57 replies to this topic

[BLOOD WOLF]

Dirus Nigh, on 12 November 2016 - 06:38 PM, said:

It's own leader board. And betting with C-Bills.

oooooooooo, really cool idea.

[TheArisen]

Tristan Winter, on 13 November 2016 - 03:56 PM, said:

I don't see how free-for-all is going to work. How does it work in MW:LL, I haven't checked it out.

In MW4:Mercs the incentive for not hiding was that you wouldn't make any money if you just hid all the time and killed the last dude. But that was single player. In PVP, that kind of logic doesn't apply to everyone. Some people just want to win.

In my opinion, any game with more than 2 sides needs to have in-match incentives (as opposed to c-bills and XP, which come after the match) for people to engage. For example, if you all remember the Highlander movies, where there could be only one survivors, the incentive for fighting was that you gained someone's powers by killing them. So if you just tried to hide until the year 3000 without killing anyone, your opponent would basically be omnipotent.

This obviously doesn't work for MWO, because it's not Quake Arena with Quad damage or anything like that. One alternative would be to give every player 1 respawn for every kill, because even if you only have 50% health after your first kill, it basically means you have 1.5 mechs while all the other guys only have 1 mech (unless they also got kills).

But that doesn't quite have the right gladiator feel to it. On Solaris, pilots don't eject and run over to a fresh mech in the middle of the show. So another possibility would be to have big gates that divide all the players in pairs, like 8x2 players in one match. In each compartment, two players fight it out. After x amount of time, the gates start to open up. So then the survivor from all the first pairs meet a new opponent. And it's basically a forced tournament format. If you take too much damage fighting your first opponent, you will be too damaged to survive against your second opponent, etc. But then it's not quite the chaos and carnage of an open gladiator-like Solaris match.

An alternative to respawns (i.e. extra longevity) as incentive to fight would be some kind of extra attacks (i.e. extra offensive abilities), like controlling turrets or hovertanks. In this case, killing enemy mechs means you control more and more of the battlefield. But again, this isn't very satisfying, because Solaris is supposed to be about mechs, not turrets.

I don't really see a good solution that doesn't involve arcade-items like medikits and damage boosters, or extra factors like turrets. It seems like free-for-all is always going to be open to cynical hide-and-seek if you want to keep it consistent with the really clean, gladiator-like idea.

And if you make the map too small and open, in order to force the action, then it just becomes a random dice roll of whether your enemies ganged up on you, or someone else became the first victims and you were able to capitalize.

Indeed. Pgi would need to figure out how to keep ppl from ganging up right away and also prevent hiding until the end.

Here's an idea but it's not refined ATM.

Introduce "Popularity" as a reward for fighting in a crowd pleasing way. Getting KMDs, etc, would be the best way to earn popularity. Yeah you could earn popularity with winning or kills but if it's setup correctly it'd encourage ppl to not play dirty.

Some people have mentioned being able to spectate. Perhaps the spectators could also award popularity to those they think deserve it. So if you hide to kill dmged mechs later or if you team up then you wouldn't get popularity.

Why would ppl care about popularity? Because it'd function like faction rep. You earn popularity, get rewards like cbills, mech bays, MC, Solaris exclusive decals, etc.

Remember, I just thought of this so it'll need polishing.

[SlippnGriff]

new game modes are way out of the question for pgi, not even mentioning new (not rehashed) maps. kekekekeke

[BLOOD WOLF]

SlippnGriff, on 13 November 2016 - 09:33 PM, said:

new game modes are way out of the question for pgi, not even mentioning new (not rehashed) maps. kekekekeke

okay?

[Jettrik Ryflix]

TheArisen, on 13 November 2016 - 09:10 PM, said:

*STUFF*

I like the "popularity" idea. In MechWarrior 4 Solaris matches, half the fun was the narrative behind the games. Your pilot went from being a relative nobody, to being a fan favourite/contender.

While this vibe would be hard to replicate in an online game, the aforementioned "popularity" mechanic would be a great virtual tie-in to an arena-type atmosphere.

