50 replies to this topic

[Escef]

The Shadow Hawk is hands down better than the Phoenix Hawk, imo... However, for the 300-500 meter range band, you're probably going to enjoy the P. Hawk more.

The P. Hawk moves quite well, slick little operator; but most variants cluster all of your weapons in the comparatively easy to lose arms (catch 22 with the P. Hawks, the arms do a good job protecting the body, but are easy to lose and have most of your firepower in them). P.Hawks also have 2 different ECM capable variants (the 1B and the 2).

The Shadow Hawk doesn't boat energy as well and isn't as nimble as the P. Hawk. However, with missiles and ballistics in the body (missiles and energy for the 2K), it can afford to use those good sized arms it has as shields for the body. Before the release of clan mechs and the quirk system, the Shadow Hawk was the best medium in the game, it was (and still is) a good compromise between agility, toughness, and firepower. However, it's biggest strength these days is to act as a close range striker build, get in, unload some SRMs and cannon shot, get out. And in that role it is largely eclipsed by the Griffin 2N (anywhere from 16 to 24 SRM tubes, possible medium lasers, and ECM). There are some viable mid to long range builds on Shadow Hawks (2K with large lasers or PPCs, 5M or 2H with 2xAC5, 2H going straight ranged DPS with 3xAC2, most models also can run some LRM support if you really want to), and you can make them work (the original Champion build for the Shadow Hawk 2H was 2xAC5 and a PPC, these days it uses a LPL instead of the PPC).

But it also depends on your playstyle. The P. Hawk is just straight up faster, and there's a lot to be said for that. As I said, I still prefer the Shadow Hawk.

[Kael Posavatz]

The two have very different playstyles so comparing them is hard.

The Phoenix Hawk is an excellent fast energy-harasser, and does adequately in the long-range snipe-fest when armed with a couple of PPCs (especially the ECM variant). One has MASC and with a large enough engine you can (briefly) outrun some locust builds. The downside is that a few have insufficient hardpoints for their tonnage which encourages players to over-gun them (the MASC variant in particular falls into this).

The Shadow Hawk is a generally pretty good heavy-medium brawler that plays a lot like the Griffin swapping SRMs for 1+ autocannons. If you like multi-autocannon heavies and assaults, it's probably the lightest mech the IS has where you'll be comfortable carrying around more than one cannon.

[L1f3H4ck]

DO NOT LISTEN TO THESE DELUSIONAL PEOPLE!!!

I was excited for the PHawk, I really was. Iconic Mech, looked like a small Black Knight, so I thought it might even get good hitboxes. It's junk. Once you get your arms blown off, and you WILL get your arms blown off, you're done.

The Shadowhawk is a good medium Mech and sees a lot of play in Scout Mode. It's quite tall for a medium, but it also has high torso mounts. The AC10+SRMs build is a cool running DPS monster.

If you're deciding between these two, get the Shadowhawk. It's not even a close, call, more like a tasty burger compared to a bowl of moldy fries.

[DAYLEET]

Shadowhawk is still top of the line. It's not as nooby as ecm+srm griffin but you wont believe what 2 ac5 can do when they are at the height of your face and clear above your body. Fast, unending and pinpoint accuracy at medium range. Remember you're support and focus with your teammate and youll do insane things. Dont spread that damage, no excuse with ac5. the 2H has a 25% ballistic cooldown,35% with modules, its dumb really.

Ive had a lot of success with an lb10x and 4srm4 too if pointblank boom now you die is your thing. Its really cold too and can hang longer at 1.44.

Really, if you like 300 meters battle+ the SDH is your boy and he wont let you down.

Edited by DAYLEET, 26 November 2016 - 11:30 AM.

[xe N on]

DAYLEET, on 26 November 2016 - 11:22 AM, said:

Shadowhawk is still top of the line. It's not as nooby as ecm+srm griffin but you wont believe what 2 ac5 can do when they are at the height of your face and clear above your body. Fast, unending and pinpoint accuracy at medium range. Remember you're support and focus with your teammate and youll do insane things. Dont spread that damage, no excuse with ac5. the 2H has a 25% ballistic cooldown,35% with modules, its dumb really.

Well, actually ... my Jaeger does it better. Much better. 3xUAC5 or 3xAC5 for teh win

Edited by xe N on, 26 November 2016 - 12:33 PM.

[DAYLEET]

xe N on, on 26 November 2016 - 12:31 PM, said:

Well, actually ... my Jaeger does it better. Much better. 3xUAC5 for teh win.

Your jagger is a heavy, and its made of paper compared to the SDH. the SDH still has a great hitbox. A heavy should be able to tank.

[Y E O N N E]

DAYLEET, on 26 November 2016 - 12:36 PM, said:

Your jagger is a heavy, and its made of paper compared to the SDH. the SDH still has a great hitbox. A heavy should be able to tank.

I dunno, they both seem pretty paper-like to me.

[N a p e s]

I still love the Shadow Hawk, despite its relatively low quirk levels(better than it was when quirks were first released). Plenty of build variety across the variants with highlights being the 2D2, 2K and 2H.

[DAYLEET]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 November 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

I dunno, they both seem pretty paper-like to me.

Now, do you prefer to be the heavy paper thin or med paper thin? Give the sdh a try again maybe.

[Y E O N N E]

DAYLEET, on 26 November 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

Now, do you prefer to be the heavy paper thin or med paper thin? Give the sdh a try again maybe.

I have both. I'm talking about when I'm shooting at them, though. Universally, they both crumple pretty quick.

[Revis Volek]

2 Different mechs with different roles in this game for the most part.

Shadow Hawk is a second line mech for the most part in this game, good support for other brawlers or mid range heavies and assaults. It can trade with the 2k varaint but most other are brawl mechs.

