51 replies to this topic

[El Bandito]

Tombs Clawtooth, on 30 September 2016 - 11:31 AM, said:

I have the same problem with a timberwolf.

I'd recommend getting an ebon jaguar and forgetting about the timberwolf if you want to brawl. Even though the EBJ has considerably less armor, it feels like it can take considerably more hits.

I'm working on mastering the timberwolf right now and it has been misery from start to finish, it can't handle being shot at, at all.

EBJ is much more vulnerable than the Timbie, due to its big CT hit box. I have dueled brawler Timbie pilots, and the trick to make it work is to make sure you are being fired at from as few enemies as possible when engaging in your comfort zone, and kill the opposing pilot before he kills you. Timbie might not be as durable as a Marauder, but it is hell lot more lethal when brawling.

Edited by El Bandito, 30 September 2016 - 04:04 PM.

[Tombs Clawtooth]

Metus regem, on 30 September 2016 - 12:07 PM, said:

On Smuryf's your EBJ build is boasting a fire power of 48, in contrast my TBR-METUS build that I posted above is pushing 62 with similar heat efficiency.... In the end it would come down to map, map knowledge and pilot skill. Even with armour and fire power favoring the Timber, the Ebon is a better hill humper.

Except most of my damage is focused, a bunch of SRMs are not focused damage.

I can stay on 1 component and drill straight through the CT of a mech with minimal effort with that loadout. This is why I've never liked SRMs and have only used them a handful of times.

If someone can convince me otherwise, or show me my flaw in my reasoning, I'm all ears. I've just never been impressed with SRMs compared to UACs.

I got to the 17th position on the global leaderboards for heavy mech pilots with my EBJ loadout, if something can take me higher I'm all for it. Because my timberwolf is making me free fall.

Edited by Tombs Clawtooth, 30 September 2016 - 04:17 PM.

[coe7]

Guys, its not a heavy brawler if its not doing atleast 70 points on alpha... and you use SRMs for heat effiency and blast power and they hit very well enough on one component when you use them with artemis and bit of familiarity.

Both of you are imho, doing too little alpha on your brawling builds. It's hurting the performance of the brawl build.

UAC's require face time to unload their damage potential, which is what brawling build can't really afford. UAC's are always sustained dps builds, you can use them close range, but.. you end up taking alot of damage you should not take.

Edited by coe7, 30 September 2016 - 04:18 PM.

[Tombs Clawtooth]

coe7, on 30 September 2016 - 04:15 PM, said:

Guys, its not a heavy brawler if its not doing atleast 70 points on alpha... and you use SRMs for heat effiency and blast power and they hit very well enough on one component when you use them with artemis and bit of familiarity.

Both of you are imho, doing too little alpha on your brawling builds. It's hurting the performance of the brawl build.

UAC's require face time to unload their damage potential, which is what brawling build can't really afford. UAC's are always sustained dps builds, you can use them close range, but.. you end up taking alot of damage you should not take.

I guess the advantage with my EBJ was that the majority of times I get into fights, by the time they notice the amount of damage they're taking from me and begin to focus me, they're usually already dead.

The timberwolf just holds a big sign saying "Please, EVERYONE, shoot at me!" That I'm not used to dealing with.

[coe7]

Tombs Clawtooth, on 30 September 2016 - 04:21 PM, said:

I guess the advantage with my EBJ was that the majority of times I get into fights, by the time they notice the amount of damage they're taking from me and begin to focus me, they're usually already dead.

Oh yes, especially if you have the aim to keep the double tap UAC damage on CT component. I assume this is some type of 2UAC10 EBJ? It's extremely potent mech if you can aim that dakka, but its not a brawler how I see brawling. Its a sustained damage mech that picks angles where opponents can't retaliate in time and due lack of communication inside the pug teams, you just get to pick another.

Brawling with TBR, or any mech without sustained dps requires different mindset than one with clan UAC's. Its completely different playstyle.

Often misinformed people complain that Dakka hybrids with suplementary weapons are "boating", but its very far from truth. They require very good map awareness, but its engagement restrictions are totally different compared to a pure brawler. I'd say you are just trying to play SRM brawler like it would be a UAC machine, and that won't work.