The only difficulty with the spectator-based rewards is making sure there are actually spectators. Would there be incentives to spectate? I mean, ideally the matches themselves would be fascinating enough to draw spectators in... but who wants to watch when they could be playing?

[BLOOD WOLF]

TheArisen, on 13 November 2016 - 09:10 PM, said:

Indeed. Pgi would need to figure out how to keep ppl from ganging up right away and also prevent hiding until the end.

Here's an idea but it's not refined ATM.

Introduce "Popularity" as a reward for fighting in a crowd pleasing way. Getting KMDs, etc, would be the best way to earn popularity. Yeah you could earn popularity with winning or kills but if it's setup correctly it'd encourage ppl to not play dirty.

Some people have mentioned being able to spectate. Perhaps the spectators could also award popularity to those they think deserve it. So if you hide to kill dmged mechs later or if you team up then you wouldn't get popularity.

Why would ppl care about popularity? Because it'd function like faction rep. You earn popularity, get rewards like cbills, mech bays, MC, Solaris exclusive decals, etc.

Remember, I just thought of this so it'll need polishing.

grand idea, although they need to reset the popularity or make it decrease or increase so that their is no cap.

[TheArisen]

Jettrik Ryflix, on 13 November 2016 - 09:37 PM, said:

I like the "popularity" idea. In MechWarrior 4 Solaris matches, half the fun was the narrative behind the games. Your pilot went from being a relative nobody, to being a fan favourite/contender.

While this vibe would be hard to replicate in an online game, the aforementioned "popularity" mechanic would be a great virtual tie-in to an arena-type atmosphere.

The only difficulty with the spectator-based rewards is making sure there are actually spectators. Would there be incentives to spectate? I mean, ideally the matches themselves would be fascinating enough to draw spectators in... but who wants to watch when they could be playing?

Some people have expressed interest in watching & even placing bets.

In WoWS there's a compliment system where you can "compliment" a fellow player for playing well. Perhaps other players could do something similar to award popularity.

[TheArisen]

BLOOD WOLF, on 13 November 2016 - 09:39 PM, said:

grand idea, although they need to reset the popularity or make it decrease or increase so that their is no cap.

I was thinking things like team killing or excessive team DMG could hurt your popularity.

I thought about spectators & fellow players being able to report for unsportsmanlike conduct resulting in a loss of popularity but I'd be worried about abuse.

[DiabetesOverlord Wilford Brimley]

PVE >Then Solaris

[BLOOD WOLF]

TheArisen, on 13 November 2016 - 10:24 PM, said:

I was thinking things like team killing or excessive team DMG could hurt your popularity.

I thought about spectators & fellow players being able to report for unsportsmanlike conduct resulting in a loss of popularity but I'd be worried about abuse.

oh right, So in theory It would be tough to gain popularity. I am with you, it could be the fact that a player is really good but the crowd always votes him down. That would sound like life though, the crowd can be fickle

[TheArisen]

BLOOD WOLF, on 13 November 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

oh right, So in theory It would be tough to gain popularity. I am with you, it could be the fact that a player is really good but the crowd always votes him down. That would sound like life though, the crowd can be fickle

Yeah but trolls could use it to jerk ppl around. It's possible other players compliments could offset that and there would be ways to earn popularity that's not dependent on someone else giving it to you.

In WoWS there's a limit on how many compliments you can give. In MWO there could be a limit for both compliments & reports(a new name for this would be good).

[50 50]

If we look at what is in the game already, we have a lot of the components already available to make Solaris fairly quickly.
The 3 test maps that can be used in private matches.
Spectator option from private matches.
The leaderboards for rankings.
Stock mech mode and some of the other options could be used to provide variety.

With a few adaptions and additions I think it becomes a very viable development option and if we look at the potential funding options from eSports which is where the 'Championship' events could take place, then it's worth considering.

A few extras to consider:

• Don't use a match maker. The Matches can be restricted by tier so there are options for less experienced players all the way up to the vets so we can enjoy the different levels of competition.
  
