40 replies to this topic

[AztecD]

there goes my 2k+ of mechs

[Mystere]

FupDup, on 06 October 2016 - 11:25 AM, said:

Content in F2P games that shut down works like this:




This is one of the reasons why I don't trust digital games that much, especially F2P ones. Your money spent can potentially disappear. Physical game discs and other physical goods are permanent as long as you don't break them.

There is a reason large corporations enter into escrow agreements with software development companies when licensing software.

Gamers have no such recourse.

Edited by Mystere, 06 October 2016 - 12:07 PM.

[invernomuto]

Mole, on 06 October 2016 - 11:30 AM, said:

I don't know about you guys but I have bought nothing from PGI that I expected to be able to keep forever. I was always aware that if MWO goes down, so does everything on my account. I happen to be of the opinion, however, that if it brought me hours of joy then it was worth the purchase. So far everything I've purchased from PGI has done that.

Agreed. MWO is my Netflix / pay tv. I've bought some hours of entertainments.

Edited by invernomuto, 06 October 2016 - 12:08 PM.

[Scyther]

When the credits roll at the end of the movie at the movie theatre, where did the movie you just 'bought' go? What about your viewing rights?

[KHETTI]

When PGI stops supporting MWO and the servers go offline, the license will have expired, all and any assets from MWO including tool sets used in development will become the property of Microsoft, as will anything you bought.
And you can bet your behind that all stuff will be locked away indefinitely, never to see the light of day again.

I sometimes think about all those games that didn't quite make it, got cancelled or are no longer supported.
I wonder if say a game like BT3025 is sitting on a storage device somewhere, tucked away in a massive repository of forgotten games, everything that's needed to get the game up and running again is there, it would only need the will of the right people to breath life again.
I wonder?!....

[Mystere]

KHETTI, on 06 October 2016 - 12:35 PM, said:

When PGI stops supporting MWO and the servers go offline, the license will have expired, all and any assets from MWO including tool sets used in development will become the property of Microsoft ...

Sigh! Why do people keep repeating this?

Unless you have access to the actual contract and have see this specifically written down, no physical assets transfer ownership. The transaction between MS and PGI is a licensing one, not a "build me MWO" contract.

[Thunder Child]

KHETTI, on 06 October 2016 - 12:35 PM, said:

I sometimes think about all those games that didn't quite make it, got cancelled or are no longer supported.
I wonder if say a game like BT3025 is sitting on a storage device somewhere, tucked away in a massive repository of forgotten games, everything that's needed to get the game up and running again is there, it would only need the will of the right people to breath life again.
I wonder?!....

"First correction, I am Swiss. Second, look around you, I have never been more alive! In 1972, I received a terminal diagnosis. Science could not save my body. My mind, however, that was worth saving... on two hundred thousand feet of data banks! You are standing in my brain!"

.... Hail Hydra?

Edited by Thunder Child, 06 October 2016 - 12:49 PM.

[Mcgral18]

It would be nice if PGI puts the models into the public domain when things end.


I mean, we can already extract them, but that would have legal ramifications if you monetised it (...well, aside from the people currently 3D printing and selling them without any licenses...but that's another thing)



Imagine an enthusiastic development team and management with Alex's models? That'd be neat.

Edited by Mcgral18, 06 October 2016 - 12:52 PM.

[KHETTI]

Mystere, on 06 October 2016 - 12:44 PM, said:

Sigh! Why do people keep repeating this?

Unless you have access to the actual contract and have see this specifically written down, no physical assets transfer ownership. The transaction between MS and PGI is a licensing one, not a "build me MWO" contract.

Knowing what went down between Mektek and Microsoft with regards to their Mekpaks, i can guarantee that MS have a clause in there somewhere that gives them exclusive ownership of all digital assets when its all over, i don't need to see the contract to know its there.

[KingCobra]

[Redacted]

I hope PGI gets better at pleasing its fans and players PGI has missed out on a lot of money to fund this game by being stubborn with a E-Sport vision that is unrealistic and needs to go back to PC MechWarrior roots to make MWO work and have player retention and happy paying customers.

I'm not going to rehash everything in my opinion that MWO needs to be a Class AAA title you can read my topics and posts on the subjects but after 20+ years as a player and fan of BattleTech and PC MechWarrior I just hope Russ wakes up and smells the coffee and MWO does a complete turnaround before it does die and the servers go dark.

Edited by draiocht, 06 October 2016 - 03:01 PM.
piracy

[KHETTI]

KingCobra, on 06 October 2016 - 01:07 PM, said:

[Redacted]

Not without Microsoft's consent, and that will cost you.

Edited by draiocht, 06 October 2016 - 03:01 PM.
Quote Clean-Up

[Tier5 Kerensky]

KHETTI, on 06 October 2016 - 12:55 PM, said:

Knowing what went down between Mektek and Microsoft with regards to their Mekpaks, i can guarantee that MS have a clause in there somewhere that gives them exclusive ownership of all digital assets when its all over, i don't need to see the contract to know its there.

No that's different. MS has ownership of the Mechwarrior IP(or something like that, I don't know what exactly) which they've licensed to PGI. PGI still owns their code and other stuff like graphics they've created.

However it's the same in that, without the right to use the Mechwarrior IP it's not possible to release the software which requires it.

