61 replies to this topic

[Angel of Annihilation]

Clydewinder, on 26 November 2016 - 11:53 AM, said:

not true. CTF 3D this morning, wpn group 2 is 1 UAC5 and 1 PPC - dropped on frozen city and got weapon jam on first right mouse click.

First shot jam would mean your weapon doesn't even fire a single shot. I haven't seen that myself. What I do is it firing one single shot then jamming.

However, I have also seen this happen on a Clan UAC. You pull the trigger and it jams after one single shot...NOT BURST...SHOT. With Clan UACs it seems like each shot can trigger the jam so you can have an UAC/10 which fires a burst of 4 shots actually jam mid-burst.

[Kylraven]

Ive played thousands of games aswell, and I've only noticed this issue since the "fix" to UAC's... all of them... and in my own personal experience the rates of jams has drastically increased, beyond the stated percentages, to the point that ive stopped using UACs.

[Charronn]

I binned the 2uac 10s earlier in my Timberwolf.Haven't played much dakka but I was kinda pissed off when they both jammed at the same time on multiple occasions.Very very annoying.
Nerf a whole weapon set because of the op KDK 3.GG PGI clothes.

[Chuck Jager]

I think it was a fix for macros
As stated before, if you got to exactly 1/2 cooldown for IS and somewhere between 1/3 and below 1/2 cooldown for clan you now get a little less to exactly the same as the new percentage. Before the fix, I could fire UAC10s without a macro and have very few jams. Firing in volley also now seems to be better than linked fast key press spamming weapons.

So if PGI is trying to reign in a possible issue with the macros this appears to be done, but the fix seems to have opened up potential triggers that hurt others worse. The chance seems to get modified by every key press and is also higher at certain times in the cooldown even if it does not trigger a shot. I found this out when I turned off the macro.

[Dee Eight]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 November 2016 - 11:31 AM, said:

It never jams on the first shot. First attempt at double-tap, yes. First pull of the trigger, period? No.

Point of fact, it does. Often enough that MANY players have noticed it and commented about it. Single trigger tap and jammed. There's been a bug in the code that produces that result for at least a year.

[Y E O N N E]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 02:15 PM, said:

Point of fact, it does. Often enough that MANY players have noticed it and commented about it. Single trigger tap and jammed. There's been a bug in the code that produces that result for at least a year.

Having a bunch of people complain is not a point of fact, especially when there is zero empirical evidence to support the claim. Not one video has ever been posted showing it jam on a fresh trigger pull. Can it jam after the first shot? Yes. And it has been demonstrated many times. But never on the very first shot.

[RestosIII]

Not sure if I've mentioned this before, but I've had it jam on the first shot, but only in a specific situation. On the testing grounds with 6x AC/2 I had it jam twice, and could never recreate it, on the first shot.

[Dee Eight]

Yeonne Greene, on 27 November 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

Having a bunch of people complain is not a point of fact, especially when there is zero empirical evidence to support the claim. Not one video has ever been posted showing it jam on a fresh trigger pull. Can it jam after the first shot? Yes. And it has been demonstrated many times. But never on the very first shot.

You're free to continue wrongly believing that. Won't cause me to lose sleep knowing you wish to remain ignorant to the fact it does happen that the very first shot will produce a jam result.

[Deathlike]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 02:50 PM, said:

You're free to continue wrongly believing that. Won't cause me to lose sleep knowing you wish to remain ignorant to the fact it does happen that the very first shot will produce a jam result.

I'm not sure if you realized but he has said "show proof" and noone has yet demonstrated this.

You can't just say "it exists" when the burden of proof relies on the person saying this.

Edited by Deathlike, 27 November 2016 - 02:53 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Deathlike, on 27 November 2016 - 02:53 PM, said:

I'm not sure if you realized but he has said "show proof" and noone has yet demonstrated this.

You can't just say "it exists" when the burden of proof relies on the person saying this.

I don't need to show proof to know it happens as its happened to me also. I'm not concerned at all with convincing folks who wish to remain ignorant to bugs in the game code. I know that its there. I know it can happen. I have given up trying to convince PGI tech support it happens. They clearly don't see fixing it as a priority anymore than they do fixing the JJ exploit code bug, or the physical collisions phase-thru bug, or any other faults in the game code.

[Deathlike]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 02:56 PM, said:

I don't need to show proof to know it happens as its happened to me also. I'm not concerned at all with convincing folks who wish to remain ignorant to bugs in the game code. I know that its there. I know it can happen. I have given up trying to convince PGI tech support it happens. They clearly don't see fixing it as a priority anymore than they do fixing the JJ exploit code bug, or the physical collisions phase-thru bug, or any other faults in the game code.

Well, I'm sure they'll fix it if they could replicate it... so as long as it didn't happen or isn't confirmed by PGI... it's just your word.

Also, what JJ exploit bug? Hoverjets™ suck.

