196 replies to this topic

[Khalcruth]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

When the new patch drops next week, you get all your XP/GXP back and full C-Bill refunds on all affected modules.

Um, I could have sworn that Mech Con presentation said the skill tree changes weren't coming until at least February, possibly later.

[Y E O N N E]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:00 PM, said:

Tbe only "monetizing" will come from when you start spec'ing under the new system, and you then later want to unspec and respec. You will need MC to get your nodes replenished if you want to re-respec.

When the new patch drops next week, you get all your XP/GXP back and full C-Bill refunds on all affected modules.

The skill tree isn't coming next week.

[Felicitatem Parco]

Yeonne Greene, on 06 December 2016 - 03:09 PM, said:

The skill tree isn't coming next week.

Sorry, I didn't mean next week, my mind slipped. Will fix.

Anyways, I am still happily excited, and managed to not explode into fit of nerdrage when I saw the preview video. It takes quite a NaClhead to throw a temper tantrum when PGI removes a crappy old system and replaces with an actual skill tree just because of the values published in a demo presentation.

Edited by Prosperity Park, 06 December 2016 - 03:21 PM.

[SmithMPBT]

I think we're gonna lose some new players when they find out you have to play 2 hours a day for 75 days to skill up a mech. If the new grind sounds harsh to me as a longtime player, the casual millennials will just rub their neckbeards and leave.

[Zeoraimer]

Do we know if the refunded XP will be usable only on the mech or variant in which it was originally accumulated upon?

Or will refunded legacy XP be spendable on *any* mechs (like how GXP is right now?)


I've also noticed 2 things.

[1] Skill Point Tax
Judging by the video, for example, I can't just have +12.5% on just range. I'd also have to take some cooldown quirks too (which I may not need/want). This means, I'd have to spend potentially 9 or 10 skills points, but what I actually wanted would have only cost 5 Skill Points if it where not for the need to diagonal cross the skill tree...

[2] Non-transferable "modules"
I used to transfer weapon and mech modules. While the Skill point 50k Cbills to unlock, if linear, will only mean 3.75 million cbills for 75 Skill Points, is cheap on a single mech, it will be quite expensive if you "remaster" ALL your mechs...

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:17 PM, said:

It takes quite a NaClhead to throw a temper tantrum when PGI removes a crappy old system and replaces with an actual skill tree just because of the values published in a demo presentation.

It also takes an ignoramus to ignore the importance of those values (among other details, it isn't just those values that worry people) and how they affect mech choice and the counter-intuitive nature of trying to limit one of the selling points of this game, customization.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 06 December 2016 - 03:31 PM.

[Felicitatem Parco]

SmithMPBT, on 06 December 2016 - 03:27 PM, said:

I think we're gonna lose some new players when they find out you have to play 2 hours a day for 75 days to skill up a mech. If the new grind sounds harsh to me as a longtime player, the casual millennials will just rub their neckbeards and leave.

The new grind is about as long ad the old grind, according to russ with the actual values that will go live (as I said earlier).

So... are you saying the current grind is too long?

[Burke IV]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

The new grind is about as long ad the old grind, according to russ with the actual values that will go live (as I said earlier).

So... are you saying the current grind is too long?

If that is true then there is no reason not to just let elited mechs turn into unlocked mechs in the new system

[Pjwned]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

The new grind is about as long ad the old grind, according to russ with the actual values that will go live (as I said earlier).

So... are you saying the current grind is too long?

I think the grind could be shorter than it is now, but if the 3 variant requirement is going away then that makes a significant difference as to how incredibly annoying it is to grind up mechs, so I'm satisfied enough to hear that.

Burke IV, on 06 December 2016 - 03:41 PM, said:

If that is true then there is no reason not to just let elited mechs turn into unlocked mechs in the new system

Well, if the plan is to refund c-bills & XP spent from the current system then that would be a worse proposition actually.

There are several mech variants that I ended up grinding out solely to unlock elite skills for the variant I actually wanted (which were then promptly sold back after grinding with them enough), so I would much rather have the XP refunded from those variants and then redistribute it as I see fit.

Edited by Pjwned, 06 December 2016 - 03:59 PM.

[oldradagast]

Prosperity Park, on 06 December 2016 - 03:39 PM, said:

The new grind is about as long ad the old grind, according to russ with the actual values that will go live (as I said earlier).

So... are you saying the current grind is too long?

I'll believe it when I see it, but even if it is "about as long," that still fails to address the problem of de-quirking mechs and forcing them to slowly re-earn lesser versions of their quirks. Quirks are the only thing keeping a huge chunk of the mechs in the game remotely playable; take that away and you have no reason to play anything but the handful of meta-mechs. A more stale metagame is the last thing MWO needs.

[Burke IV]

Pjwned, on 06 December 2016 - 03:57 PM, said:

Well, if the plan is to refund c-bills & XP spent from the current system then that would be a worse proposition actually.