The Phoenix Hawk however is either a harraser or support mech ONLY and is not the size, tonnage or has the weaponry to really get into a brawl and duke it out. I run one with i think 8 Sml Pulse and max engine and it is the only one i would take into a fight like that and i would still not be looking to fight mechs bigger then me. i would look for lights and mediums i know i can pick apart.

The Shadow hawk on the other i might take a few trades with a heavy and even try to brawl or finish up a hurt assault but those are few and far between.

So if you like to stand, trade and be an in your face fighter id lean towards the Shadow Hawk, if you wanna play shoot and scoot and like to be evasive and sneaky the Pixie is gonna be more of your ride.

[DAYLEET]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 November 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

I have both. I'm talking about when I'm shooting at them, though. Universally, they both crumple pretty quick.

I dont ever drive the yagger, i only shoot at them. But i never felt as fragile in my shd as the yagger i shoot at. They are actually quite sturdy.

Edited by DAYLEET, 26 November 2016 - 01:06 PM.

[FupDup]

The correct answer is Hunchback IIC.

[Jackal Noble]

Enjoy the Phoenix hawk a bit, hero (roc) is kinda meh. Don't own any shawks.
Jjs are solid as all get out.
Those that say the arms are easy to lose; yes, getting shot repeatedly on the same component will often result in the loss of said component. How many more structure buffs do you need/want(2).

[L1f3H4ck]

And I'm sure everyone got some good suggestions for Mechs that are better than both hawks, but that wasn't the question. Also, Thunderhawk is best hawk.

[Koniving]

Gaden Phoenix, on 26 November 2016 - 01:05 AM, said:

Hi all,
Looking to get a new medium with the sale on Tuesday. Would like to enquire, you your opinion, which is the better med. mech to get?

The Phoenix Hawk or the Shadow Hawk? I like 300~500M range combat alot.

The real question to ask...

Is do you use Armlock more often than not?

If so, use Shadowhawk.

If you do not use Armlock (on) more than off...
then Phoenix Hawk is something you will thoroughly enjoy. Set FOV to 80+ for even better enjoyment.

Make great use of Left CTRL + mouse aiming for the best fun you can have.

[Angel of Annihilation]

I absolutely love my PHX-2 and for me anyway, my PHX-2 is about my top performing mech in the game. I run mine with 2 x LL, 3 x ML, ECM and max JJs. It is extremely agile with the quirks and is one of the few mechs in the game that actually has great jumping capability. It was also recently buffed to add a crapton of armor to the arms (mine has only 2 less armor on its arms as its CT now). I also find them quite tanky, even while mounting an XL. After 43 matches I am running a 2.42 K/D with it and this is before the buff.

The other variants I only do ok with so I can't say they are all great but even the ones that I am not pulling big numbers with are still fun to play.

With the Shadow Hawk though, I just could never find my grove with it. They don't have the agility quirks of the PHX so feel heavy and sluggish to me and they don't have near the jump capability which for me is a huge negative. Also I don't really like the hard points on the Shadow Hawk. Oh and it is a bigger, easier to hit mech.

So in my opinion, PHX would be the way to go.

Edit and Note: Not really relevant to the question but if you want a good IS medium, look at the Crab. I have been very impressed with that mech.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 27 November 2016 - 10:07 AM.

[QuantumButler]

Viktor Drake, on 27 November 2016 - 10:04 AM, said:

I absolutely love my PHX-2 and for me anyway, my PHX-2 is about my top performing mech in the game. I run mine with 2 x LL, 3 x ML, ECM and max JJs. It is extremely agile with the quirks and is one of the few mechs in the game that actually has great jumping capability. It was also recently buffed to add a crapton of armor to the arms (mine has only 2 less armor on its arms as its CT now). I also find them quite tanky, even while mounting an XL. After 43 matches I am running a 2.42 K/D with it and this is before the buff.

The other variants I only do ok with so I can't say they are all great but even the ones that I am not pulling big numbers with are still fun to play.

With the Shadow Hawk though, I just could never find my grove with it. They don't have the agility quirks of the PHX so feel heavy and sluggish to me and they don't have near the jump capability which for me is a huge negative. Also I don't really like the hard points on the Shadow Hawk. Oh and it is a bigger, easier to hit mech.

So in my opinion, PHX would be the way to go.

Edit and Note: Not really relevant to the question but if you want a good IS medium, look at the Crab. I have been very impressed with that mech.

Crab is a really solid mech and no one really realizes it, they have relatively low target priority too and tend to get focused a lot less.

[Chuck Jager]

The SHD teaches you some very good skill like torso twist and shoot and scoot in ways that are not as limited to by one specific niche and you got mo better armor for mistakes. The best engine is a 300xl and then a 280 and 325, but there are std builds along with a 350 and erllas on the 2k (many do it with a 325). The hero mech is a pretty decent mech if you want to skip grinding a 3rd chassis.

I have the phoenixs and they pretty much ended up mid range with very few options and major squish, but I also played the SHD a ton pre nerfs/clan and know its strengths post nerfs/clan. I just do not find the PHK an enjoyable choice compared to other choices.

Edited by Chuck Jager, 28 November 2016 - 10:59 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

xe N on, on 26 November 2016 - 02:55 AM, said:

AC10 + 4 SRM4 on a 2D2 is somewhat OK-ish

OK-ish doesn't really do the 2D2 brawler justice, while it may not be as good as the Griffin, it is still one of the top medium brawlers, probably the second best.

Either way, the Shaq Hawk is definitely the better of the two. I would suggest going with the 2K (3 LPLs is still solid, could use PPCs as well), 2D2 (standard brawling config), and 2H (all the dakka) for your three variants.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 28 November 2016 - 11:29 AM.