15 replies to this topic

[Captain Stiffy]

This is really annoying. There are a lot of circumstances where it is impossible to view the desktop without closing the game.

[El Bandito]

Captain Stiffy, on 14 October 2016 - 04:02 PM, said:

This is really annoying. There are a lot of circumstances where it is impossible to view the desktop without closing the game.

Yeah full-screen and alt-tabbing are not friends. I suggest full window, instead.

[Deathlike]

It's a more of a design issue/flaw that's problematic for DirectX (mostly because it's mostly deprecated).

Full Windowed is a better option.

[Captain Stiffy]

Deathlike, on 14 October 2016 - 05:43 PM, said:

It's a more of a design issue/flaw that's problematic for DirectX (mostly because it's mostly deprecated).

Full Windowed is a better option.

I am in full window. That is what I meant. Because full screen is CRT 1992 bullcrap

I actually use a 21" 2ms LCD for MWO and have a 42" 4k TV attached as well

Fullscreen window is on the LCD and it is the primary monitor. Can't minimize that window to get at features. (Win+M, etc...) it doesn't respond

Edited by Captain Stiffy, 14 October 2016 - 05:47 PM.

[Deathlike]

Captain Stiffy, on 14 October 2016 - 05:44 PM, said:

I am in full window. That is what I meant. Because full screen is CRT 1992 bullcrap

I actually use a 21" 2ms LCD for MWO and have a 42" 4k TV attached as well

Fullscreen window is on the LCD and it is the primary monitor. Can't minimize that window to get at features. (Win+M, etc...) it doesn't respond

I dunno.

I use strictly Windowed personally, so I get some level of access.

[Bandilly]

Fullscreen non-windowed responds for me, but only if I have another program open.

[Felbombling]

You can go full screen if you have something open in the background, like the Tournament page, for example. You can then use alt + tab to minimize. I just went windowed myself, but it is an option.

[MrMadguy]

Due to some reasons MWO's window captures focus. I think, it's one of PGI's programming errors, they have a lot of. Cuz other games don't do it.

Also. May be I'm that guy from CRT era, but I prefer fullscreen mode, cuz despite of all optimizations, modern drivers have, fullscreen mode still provides exclusive access to GPU resources. You can read about it in MSDN.

Quote

When in full-screen mode, the Desktop Window Manager (DWM) is disabled. DXGI can perform a flip to present the back buffer contents instead of doing a blit, which it would do in windowed mode. This performance gain can be undone, however, if certain requirements are not met. To ensure that DXGI does a flip instead of a blit, the front buffer and back buffer must be sized identically. If the application correctly handles its WM_SIZE messages, this should not be a problem. Also, the formats must be identical.

The problem for most applications is the refresh rate. The refresh rate that is specified in the call to ResizeTarget must be a refresh rate that is enumerated by the IDXGIOutput object that the swap chain is using. DXGI can automatically calculate this value if the application zeroes out the RefreshRate member of DXGI_MODE_DESC that is passed into ResizeTarget. It is important not to assume that certain refresh rates will always be supported and to simply hard-code a value. Often, developers choose 60 Hz as the refresh rate, not knowing that the enumerated refresh rate from the monitor is approximately 60,000 / 1,001 Hz from the monitor. If the refresh rate does not match the expected refresh rate of 60, DXGI is forced to perform a blit in full-screen mode instead of a flip.

Lol. As you may know, MWO has another problem, described in this article - in DX11 60Hz freq is hardcoded, which may be one of the reasons, why performance under DX11 is much lower, than under DX9, while in other games situation is opposite. For example my monitor is 75Hz, so hardcoded 60Hz value doesn't match desktop's freq, which causes loss of performance due to blitting instead of flipping.

Edited by MrMadguy, 14 October 2016 - 07:55 PM.

[War Beast]

Captain Stiffy, on 14 October 2016 - 04:02 PM, said:

This is really annoying. There are a lot of circumstances where it is impossible to view the desktop without closing the game.

You just need to have another window of something open. I open chrome or just a folder off my hard drive before I launch the game. Then you can alt-tab back and forth as much as you want. If you have no other item open then there is nothing to alt-tab to.