Edited by Deathlike, 27 November 2016 - 02:58 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 02:50 PM, said:

You're free to continue wrongly believing that. Won't cause me to lose sleep knowing you wish to remain ignorant to the fact it does happen that the very first shot will produce a jam result.

You calling anybody ignorant is the pot calling the kettle black. You do need to prove it, because you say it is there. PGI doesn't do anything unless they see evidence. Russ personally request people post video of it and got nothing from anybody. And don't say they aren't responsive when people post empirical evidence, because they have gone out of their way to fix hitboxes on a multitude of 'Mechs, as well as SRM hit-reg, after receiving video evidence.

[s0da72]

Kylraven, on 27 November 2016 - 10:44 AM, said:

Ive played thousands of games aswell, and I've only noticed this issue since the "fix" to UAC's... all of them... and in my own personal experience the rates of jams has drastically increased, beyond the stated percentages, to the point that ive stopped using UACs.

Are you referring to when they buffed them about a year or so ago?

[Clydewinder]

Viktor Drake, on 27 November 2016 - 09:46 AM, said:

First shot jam would mean your weapon doesn't even fire a single shot. I haven't seen that myself. What I do is it firing one single shot then jamming.

However, I have also seen this happen on a Clan UAC. You pull the trigger and it jams after one single shot...NOT BURST...SHOT. With Clan UACs it seems like each shot can trigger the jam so you can have an UAC/10 which fires a burst of 4 shots actually jam mid-burst.

First shot jam = fires first shot, then jams

[Dee Eight]

Deathlike, on 27 November 2016 - 02:58 PM, said:

Well, I'm sure they'll fix it if they could replicate it... so as long as it didn't happen or isn't confirmed by PGI... it's just your word.

Also, what JJ exploit bug? Hoverjets™ suck.

Ignorant of the JJ exploit bug too eh? Color me un-surprised. You feather/pulse the JJ toggle and many weapons then fail to register hits onto your mech. Its been around a long time. At one time PGI claimed to have fixed it but whatever code they put in place apparently got omitted from recent patches because folks are reporting it again in the patch feedback forum. Search the forum for jump jet exploit and you'll find lots of threads on it. This is the reason the fire control macro program has a jump jet toggle programmed into it.

[Carl Vickers]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 09:06 PM, said:

Ignorant of the JJ exploit bug too eh? Color me un-surprised. You feather/pulse the JJ toggle and many weapons then fail to register hits onto your mech. Its been around a long time. At one time PGI claimed to have fixed it but whatever code they put in place apparently got omitted from recent patches because folks are reporting it again in the patch feedback forum. Search the forum for jump jet exploit and you'll find lots of threads on it. This is the reason the fire control macro program has a jump jet toggle programmed into it.

lol, the reason people feather the jj button is it puts peoples aim off, they see the jj's go and start trying to compensate aim which they then miss. It also stops them jj'er from getting hung up on pebbles as they move.

The one people are using now a days is the screenshot exploit. If you spam the screenshot button it makes your mech warp like you are lagging.

[Y E O N N E]

Clydewinder, on 27 November 2016 - 08:01 PM, said:

First shot jam = fires first shot, then jams

That's a second-shot jam, though. There are a whole host of things that are registering a second trigger pull from you, ranging from something as simple as you losing track of your pulls, to your mouse having a very low actuation point and your holding the mouse button causing it to flutter, to lag registering one marginally longer press as two separate ones.

It's not a bug in the code, it's an idiosyncrasy in the way the system works, including the hardware we play with.

[Deathlike]

Dee Eight, on 27 November 2016 - 09:06 PM, said:

Ignorant of the JJ exploit bug too eh? Color me un-surprised. You feather/pulse the JJ toggle and many weapons then fail to register hits onto your mech. Its been around a long time. At one time PGI claimed to have fixed it but whatever code they put in place apparently got omitted from recent patches because folks are reporting it again in the patch feedback forum. Search the forum for jump jet exploit and you'll find lots of threads on it. This is the reason the fire control macro program has a jump jet toggle programmed into it.

I'm not saying it's not in the netcode, but it's been known before that PGI's visuals of what the mech happens to "look" like "virtually" at the time is not necessarily the same as what players see visually.

With that said though, that wouldn't really account for your poor aim though.

[The Unstoppable Puggernaut]

I think people are missing PGI's point. Why are you taking UAC's any more, they're not this flavour of the month.

[Clydewinder]

Yeonne Greene, on 27 November 2016 - 09:33 PM, said:

That's a second-shot jam, though. There are a whole host of things that are registering a second trigger pull from you, ranging from something as simple as you losing track of your pulls, to your mouse having a very low actuation point and your holding the mouse button causing it to flutter, to lag registering one marginally longer press as two separate ones.

It's not a bug in the code, it's an idiosyncrasy in the way the system works, including the hardware we play with.

no, never got a second shot. firing UAC5 single-shot or holding the trigger down should give AC5 normal fire rate without jamming - in the instance described above, the UAC5 fires and reports jammed on the first shot.