476 replies to this topic

[Aramuside]

The Unstoppable Puggernaut, on 15 November 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

So for the KDK nerf, I'd say it's pretty much failed in a lot of aspects. First match, 900+ damage and 3 kills. That's without seeing enough foes. Second match I squared off directly against a Dakka Mauler. No interferance. I took off his shoulder thinking he's got an XL but no. We murdered each other. I killed him using a 6x6 and 12x12 coolant and I was orange crit CT. So I scraped it through against a 90 tonne mauler with two coolant modules. I guess it's time for the entire Mauler range get a nerfing too right?

That's good in my opinion, despite being a Kodiak Ultimate pack owner, as KDK3's were punching ridiculously over their weight to the extent I'd often see 3-4 on each side. It utterly killed variety as there was so little need to run any other assault - apparently now you have a close competitor but you still beat it. Coincidentally, I use coolants all the time in mediums so I'm unsure why it should be an outrage for a 100 ton mech to use them.

[qeurul]

Wintersdark, on 13 November 2016 - 06:56 PM, said:

*headdesk*

JUST DON'T DOUBLETAP THEN.

See?

JUST DON'T.

If you *NEVER* doubletap, you're STILL better off using UAC's than AC's. The UAC is simply better. It's smaller, it does more damage. Just don't doubletap.

Of course, having the *ability* to doubletap, no matter how bad jamming is, is still an advantage. It gives you the option of risking a jam, that you can weigh in battle if need be - such as in times where if it jams it won't affect you. Because:

1) YOU choose whether to risk a jam. Never doubletap, never jam.
2) cUAC, never doubletapping, does more damage than cAC

Now, I'm not arguing that they should nerf jam rates, that's a different matter.

What I'm saying is, there's no advantage to taking cAC vs. cUAC, but there ARE disadvantages, even if you never, ever doubletap. This is terrible for weapon diversity, as there simply is no circumstance where you're better off with cAC's.

So, all your blathering about boating vs. running a single weapon are pointless: Even if you run only one UAC, you're 100% of the time better off running a UAC5-20 vs. a AC5-20 (the AC2 is a bit sketchier, for reasons covered earlier). And in the cases where a UAC isn't ideal, a LBX is an improvement, such as in a close brawl where you'll never intend to doubletap ever, go to the LBX20 and reap front loaded damage instead of having to have facetime.

In all cases, running AC5-20's is objectively worse than the alternatives.

I follow this logic 100%, except the cAC10 produces 2 heat, instead of 3 of the cUAC10. I tested this in mechlab and I could run 4x cAC10 in my KDK-3 with XL400 engine instead of usual XL380, because I do not need the extra heatsinks. So if you are willing to lose 0.4 sec recycle time and the tactical ability to double-tap, you get slight speed boost with cooler combo. The 4x cAC10 in fact is so cool, that you can selectively fire all 4 at the same time, instead of cycling them as you have to with cUAC version.

I have not tested this yet in-game, but I'm looking eagerly to it.

EDIT: The cAC10 extra one slot is hurting the 4x cAC10 build on KDK-3 hard, 6t of ammo with TC1, without putting ammo to arms, but you can have two er med lasers in one arm with some armour to spare, especially with XL380.

Edited by qeurul, 16 November 2016 - 02:26 AM.

[Wintersdark]

qeurul, on 16 November 2016 - 01:09 AM, said:

I follow this logic 100%, except the cAC10 produces 2 heat, instead of 3 of the cUAC10. I tested this in mechlab and I could run 4x cAC10 in my KDK-3 with XL400 engine instead of usual XL380, because I do not need the extra heatsinks. So if you are willing to lose 0.4 sec recycle time and the tactical ability to double-tap, you get slight speed boost with cooler combo. The 4x cAC10 in fact is so cool, that you can selectively fire all 4 at the same time, instead of cycling them as you have to with cUAC version.

I have not tested this yet in-game, but I'm looking eagerly to it.

EDIT: The cAC10 extra one slot is hurting the 4x cAC10 build on KDK-3 hard, 6t of ammo with TC1, without putting ammo to arms, but you can have two er med lasers in one arm with some armour to spare, especially with XL380.

I covered this.

Yes, the cAC10 produces one less heat per shot, but it also has a 2.9s cooldown, vs. the cUAC10's 2.5. So you're going from 4.0dps per autocannon to 3.45, or from 16 dps overall to 13.8.

The cAC10 and cUAC10 are in the same ghost heat group, so firing all 4 cAC10's (or a combination of cAC/cUAC) still generates ghost heat.

So, no, you still never want to run cAC10.

Because! If the lower heat is a concern worth accepting a solid DPS loss over, you'd go to cLBX10, which will do more damage over time than the cAC10 (as it has a higher crit rate = more crit damage done = more extra damage via the 15% crit damage > structure carrythrough) and has no ghost heat whatsoever, so generates less heat than firing 4xcAC10. Also, no burst time with the cLBX, which is a plus. Fire, twist, fire, twist.