But it would be fair for everybody no matter how much xp you had or how many mechs you got, the xp is gone but the mechs you ground out remain. There are people with huge numbers of mechs, the people who have put the most into this game, they are in danger of getting a real bad deal.

[Morggo]

oldradagast, on 06 December 2016 - 04:00 PM, said:

I'll believe it when I see it, but even if it is "about as long," that still fails to address the problem of de-quirking mechs and forcing them to slowly re-earn lesser versions of their quirks. Quirks are the only thing keeping a huge chunk of the mechs in the game remotely playable; take that away and you have no reason to play anything but the handful of meta-mechs. A more stale metagame is the last thing MWO needs.

There was also a tweet where Russ indicates there likely will be base quirks on underperforming chassis that the skills will add to. All is well folks, they make mistakes but doubt they'd be so daft as to drive off their last 50,000 customers in one change.

[Mystere]

oldradagast, on 06 December 2016 - 04:00 PM, said:

I'll believe it when I see it, but even if it is "about as long," that still fails to address the problem of de-quirking mechs and forcing them to slowly re-earn lesser versions of their quirks. Quirks are the only thing keeping a huge chunk of the mechs in the game remotely playable; take that away and you have no reason to play anything but the handful of meta-mechs. A more stale metagame is the last thing MWO needs.

People saying Mechs are not "playable" is quite an exaggeration. I think "competitive" is the word you all are looking for.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Mystere, on 06 December 2016 - 04:47 PM, said:

People saying Mechs are not "playable" is quite an exaggeration. I think "competitive" is the word you all are looking for.

I think fun or enjoyable would be better words.

[TLBFestus]

Rampage, on 05 December 2016 - 05:28 AM, said:

As a matter of fact, it was mentioned on a NGNG podcast that there would be a post Mech_Con Town Hall. At first, it was scheduled before Mech_Con but then it was decided to move it back so that the reveals at the event could be openly discussed.

YEAH! That's the ticket! Our buddies over at NGNG will be tossing softballs and feathery kisses at Russ all night long. Can't wait to hear Russ' response to questions like;

-"What was it like at Mechcon"
-"Did you know you look particularly fetching in moonlight?"
-"That's the best answer ever Russ! Now, what was it?"!"
-"Is your seat comfortable, can I get you some more tea?"
-"Tell us why we aren't worthy....please!"

Spoiler

Edited by TLBFestus, 06 December 2016 - 05:16 PM.

[Pjwned]

Burke IV, on 06 December 2016 - 04:20 PM, said:

But it would be fair for everybody no matter how much xp you had or how many mechs you got, the xp is gone but the mechs you ground out remain. There are people with huge numbers of mechs, the people who have put the most into this game, they are in danger of getting a real bad deal.

I'm not seeing your point because they would get XP refunds for all those mechs presumably.

[RestosIII]

Mystere, on 06 December 2016 - 04:47 PM, said:

People saying Mechs are not "playable" is quite an exaggeration. I think "competitive" is the word you all are looking for.

Imagine running a Vindicator. Now imagine that without any quirks at all. That's what me mean by "not playable". I really hope PGI knows what it's doingg and doesn't **** this up by leaving mechs that NEED quirks unquirked because of the skill tree.

[Prof RJ Gumby]

RestosIII, on 06 December 2016 - 06:09 PM, said:

Imagine running a Vindicator. Now imagine that without any quirks at all. That's what me mean by "not playable". I really hope PGI knows what it's doingg and doesn't **** this up by leaving mechs that NEED quirks unquirked because of the skill tree.

He said he knows about this problem and they are working to include some bonuses for the underdogs. I suspect there will still be quirks, just in form of free skill nodes tagged by default or something like that.

Edited by Prof RJ Gumby, 06 December 2016 - 06:13 PM.

[Lightfoot]

I like it and think it's good if the end Skills are markedly better than the current end skills. This could be as a larger group of different skills or a specialized path to something that is much better than what you can do currently.

Again I say consumable modules and basic weapon modules should be kept as is. Weapon modules because they are pilot skills that are linked to the weapon and not the mech. Mechs could still get a weapon tree like Quirks work now, but ti doesn't make sense that an expert with Lasers or LBX, etc. would lose that knowledge by changing to a different mech. Just thinking how skills worked in some MechCommander games.

[Ukos]

looking at a lot of the negative posts a potential fallacy is that you have to buy every node on the tree to count as having mastered the mech (as per current skill tree) it may be worth considering you Don't need to buy all skills only activate those nodes you need to tune your mech to your play style.

The option appears to be there to cherry pick the nodes you want allowing a pilot to pick the abilities and bonuses you want or alternately spend the calculated volume to buy every node

in effect representing a pilot who has spent his career on one or two variants / chassis and mastered every aspect of those mechs (for lore fans equivalent to Aidan Pryde on the Summoner) or a more polymath pilot who has experience with a more varied stable of mechs .

In terms of legacy GXP received for previously earned experience has this been confirmed to be on a 1:1 ratio or is 1 current xp worth 2 or more LXP?