With your KDR, its not about skill or ability, I just think that you have not tried enough to learn the different mindset required for that different playstyle.

Edited by coe7, 30 September 2016 - 04:29 PM.

[LORD ORION]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...6349a3dac1e0e55

1) Use your jets to twist your torso fast, and spread damage across all your armor.
2) 60 + 20 is enough to hurt a torso, take out big guns. Look at the enemy rag doll and decide if it is worth it to take out the torso on the next alpha, or if you should move to CT. (as in your 2nd UAC20 blast took out a heavy weapon)
3) SRM6 + SRM4 combo has the advantage of avoiding ghost heat on the second alpha if you fire the 4s before the 6s have cycled.

Mech is pretty much the king brawler as long as you twist properly with the jets.

[Tombs Clawtooth]

coe7, on 30 September 2016 - 04:27 PM, said:

Oh yes, especially if you have the aim to keep the double tap UAC damage on CT component. I assume this is some type of 2UAC10 EBJ? It's extremely potent mech if you can aim that dakka, but its not a brawler how I see brawling. Its a sustained damage mech that picks angles where opponents can't retaliate in time and due lack of communication inside the pug teams, you just get to pick another.

Brawling with TBR, or any mech without sustained dps requires different mindset than one with clan UAC's. Its completely different playstyle.

Often misinformed people complain that Dakka hybrids with suplementary weapons are "boating", but its very far from truth. They require very good map awareness, but its engagement restrictions are totally different compared to a pure brawler. I'd say you are just trying to play SRM brawler like it would be a UAC machine, and that won't work.

With your KDR, its not about skill or ability, I just think that you have not tried enough to learn the different mindset required for that different playstyle.

Yeah that's my build. 2xUAC10, 5xERSL, 2xSRM2. The SRMs are just supplemental damage I tagged on out of curiousity, and I happened to end up liking them as a means of sustaining some more DPS when my guns are jammed or I'm running hot.

And yeah I am exploiting positioning quiet often and unloading as much damage as possible, twisting out and running only when they take notice I'm there. Then I find a new position and repeat the process. The build seems effective enough out to 700m, which makes it extremely fun to play because I'm never stuck being useless until the fight closes the distance.

I despise builds that limit my range to under 500m before I can even touch someone.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d055b94cf2f79b2

I wish I could find a build for the TBR that would feel similar to me, then I'd love the mech. Arm mounting a UAC10 feels miserable to me as it's too low, and I can only realistically have 1 torso mounted.

Edited by Tombs Clawtooth, 30 September 2016 - 05:26 PM.

[MortZA]

I quite like 9MPLs.

Runs a bit hot, but you can usually fire everything twice before needing to cooldown

[EpyonComet]

El Bandito, on 30 September 2016 - 04:02 PM, said:

EBJ is much more vulnerable than the Timbie, due to its big CT hit box. I have dueled brawler Timbie pilots, and the trick to make it work is to make sure you are being fired at from as few enemies as possible when engaging in your comfort zone, and kill the opposing pilot before he kills you. Timbie might not be as durable as a Marauder, but it is hell lot more lethal when brawling.

I'm pretty sure that's how you play well in any mech or role haha

[El Bandito]

EpyonComet, on 30 September 2016 - 08:35 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure that's how you play well in any mech or role haha

That's over-generalization. Sniper mechs and LRM mechs win through attrition, skirmishers must perform successful hit and fade, and durable Assaults/Heavies actively draw fire in order for the team to move in and mop up the enemy. Brawlers are specialized for sticking successive heavy punches at short range in order to take down the enemy ASAP, but mechs such as the Timbie cannot take concentrated fire under most circumstances, therefore it must dictate the terms of engagement.

Edited by El Bandito, 30 September 2016 - 09:24 PM.

[Hit the Deck]

Snowbluff, on 30 September 2016 - 03:31 PM, said:

Personally, I don't like brawling in my TBR. I feel like clan mechs work better when taking advantage of their better weapons range.

And in this case, it's taking advantage of their wonderful cSL, cSPL, and half weight SRMs (to be fair, they aren't half weight anymore when Artemis is involved).

[Davegt27]