50 replies to this topic

[QuantumButler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 28 November 2016 - 11:27 AM, said:

OK-ish doesn't really do the 2D2 brawler justice, while it may not be as good as the Griffin, it is still one of the top medium brawlers, probably the second best.

Either way, the Shaq Hawk is definitely the better of the two. I would suggest going with the 2K (3 LPLs is still solid, could use PPCs as well), 2D2 (standard brawling config), and 2H (all the dakka) for your three variants.

I think it works better with a LB10 over a standard AC10 myself, that extra ton of weight helps a lot too.

At the range you're going to brawl at the lb10 spread is actually a boon in conjunction with the srm cloud, and the increased crit damage gets you tons of extra component desttructions.

Plus the lbx10 spread at extreme range makes it hilariously easy for you to tag all enemy mechs at least once for assists on every single foe.

Bonus, most people don't realize the lbx pellets are doing almost nothing to 'em at range and it makes them run for cover or otherwise throw them off.

There's a reason the shadowhawks didn't get big quirks, and that is because they have always been good to great machines, people forget that quirks were originally intended to bring poor performing machines up to par, and the Shadowhawk was that par for a very long time in the medium class, it and it's other 55 tonner resistance brothers were the top tier machines for mediums, and still performed solidly even with the advent of the clans, a combination of good hardpoint locations, good geometry, good engine caps, decent mobility, and top tier armor for a medium results in an all around solid machine and a good choice for any pilot.

Edited by QuantumButler, 28 November 2016 - 11:38 AM.

[0bsidion]

Escef, on 26 November 2016 - 07:40 AM, said:

The Shadow Hawk is hands down better than the Phoenix Hawk, imo... However, for the 300-500 meter range band, you're probably going to enjoy the P. Hawk more.

The P. Hawk moves quite well, slick little operator; but most variants cluster all of your weapons in the comparatively easy to lose arms (catch 22 with the P. Hawks, the arms do a good job protecting the body, but are easy to lose and have most of your firepower in them). P.Hawks also have 2 different ECM capable variants (the 1B and the 2).

The Shadow Hawk doesn't boat energy as well and isn't as nimble as the P. Hawk. However, with missiles and ballistics in the body (missiles and energy for the 2K), it can afford to use those good sized arms it has as shields for the body. Before the release of clan mechs and the quirk system, the Shadow Hawk was the best medium in the game, it was (and still is) a good compromise between agility, toughness, and firepower. However, it's biggest strength these days is to act as a close range striker build, get in, unload some SRMs and cannon shot, get out. And in that role it is largely eclipsed by the Griffin 2N (anywhere from 16 to 24 SRM tubes, possible medium lasers, and ECM). There are some viable mid to long range builds on Shadow Hawks (2K with large lasers or PPCs, 5M or 2H with 2xAC5, 2H going straight ranged DPS with 3xAC2, most models also can run some LRM support if you really want to), and you can make them work (the original Champion build for the Shadow Hawk 2H was 2xAC5 and a PPC, these days it uses a LPL instead of the PPC).

But it also depends on your playstyle. The P. Hawk is just straight up faster, and there's a lot to be said for that. As I said, I still prefer the Shadow Hawk.

^^ Mostly agree with this, I like different builds though. Admittedly my builds probably aren't as good but I have fun with them.

I got the PHX mostly out of nostalgia but I never expected it to be the creme of the crop, and I was right. The PHX isn't particularly good or bad, it's mediocre. The quirks helped alleviate this somewhat, but how well you do in it is mostly up to pilot skill. I typically get lukewarm results personally.

If you think of it as a slower, easier to hit light and don't try to face tank anything, just do hit and run on anything that isn't distracted, you'll probably do OK.

[Chuck Jager]

Forgot the with the SHK you can still play the 3lplas easily in to 300m if you weave with a team mate and learn to just poke the shoulder with the XL when you shoot. I do like this build with the 325 w/ferro and less armor, but you may need to go 300xl and more HS with more cautious play till mastered. The 3erllas is still decent if you got the modules for the erllas and a big 325-350xl. Your speed and high mount let you be where you need to be and still stay somewhat protected without hiding.