As I said previously, if you're not running cUAC's, then you should be running cLBX.

Edited by Wintersdark, 16 November 2016 - 02:51 AM.

[Syn Pryde]

So Clan-AC is supposed to be a useful thing now ?
WHERE ARE THE DAMNED C-AC MODULES ?
CAN WE PLEASE GET A GOOD LIGHT LIKE LOCUST ?

and why do i have to buy them when i get UACs, which where supposed to be superior, they should at least have +50% according to lore. And.... We clans should not drop in 3 lances of 4 each, but 2 stars of 5 each. which would balance the whole ****** thing.

i dont see how this might help e.g. against me running a KDK-3 with 4 C-AC10 or LB10-X and just firing them all instead of left-right ?


PS: who cares about large lasers, they have a burntime until the next millenium. only gets you killed after tier 4.

Edited by Syn Pryde, 16 November 2016 - 03:56 AM.

[Syntillate]

Alexander Garden, on 15 November 2016 - 03:57 PM, said:

Input error; it should be -10% Energy Heat Gen.
That KFX-S Quirk, and the SCR-Prime ER Laser Quirk (should be a -5% Duration Quirk, not a Range Quirk), should both be fixed in a hot-fix planned for tomorrow.

Thanks Alexander!!

[Hawok79]

Wintersdark, on 13 November 2016 - 05:22 PM, said:

It was a bug; it doesn't happen anymore.

I challenge anyone to provide video proving otherwise.

So,How much time i must wait before i can fire the second time...4 Seconds,did you need a timer?
If reloadcyrcle is over (blue is gone) and you tab a moment later,it still can Jam.
You dont fire for 30sec...first click,an it jams without a singe Round left the barrel,still happens.
With this Patch the Clan Uac line is pretty useless now,specialy when you use only one of them.

The Unstoppable Puggernaut, on 15 November 2016 - 01:24 PM, said:

So I scraped it through against a 90 tonne mauler with two coolant modules. I guess it's time for the entire Mauler range get a nerfing too right?

You misunderstanding something...Clan Mechs get nerved,IS Mechs gets a Buff because they are weak and underpowered

Edited by Hawok79, 16 November 2016 - 05:16 AM.

[Zolaz]

BLOOD WOLF, on 12 November 2016 - 11:49 PM, said:

I am starting to wonder what content means? my content, your content, their content!. Content is what?......I dunno

Content is the stuff that makes people play games. For real games that means stuff to do ... for MWO that means would you like to buy a mech pack. In order to hide the fact that no new content is being generated PGI moves some numbers arounds on weapons and works on "balance" over and over and over.

[Randomm]

X Player, on 15 November 2016 - 11:44 AM, said:

The game is completely broken or something... I get ~46 fps in the mechlab and below ~30 fps in the testing grounds.
Edit: No problems on my side, drivers updated, game files checked, update is live. FPS problem persists.
Edit2: Other games perform bad as well, seems to be an issue with the new Nvidia driver.

Not just me - phew.
Guess it's LRM boats for a while

[Arkhangel]

Zolaz, on 16 November 2016 - 05:26 AM, said:

Content is the stuff that makes people play games. For real games that means stuff to do ... for MWO that means would you like to buy a mech pack. In order to hide the fact that no new content is being generated PGI moves some numbers arounds on weapons and works on "balance" over and over and over.

Getting new mechs does make some people play the game. they just don't come on the forums to whine. also, bear in mind it's a lot easier to model a mech than re-design or make a map from scratch, and those are a different department as well.
So's the guys re-designing Assault mode.

As for the balance pass whining... would you rather they just started banning the accounts of people who specifically always go for exploiting game mechanics? or would you rather they try and break the meta? because Meta Builds are actually what causes people to leave the game. it causes stagnation. You hardly get to see anyone ever use anything other than specific stuff.

I've been playing since Closed beta. I ain't the best pilot, natch, but I know of several pilots who've NEVER needed Meta Mechs, or Quirks, or anything to be good in the Mechs they chose to use, and said Mechs much of the time weren't whatever "The Mech of the Day" was. Put my unit leader, Macheiron in a Dragon or Shadow Hawk. My unit mate SovietArmada in a Hunchback, etc.

Regardless of what they're up against, they'll make that Chassis work, despite how much people will say said mech sucks and you should use X mech instead. The pilot of the mech has always mattered more than the Mech or quirks.

at the end of the day, it's your own skill, and the ability to coordinate with your teammates that wins or loses a match, nothing else.

Edited by Arkhangel, 16 November 2016 - 09:50 AM.

