28 replies to this topic

[PhoenixFire55]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 September 2016 - 04:44 AM, said:

Laser vomit was present in comp play in a significant fashion. See: Quickdraw and Black Knight before the IS quirk nerfs and the Timberwolf before them.

Oh please ... Quickdraw? In competitive drops?
Black Kinghts? ... Maybe when they were filling some sort of a specific role like 5ERLLs uberlong trader or 7+ MPLs brawler for cold maps etc., which has nothing to do with meta in the first place.

Maybe some teams used some sort of wierd decks full of meta LPLs+MLs laservomit (i.e. deck that is built for trading at 300-450m ranges), but for every map out there I can give you an example of a dropdeck and a strategy that beats that metadeck ten times out of ten. If you try to close the distance with a full-long-range team using that deck you'll lose too many mechs even before you get into range of your weapons, same way if you start doing your damage at ~400m against a full brawl deck then its already too late, they'll roll over you.

Once again, comp is about specific setups for specific maps. There isn't a single role your meta laservomit does better than a mech specifically build for that role (thus the ERLLs/MPLs examples for KNT compared to your "meta" LPLs+MLs), and thats why you hardly ever see it in comp. Comp doesn't need good all-rounders which meta are, comp needs and uses min-maxed builds only.

Plus, comp generally sees laser weapons as inferior compared to pinpoint ones coz its much too easy to spread their damage all over your mech. Lasers became more popular at some point due to up to 50% duration quirks on certain mechs, but thankfully said quirks were gone rather fast.

Now AC-related meta on the other hand is very common in comp drops because it is builds with maxed out DPS (KDK-3, BlackWidow etc.).

[Y E O N N E]

Long range on a cold map has everything to do with "meta." Playing the ideal hand for the environment is what meta-gaming is all about. Laser vomit was never the entire deck and it was never quite how people perceive it (6+ guns and no less), but it was a solution to several metas.

Before the Warhammer and Kodiak, the Black Knight was overwatch king in MRBC for a brawl-focused game, and it was brutally effective at it. Before the quirks, the Timberwolf was the preferred option.

On large maps like Tourmaline, the Quickdraw was used with four ERLL and those fancy quirks it no longer possesses. You would get up in the crystals and create enfilading fields of fire with it. Nowadays, the Grasshopper is used as long range overwatch, but honestly it is a bit ***-for-tat with the Gauss/PPC Timber.

BJ-1X, BJ-3, and Storm Crow were all used as laser vomit at various points, mostly on lighter weight matches but also as flankers for heavier ones.

The Nova is a laser vomit brawler.

The list of 'Mechs used as laser-vomit in League drops is quite long.

[Ultimax]

vonJerg, on 26 September 2016 - 12:09 AM, said:

Ultimax, he was referring to 2 x C-erPPC + 2 x C-Gauss

His Wubshee is a burst damage build, so I compared it to a burst damage build.

[Davers]

PhoenixFire55, on 26 September 2016 - 12:51 AM, said:

FYI ... laservomit was never present in comp play in any significant way but it was still called meta. I.e. meta is what allows noobz in QP to easier pewpew other noobz from QP on all/most maps. Comp can't care less about meta as it has specific loadouts for specific maps and strategies.

The so-called powerful laservomit meta (or previous Gauss+PPCs meta) is so pathetically weak at close range compared to any kind of SRM+ballistic brawler that I don't even know how people can call it meta in the first place. But I guess if all you do is hide like a little girl 500m away from the fight while taking occasional pop-shots against said alpha-builds you can call it that.

Meh.

Well the ability to create specific themed drop decks is the greatest strength of premades. I can't even count the number of times I dropped in a Griffin only to discover that there was only one or two other brawling mechs (usually lights or mediums) and the rest of the team was happy standing behind a ridge firing lurms and other med-long range weapons.

[PhoenixFire55]

Davers, on 26 September 2016 - 09:07 AM, said:

Well the ability to create specific themed drop decks is the greatest strength of premades. I can't even count the number of times I dropped in a Griffin only to discover that there was only one or two other brawling mechs (usually lights or mediums) and the rest of the team was happy standing behind a ridge firing lurms and other med-long range weapons.

Absolutely. But this has nothing to do with mechs being/not being OP.

[Davers]

PhoenixFire55, on 26 September 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

Absolutely. But this has nothing to do with mechs being/not being OP.

I know. I was referring to your example of srm mechs in comp play.

[PhoenixFire55]

Davers, on 26 September 2016 - 10:11 AM, said:

I know. I was referring to your example of srm mechs in comp play.

LOL ...well derp. Too preoccupied with a different thread. You know what I meant tho. There isn't anything significantly out of balance among mechs and/or weapons. What makes certain things better/worse is the "me first" mentality, which makes everyone hide all the time, and obviously makes some mechs and builds dominant in such type of gameplay.

Everything is situational, its up to players to find/create situations where their mech and their build excels rather than bash their heads against the wall doing the same thing against builds that do said thing better.

You can't fix stupid tho, so there will always be "meta", and always will be threads like this. 3 years ago there was nothing but whine about how Gauss+PPC was a no-skill crutch combo and how lasers took skill to use. Now look where we are at right now ... lol

[Idealsuspect]

Cancers are meta

[JadePanther]

with how many lpl builds running around on the cold maps that constantly get picked i'd have to disagree..