work.

But I do understand what you are talking about. And why you are pointing it out.

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

LikeUntoGod, on 07 September 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

Hmmm, Ok, I see your point.

But IMO, anyone that does not take a new load out to the testing grounds first is a fool and often a hazard to his teammates as he shoots them in their backs while he is testing things out 20 seconds after a drop.

What would pick me off would be the money I sunk into a Build that does not work.

But I do understand what you are talking about. And why you are pointing it out.

The problem lies with new players who literally cannot afford the cbills to even test out mechs. They usually have to go all in on their first mech. They go for broke... In hopes they werent misled when they come into the forums.

Im trying my best to protect new players from having to experience this hell. Because nothing is worse then blowing your recruit money on a troll build that is ment to suicide the pilot. Because now they cant afford a new mech for a long long time... Since they cant even improve their c-bill farming with a new powerful mech.

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky, on 07 September 2016 - 09:46 AM, said:

As you can see in the build he posted (http://mwo.smurfy-ne...755c007472b4a12)... There are 5x Clan ER Large Lasers in each hand which equals 10x ER Large Lasers.

So if he fires a swipe (5x Clan ER Large Lasers), he will incure massive amounts of ghost heat. 2 heat sinks cannot cool this five to seven times... And I am not even counting the non-ultra Ac5.

This is a troll build because posting garbage like this trolls other new players. They will come to these forums and copy peoples mechs... They will go into a real battle and accidentally suicide them selves!

I dont want new players to use a mech like this, as their first mech they saved their recruit money for... Suicide and then quit the game because they cant afford a new mech...

But this Arugela person is desperatelly trying to make people quit the game by frantically posting all these troll builds all over the forums.

Well, would a troll really go so far?. I don't think so. According to leaderboard Arugela played 3 games as assult on season two, and on current season three 104 games, with W/L ratio of 0.67. Which fits his Kodian builds. But that's a lot of games for just someone who wants to troll on forum.

So for me he seems genuine. And in this thread, he is not trying to convince others how great his Kodiak build is, but trying to improve it. (and installing some lasers and ballistic is only way to go)

I guess I'm not a noob anymore but more like immediate player who's played intensively for the summer and little bit before that, but I remember when the late assult sales came and I finally got my first assult, I ran this build for about 10 games and then started to improve it.

http://i.imgur.com/kx32Hhu.jpg

[Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky]

Teer5, on 07 September 2016 - 11:34 AM, said:

Well, would a troll really go so far?. I don't think so. According to leaderboard Arugela played 3 games as assult on season two, and on current season three 104 games, with W/L ratio of 0.67. Which fits his Kodian builds. But that's a lot of games for just someone who wants to troll on forum.

So for me he seems genuine. And in this thread, he is not trying to convince others how great his Kodiak build is, but trying to improve it. (and installing some lasers and ballistic is only way to go)

I guess I'm not a noob anymore but more like immediate player who's played intensively for the summer and little bit before that, but I remember when the late assult sales came and I finally got my first assult, I ran this build for about 10 games and then started to improve it.

http://i.imgur.com/kx32Hhu.jpg

Due to how ghost heat works, your build runs many many times cooler then the one in question. (Yes your 2 er PPCs run cooler because they are on a different weapon type). So if you didnt like the build your running, imagine something far far worse!

Edit, plus you have way more heatsinks... The two builds arent even comparable...

Troll build is a troll build... Gigadrill laser builds and the like are literally suicide mechs.

Here is a video about troll builds:

Edited by Aleksandr Sergeyevich Kerensky, 07 September 2016 - 12:06 PM.

[TooDumbToQuit]

I'm having a problem getting more than 4 TCs into this build......

[Arugela]

I'm seeing where the confusion is. I have tested most of the builds. The confusion is we have a mix up of which builds are which. The 5-7 builds swipeing is from the small pulse laser build. The large laser build is untested because I don't have the money atm! 8)

The ERRL build has not been teseted but I figured if it can fire without overheating each hand it's a long range one and might work. I just don't know how much overheating it does. The Medium pulse laser is 30 heat per hand... I get about 44% in practice in the bar. The ERRL do 50 heat and hopefully get enough back to fire even if I have to wait a bit and super long range. If not I may have to modify to preference..

I don't even have the money for ERLLs atm. I just spend it on something for the small laser build. I'll put them on one hand later and test. Plus I'm still just finishing grinding elite on the other variants for the double bonuses to see how far it can be taken.(I was waiting for elite double bonus to fire these.)

Yea, I've only been playing for week or two at the most or something. I'm still cutting my teeth as it were.

Edit: I always have chainfireing and things in my builds also for lower heat use. What I can do on my SP build is you fire one hand normally then have a second hand for chainfire without waiting. It gives the duel hand alot of use for getting out damage and having extra hits in a time frame if needed. So, from what I have found on the SP build, it does have potential use. It's just expensive on the build if I can't do the second hand after without much convenience. But with along distance sniping build I would be more concerned with placement for peaking out of building.

And I didn't think of mixing PPC's and ERlasers. That could be interesting! (If they would work or not: UberT2000 & Naked T-2000)

Back on the ERL subject. Here is T-2000 Bear! Insanely slow and low heat, but endless ammo for the ultra AC 2! I think it fits what was in that video!! 8p With the right firing practices it might work.

I would do:
1. PPC
2. UAC2
3. RorLHand 5xerl(chainfire)
4. LorRHand 5xerl(chainfire)
5. RorLHand 5xerl
6. LorRHand 5xerl
7. Press mouse wheel for alpha emergency suicide kill!!!

Who knows?! Maybe they will come out with a class higher than the assault mech one day! ><

Edit2: Here is a build that might not get ghost heat:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...43aed99631045c8

I put in the pulse large with the erlarge and PPCs and it did not give the yellow warning in Smurfy for a single hand. So if you do only fire one hand at a time this may be more feasible besides the other downsides. 58 heat per hand with possibly no ghost heat and 19 heat sinks. cooldown mods for all three laser types and it could be interesting. Also, 55-65 damage per hand!! You could almost without question do both hands fairly quickly then fire the AC2 for a while and use flamer if needed if they get close.

Edited by Arugela, 07 September 2016 - 05:56 PM.

[Hemholtz]

Arugela, on 07 September 2016 - 04:21 PM, said:

UberT2000 & Naked T-2000
T-2000 Bear!

/me fails Sanity check....starts foaming at the mouth....dies

Edited by Hemholtz, 07 September 2016 - 05:40 PM.