Oh you can also cntrl-alt-delete to task manager to get to the desktop if needed as well.

At least thats my work around

Deathlike, on 14 October 2016 - 05:43 PM, said:

It's a more of a design issue/flaw that's problematic for DirectX (mostly because it's mostly deprecated).

Full Windowed is a better option.

Full windowed is nice, but I lose a lot of frames using it. When I'm trying to stay at 144 or above it makes a difference to use fullscreen.

[Mystere]

Captain Stiffy, on 14 October 2016 - 05:44 PM, said:

It's off topic but ... I would like to know what PC case you are using.

[Peter2k]

Mystere, on 15 October 2016 - 12:17 AM, said:

It's off topic but ... I would like to know what PC case you are using.

looks like this
CoolerMaster HAF XB

Captain Stiffy, on 14 October 2016 - 04:02 PM, said:

This is really annoying. There are a lot of circumstances where it is impossible to view the desktop without closing the game.

only way to some kind of access is having something open besides MWO

but yeah
can't minimize to get to the desktop

Edited by Peter2k, 15 October 2016 - 12:54 AM.

[Bandilly]

MrMadguy, on 14 October 2016 - 07:52 PM, said:

...performance under DX11 is much lower, than under DX9,

I tried dx9 yesterday to see if it would fix my conquest cap meters. It fixed the meters but dramatically increased load times, reduced fps, and caused some additional stuttering during matches. Immediately went back to dx11. New drivers fixed the meters under dx11 and kept the better performance.

[Captain Stiffy]

Peter2k, on 15 October 2016 - 12:52 AM, said:

looks like this
CoolerMaster HAF XB






only way to some kind of access is having something open besides MWO

but yeah
can't minimize to get to the desktop

That's the case. Probably the last case I will ever have to buy. Extremely good quality, high ease of access, high adaptability of trays and holes for every standard imaginable.

I found that opening task manager with control alt delete will show the taskbar which is what I really wanted. Too bad control-shift-escape doesn't work.

Edited by Captain Stiffy, 15 October 2016 - 07:33 AM.

[Captain Stiffy]

MrMadguy, on 14 October 2016 - 07:52 PM, said:

Due to some reasons MWO's window captures focus. I think, it's one of PGI's programming errors, they have a lot of. Cuz other games don't do it.

Also. May be I'm that guy from CRT era, but I prefer fullscreen mode, cuz despite of all optimizations, modern drivers have, fullscreen mode still provides exclusive access to GPU resources. You can read about it in MSDN.


Lol. As you may know, MWO has another problem, described in this article - in DX11 60Hz freq is hardcoded, which may be one of the reasons, why performance under DX11 is much lower, than under DX9, while in other games situation is opposite. For example my monitor is 75Hz, so hardcoded 60Hz value doesn't match desktop's freq, which causes loss of performance due to blitting instead of flipping.

So what the shart happens with the refresh rate when I alt+enter from windowed to become fullscreen and have a TV also attached? In this schema is it almost certainly inefficient?

I also want to ask why it causes one op instead of another but perhaps that is outside the scope of a forum post.

[Deathlike]

Peter2k, on 15 October 2016 - 12:52 AM, said:

looks like this
CoolerMaster HAF XB






only way to some kind of access is having something open besides MWO

but yeah
can't minimize to get to the desktop

It looks like a classic laser printer instead of a specialized case.

Oh my eyes...

[Tier5 Kerensky]

Actually it does.

But at least in WIndows 10 it doesn't give such an option from task bar. But if you use task manager or similiar program called Process explorer to give the minimize command, it will minimize.

Now, what actually you want to archive with the minimize?

If you just want to see desktop, click win+d , or alternatively ctrl+esc (or just win) and press the show desktop area(in W7 and later by default it's the small area on the right side of task bar.

Oh sorry, it seems those keyboard functions are disabled from the game. But alt+tab into Windows which should always work, and then use them.

Difference to minimizing , and just showing the desktop with the above ways, is that if you close or minimize some window, Windows will switch focus into last non-minimized program, which might be MWO. But if it's properly minimized you will manually have to switch to it.

Edited by Teer5, 15 October 2016 - 06:49 PM.