• Use a round robin format which can then progress through to the quarters, semi finals and finals. Want to play, then you put your name in to one of these league tables and go for it.
  
• Have this as a monthly event with the players that make the finals put onto a leaderboard.
  
• The top ranked players can receive invitations to the 'World Championship' and we can have a yearly big event before resetting it for the next year.

For additional features and to make the mode stand out a bit more from quick play... which is our casual mode:

• Matches need prize money... little different to the rewards but if there is an entry fee you then get a prize pool that can be divided up at the end.
  
• Betting on the matches would be nice but I wonder if there are any legal ramifications about doing this (even though it's not real money)
  
• It would be great to be able to sit in the stands, watch the battles and be part of the crowd. Add a bit of immersion not only for those competing but also so there is a real virtual spectator option for the rest of us. Should be able to do that with the spectator mode and have some 'big screen' options that we can view as well. (There is probably some advertising options that could be looked btw)

I think there is a lot that could be done.

Yes, Faction Play needs some more work... but it's a huge mode that really needs a different perspective.
PvE... well... I personally don't believe a single player story line is worth pursuing but believe that with some changes to Faction Play we can create our own story and add in AI elements there so we can have PvE, but that is for another topic.

[TKSax]

Solaris is not happening until a Game Engine Upgrade Per Russ in a town hall earlier this year. He said that would take over a Year to make Happen. So No Solaris in 2017.

[BLOOD WOLF]

TKSax, on 14 November 2016 - 07:40 PM, said:

Solaris is not happening until a Game Engine Upgrade Per Russ in a town hall earlier this year. He said that would take over a Year to make Happen. So No Solaris in 2017.

that answers the question

[GRiPSViGiL]

BLOOD WOLF, on 13 November 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

oh right, So in theory It would be tough to gain popularity. I am with you, it could be the fact that a player is really good but the crowd always votes him down. That would sound like life though, the crowd can be fickle

In that case embracing the villain role would be should be just as rewarding as being the hero.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

1v1, 2v2, and 4v4 modes, as well as 4, 8, and 12-man free-for-all.

Hand-to-hand combat: hatchets and punching (LAA required, hand actuator gives bonus damage, hatchets do much higher damage still). Skip kicking to keep things simpler for the animators and coders.

Option to stream your match with a spectator lobby that lets people observe games on a 2 minute delay. People can place c-bill bets (not MC to avoid gambling laws) during the pre-match setup, but once it starts betting is locked to prevent the delay from enabling fixed bets. Winner's purse is increased by a multiplier based on the odds as determined by the final bet ratio.

Several maps, based on the lore House arenas. Gradually add more over time.

Hold seasons. Break into categories by weight class, by team size, and by tech base (Light/Medium/Heavy/Assault/Mixed, IS/Clan/Mixed, Solo/Duo/Trio/Lance). As each season comes to a close, invite the top players/teams from each to the Solaris Grand Championship, which will involve live-cast invitational matches to find the best in each category, culminating in the 1v1 Mixed Weight Mixed Tech championship match, winner gets some kind of design input on a Hero based on his winning mech.

Duncan Fisher recording a vast library of potential commentary that triggers when certain conditions are met. Bring in George Ledoux to live cast season championship matches if possible.

[TheArisen]

GRiPSViGiL, on 14 November 2016 - 09:24 PM, said:

In that case embracing the villain role would be should be just as rewarding as being the hero.

Well the idea for popularity is to function in a similarish way to faction rep.

I'm not sure how you could handle a villain role without essentially encouraging bad play.

[GRiPSViGiL]

TheArisen, on 15 November 2016 - 09:22 AM, said:

Well the idea for popularity is to function in a similarish way to faction rep.

I'm not sure how you could handle a villain role without essentially encouraging bad play.

He stated that people would hate on good players by down voting them and I think that is legitmate concern...embracing that or creating a system that allows that be a legitimate path would be just as dynamic.

Edited by GRiPSViGiL, 15 November 2016 - 11:45 AM.