It is a bit weird because you are twisting your weapon side arm to protect you weapons instead of the opposite side, but the bigger engine and huge arm does it very well.

The 2h is really fun with great quirks for AC + accell, but it is not best in slot. 3ac2s is still fun to play (not recommended, but fun)

[FireStoat]

If I played IS I'd go Shadow Hawk, no question. Those high mounts are superb.

I play clan though so it's Huntsman for me. I feel bad watching the free blackjack, centurion, and the newly arriving gridiron all gathering dust though. Those three look like they're pretty good. If Inner Sphere ever got Light Fusion Engines I think I'd make the switch. On the table top game taking an XL engine on an Inner sphere mech wasn't a big deal due to random hit location charts, but in this game it's a dismal failure to use them on too large of a percentage of mechs you'd want them on.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

QuantumButler, on 28 November 2016 - 11:34 AM, said:

I think it works better with a LB10 over a standard AC10 myself, that extra ton of weight helps a lot too.

I agree, the LBX10 is a better choice than the AC10 for that build especially since you can throw in a XL 295 which puts it near GRF-2N speed.

[QuantumButler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 28 November 2016 - 12:38 PM, said:

I agree, the LBX10 is a better choice than the AC10 for that build especially since you can throw in a XL 295 which puts it near GRF-2N speed.

You can actually run it with a 300 XL if you don't mind only having 40 lbx and 450 srm shots.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4006e4fc107a256 like so.

Edited by QuantumButler, 28 November 2016 - 12:45 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

QuantumButler, on 28 November 2016 - 12:44 PM, said:

You can actually run it with a 300 XL if you don't mind only having 40 lbx and 450 srm shots.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4006e4fc107a256 like so.

My typical build: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...19e7ecb3ccdd84a

Ammo and DHS placement depends on whether I'm expecting legging to be a problem or not, legging used to be the goto method of killing brawlers so stripping legs at all is a no-no for them and the difference between 1 and 2 JJs is negligible.

[QuantumButler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 28 November 2016 - 01:17 PM, said:

My typical build: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...19e7ecb3ccdd84a

Ammo and DHS placement depends on whether I'm expecting legging to be a problem or not, legging used to be the goto method of killing brawlers so stripping legs at all is a no-no for them and the difference between 1 and 2 JJs is negligible.

yeah all that placement stuff is a matter of personal preference, I haven't had much issue with legging in my 2D2 whereas I have had issues of friendly fire accidentally setting off torso mounted ammo in the past when they hit my lightly armored back.

[Johnny Z]

I'm getting one of the Phoenix Hawks today. Just decided now. Cant argue with the price and another fast medium Hero will be nice.

[Gaden Phoenix]

Got both the Hawks. I remembering why I play heavies.. I got trust issues in pugs to push or take dmg. Alot of time (I feel) need some idiot (like me) to start push. Very few people (I feel) will actually be spear in push. But when they do, OMG, why can't every game be like that ... .

For the Shadowhawks are really not bad, but am finding it tough to get the Grey Death to work. The AC/10 (for me) needs alot of face time to max out dps, yet enemies laugh at my 2LPL and 1 AC10 = shoot that moron (me) for fun. Need to force myself to also play ninja style like most pugs do.

For Phoenix Hawks, they are ALOT ALOT of work for the average same amount of dps my heavy (BH2, WHR, LK, HBR) can do in 4~5 vomits. But fun. Just I cannot play them too many matches (aka leveling is painful).

I too much a, set up a firing line and cover hump, heavy or medium weapon boat player. PHX and SHK are really different play styles.

In pugs, I find I must really trust my team heavies and assaults to push and tank.. I finding that hard. When I get too impatient, I forgot I am squishy, will try to tank/push and die fast.

I leveled my Rifleman Legend Killer in what 2~3 hours. But sadly taking me FOREVER to level my phx-2 and grey death. Need to find some super pro youtube video on how to play phoenix and shadow and copy the playstyle.

Edited by Gaden Phoenix, 29 November 2016 - 08:58 PM.

[RAM]

~S~

Good dropping with you last night - enjoy the new mechs!


RAM
ELH