I think it would not be awfully difficult to reverse engineer the data sent to server and create the server side software by thirdparty hobbyists.
But why would anyone do thar? When MWO is shut down, it's likely when next version has been in developement for good time. People would switch into that.

[KingCobra]

Khetti said (Not without Microsoft's consent, and that will cost you. )

[Redacted]

Like I said PGI can turn MWO around and fix the game to have millions of fans and players but I feel there too battered by empty dream of a DOTA clone that did not unfold and work to continue but then again I could be wrong and Russ has some balls and turns MWO back into a Social new Player friendly game all players can enjoy not just a premade frat club.

Edited by draiocht, 06 October 2016 - 03:17 PM.
piracy

[Mystere]

There are at least 2 fallacies in this thread:

• Microsoft gets to own all software assets produced to build MWO.
  
• People will be able to run private servers without PGI giving the server code away or someone outright stealing it.

Please continue with the hilarity.

Edited by Mystere, 06 October 2016 - 01:44 PM.

[KHETTI]

Teer5, on 06 October 2016 - 01:29 PM, said:

No that's different. MS has ownership of the Mechwarrior IP(or something like that, I don't know what exactly) which they've licensed to PGI. PGI still owns their code and other stuff like graphics they've created.

However it's the same in that, without the right to use the Mechwarrior IP it's not possible to release the software which requires it.

I think it would not be awfully difficult to reverse engineer the data sent to server and create the server side software by thirdparty hobbyists.
But why would anyone do thar? When MWO is shut down, it's likely when next version has been in developement for good time. People would switch into that.

Its not different at all, Mektek were modding a Microsoft product,they were a non-profit organization,their work belonged to them ie 3d models, tool sets they created ect.
Microsoft offered Mektek a deal to make the mekpaks officially published, but they would get ownership of everything(ie meaning they intended to charge money for the mekpaks), and from what i was told they tried to do it in a rather underhand way, and Mektek told them to stick it.
This is how Corps like MS operate, and the IP sat idle for well over a decade, S&M acquired a license to the IP, then PGI acquired the license and it would have been re-negotiated.
Part of the condition for making money off someone else's digital IP, is that when your done, we get everything.
It makes sense to have ownership over everything to do with an IP that you own.

[KingCobra]

Mysteries said (There are at least 2 fallacies in this thread:

• Microsoft gets to own all software assets produced to build MWO.
  
• People will be able to run private servers without PGI giving the server code away or someone outright stealing it.

Please continue with the hilarity. )



stop trying to scare players with untruths and myths frst off Microsoft does not make contracts like you claim I know and second there are people in the world hat do steal source code and software it is really not that hard to do 100%all PC games ever made can be copied and moded so please unless you have specific knowledge of game code go scare up a post somewhere else .

LOL MekTek those poor fools I was there when they stole the source code to MechWarrio4Mercinaries actually it was DP that stole it from a DEV and the MOD tools, But soon they were fighting between there self's and split into MekTek and NBT one making the MekTek mods and the other the NBT mods bolth crews were not very smart though and only made any money off of selling hacks to there own mods LOL.

Edited by KingCobra, 06 October 2016 - 01:57 PM.

[Mystere]

KingCobra, on 06 October 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

Mysteries said (There are at least 2 fallacies in this thread:

• Microsoft gets to own all software assets produced to build MWO.
  
• People will be able to run private servers without PGI giving the server code away or someone outright stealing it.

Please continue with the hilarity. )


stop trying to scare players with untruths and myths frst off Microsoft does not make contracts like you claim I know and second there are people in the world hat do steal source code and software it is really not that hardtop do 100%all PC games ever made can be copied and moded so please unless you have specific knowledge of game code go scare up a post somewhere else .

I wish you all the luck running a private server using stolen property. You're going to need it ... and lawyers.

[KingCobra]

Dude I never said I would do anything like that besides its a pain in the ASSSS running a private server I did it for 5 years on a freeware game I loved to play but the players were all crying ******* LOL so I shut it down.


P.S anyone still have a copy of MercShield?

Edited by KingCobra, 06 October 2016 - 01:57 PM.

[KHETTI]

KingCobra, on 06 October 2016 - 01:49 PM, said:

Mysteries said (There are at least 2 fallacies in this thread:

• Microsoft gets to own all software assets produced to build MWO.
  
• People will be able to run private servers without PGI giving the server code away or someone outright stealing it.

Please continue with the hilarity. )




stop trying to scare players with untruths and myths frst off Microsoft does not make contracts like you claim I know and second there are people in the world hat do steal source code and software it is really not that hard to do 100%all PC games ever made can be copied and moded so please unless you have specific knowledge of game code go scare up a post somewhere else .

LOL MekTek those poor fools I was there when they stole the source code to MechWarrio4Mercinaries actually it was DP that stole it from a DEV and the MOD tools, But soon they were fighting between there self's and split into MekTek and NBT one making the MekTek mods and the other the NBT mods bolth crews were not very smart though and only made any money off of selling hacks to there own mods LOL.

complete nonsense, you clearly know nothing.

[zagibu]

Here is a quote from the terms of service everyone of you agreed on by using this website or downloading the steam client:

Quote

3. ALL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES PROVIDED UNDER THIS AGREEMENT ARE PROVIDED ON AN “AS IS” AND “AS AVAILABLE” BASIS.

Maybe read them some time.