[The Unstoppable Puggernaut]

Just had a game with the kdk3 with a very good score I am happy with. Although it was more labourious I am very happy with this mech's high performance still. I've been advised not to post details so I won't but this proves to me, that it's mainly the player not the mech. I hope PGI is gathering data from this and will at least lift the yaw nerfs on the other kdk's. The KDK1, KDK5 and SB really needs them (brawler mechs).

[Scout80913]

I really appreciate the Notes explaining the logic behind the balance changes. In and of itself that's a huge improvement. So far, I'm liking most of the adjustments.

Having said that, it does feel like the UAC nerfs are just a little too strong. I understand the intent, but the actual result (assuming the huge increase in jam chances listed is correct) is that builds that are boating UACs are only slightly affected. If one jams, odds are another one will still be firing. Conversely, builds that use a single UAC are much less reliable than they used to be. This causes players to behave more cautiously than they tend to already be. The end result is an increase in the tendency to ball up and stand in one place, bogging gameplay down even further. I doubt this is what was intended.

[Tordin]

Came to think of it, regarding the buffs to the Phoenix Hawk arms

Quote

[color=#558ED5] with a prominent 'pistol'-style weapon[/color]

Well, wouldnt hurt to add the + 7 structure boost to the left arm as well now wouldnt it? Several if not all of the Phawks that have symmetrical pistol style hands, like the 1K should get equal structure boosts. I understand the + 7 structure boost on the Phawks that have most hardpoints on the right arm though.

[MegaBopper]

MegaBopper, on 15 November 2016 - 04:05 PM, said:

I have been looking without luck for the link to the standalone client patch files.

I saw that you have posted the links. Thank you.

Best Regards,

Megabopper

[Speedy Pinky]

Thanks for the patch
LPL are useless now and 8 of 12 Mechs use PPC and/or Gauss
I look in 1 month if it better but so playing is useless.
Bye!

[Timber Ghost]

Speedy Pinky, on 16 November 2016 - 02:23 PM, said:

Thanks for the patch
LPL are useless now and 8 of 12 Mechs use PPC and/or Gauss
I look in 1 month if it better but so playing is useless.
Bye!

The clan LPL is not useless, sheesh. If the very slight nerf is making you leave the game, you have other issues. The optimal range is still the same. 600m. While IS is a dismal 360. They just shortened the max range a bit is all. The LPL is suppose to be more of a brawling laser anyway. This just helps push it back in to that roll a little bit.

As for the UAC's, many reports are coming back in that players notice little difference. Damage numbers are still high on the KDK3, and no one is parking that mech like some here are predicting, lol.

[Graugger]

Timber Ghost, on 16 November 2016 - 02:50 PM, said:

As for the UAC's, many reports are coming back in that players notice little difference. Damage numbers are still high on the KDK3, and no one is parking that mech like some here are predicting, lol.

The nerf wasn't aimed at the KDK-3 it was aimed at IS mechs boating 5s and being effective AGAINST KDK-3s.

[I cant want to]

the nerf to uacs may have been intended for the kdk, but it having much more effect on people not boating - the downtime on a single uac is much more noticable

IS side, quad uac5 can still dish out ~300 damage of continual fire before overheat on a neutral map without running additional dhs

Edited by chaothulhu, 16 November 2016 - 03:47 PM.

[Talos7]

So far the biggest change that has me scratching my head is the Summoner nerf. I mean why?

I enjoy the 'mech. Yea sure some people can use it great. When i run gauss/ERPPC combo I routinely get some high damage games. But its so darn squishy and underrepresented in the game I don't understand the nerf to it.

[Graugger]

They forget to mention that C-PPCs no longer do spread damage and do all PPFLD?

[Cheeseburger1]

To me this re-balancing is just a scheme to get people to put money into making new mechs. Keep re-balancing mechs and continuously make large groups of people scrap their now useless mechs to switch to one that performs. Wait until they spend money building up their new mech and re-balance stats again. Rinse and repeat.

I have only played this game steadily for about a 3 months (played the classics religiously) and I put about 30 million credits into my UAC5 heavy Dire Wolf, which after the patch feels almost useless. Plus I put in about 20 million credits on trying to buy other Dire Wolves to work towards maxing out my skill tree. All of that time feels almost wasted at this point.

How were UACs and Dire Wolves overpowered? They are meant to be powerful short range - That's the point. So because an assault mech gets more damage on average than a light mech something is wrong? My Dire Wolf went from immobile and terrible at long range... to immobile, terrible at long range and terrible at short range. It seems they are really trying to punish brawlers - who would already get lit up like a Christmas tree if they didn't play smart and strategically close in on enemies. Plus how were UAC heavy Dire Wolves more overpowered than pretty much anything Kodiaks can field?

Edited by Cheeseburger1, 16 November 2016 - 06:23 PM.