43 replies to this topic

[KingCobra]

For 4 years PGI has let teams Seal Club new players and pugs not only in faction play but in the past in the solo MM queues.

Finally PGI became smart and pretty much split the mm queues in solo play which helped the game immensely. Now it is time for PGI to split the Faction play queues into PUG Vs PUG, and Teams Vs Teams ONLY.

This has been needed for 3 years to be honest I have been on teams in MWO and have played it as a pug and I do know there is value in each type of game play but the inherent problem in MWO is when you stack up a team Vs PUGS its always a slaughter.

Many are going to come on this thread with
#1 join a team?
#2 suck it up buttercup
#3 this is hard mode= which it should be in a team Vs team situation not seal clubbing new players and casuals.

#ECT ECT ECT.

But the real reality is PGI needs to be funded to keep this game MWO alive and build the new MechWarrior5.
So I would propose splitting the faction play queues into 2 groups
#1= Teams vs teams only
#2 = Pugs Vs Pugs only.
this way new players and casuals/pugs can have fun in faction play and not get seal clubbed and rolled in 90% of there games each would still contribute to the winning or losing of planets in the faction warfare battles.

I believe this will work so PGI can still retain the older team players and contributors and regain the wallets and trust of the pug/casual player base in MWO plus pugs/casuals can still join a team if they choose and play in that queue when they feel they have enough skill to do so.

P.S PGI the older IS mechs are still weak and almost useless against there clan counterparts could you give 95% of the older IS mechs a armor boost? And I personally want to stay playing faction warfare and contributing to this game and funding it but you have to start seeing the other side of coin not just what the teams want.

[Stormie]

You they already did this right? And there were basically zero fights in the PUG queue? In fact all the PUGs fiddled the system to get back in the group queue so they could get games?

In fact it was such a success that it was removed again after a brief period (1 week? - memory is a little hazy)

Edited by Stormie, 14 December 2016 - 08:42 AM.

[KingCobra]

You they already did this right? And there were basically zero fights in the PUG queue? In fact all the PUGs fiddled the system to get back in the group queue so they could get games?

In fact it was such a success that it was removed again after a brief period (1 week? - memory is a little hazy)
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Lets be honest about this Stormy ((99% of pugs and casuals did not even know PGI split the faction play queues and they never even gave the spilt a fare chance to become part of the game. The teams squealed so loud and threatened Russ and PGI that they would quit funding the game that Russ basically caved in and removed it from the game.

Edited by KingCobra, 14 December 2016 - 08:46 AM.

[meteorol]

Stormie, on 14 December 2016 - 08:41 AM, said:

You they already did this right? And there were basically zero fights in the PUG queue? In fact all the PUGs fiddled the system to get back in the group queue so they could get games?

In fact it was such a success that it was removed again after a brief period (1 week? - memory is a little hazy)

They didn't split PUG and group queue.

They split the queue unit players / non unit players. Which was bound to fail. From the very first second. Everyone told them it would. There was no chance, literally 0% it would work.

[Stormie]

KingCobra, on 14 December 2016 - 08:46 AM, said:

Lets be honest about this Stormy ((99% of pugs and casuals did not even know PGI split the faction play queues and they never even gave the spilt a fare chance to become part of the game. The teams squealed so loud and threatened Russ and PGI that they would quit funding the game that Russ basically caved in and removed it from the game.

Its impossible to determine what percentage knew of this change, its also impossible to know what percentage of those thatdidnt know would have been interested anyway. All we can do is speculate.
What we do know is that there were almost no games played in the solos queue, and that the players from the solo queue took action to voluntarily reenter the group queue.

What you have to remember is that the population playing MWO isn't very large especially in off peak times. Steams numbers generally suggest around 600 people online when im playing in my 'primetime' (I understand that only a portion of the playerbase plays through steam... Its an illustration).
Splitting the buckets in half means longer wait times (probably zero matches in oceanic). Bucket consolidation has been the go to at PGI for a while now (first in quick play with removal of hard gametype choice, and now with removing individual factions). They aren't going to take a step back on this. It just doesn't make sense especially for a game mode that was on its knees and they are (apparently) trying to revitalise.

Edited by Stormie, 14 December 2016 - 08:58 AM.

[KingCobra]

They didn't split PUG and group queue.

They split the queue unit players / non unit players. Which was bound to fail. From the very first second. Everyone told them it would. There was no chance, literally 0% it would work.
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Who is everyone? sir?

And it was not doomed to fail what failed was a commitment by PGI to make it work it would be relatively east to do it and the pug/casual queue would be heavily populated the team queue would not and that is why they removed it because the teams were crying so hard they had no one to play and they could not continue to seal club everyone I know I'm on a top tier team since almost day 1 and have played as a pug also.

The problem team have is they need a huge global chat lobby to recruit new players train for free and coordinate battles VS other teams this was needed since day 1.

Stormy there not going to revitalize the faction warfare game mode by letting teams seal club and slaughter every pug/casual/new player that comes along to try out this game mode.

They are just driving people away with there wallets closed.

[Kwea]

KingCobra, on 14 December 2016 - 08:35 AM, said:

For 4 years PGI has let teams Seal Club new players and pugs not only in faction play but in the past in the solo MM queues.

Finally PGI became smart and pretty much split the mm queues in solo play which helped the game immensely. Now it is time for PGI to split the Faction play queues into PUG Vs PUG, and Teams Vs Teams ONLY.

This has been needed for 3 years to be honest I have been on teams in MWO and have played it as a pug and I do know there is value in each type of game play but the inherent problem in MWO is when you stack up a team Vs PUGS its always a slaughter.

Many are going to come on this thread with
#1 join a team?
#2 suck it up buttercup
#3 this is hard mode= which it should be in a team Vs team situation not seal clubbing new players and casuals.

#ECT ECT ECT.

But the real reality is PGI needs to be funded to keep this game MWO alive and build the new MechWarrior5.
So I would propose splitting the faction play queues into 2 groups
#1= Teams vs teams only
#2 = Pugs Vs Pugs only.
this way new players and casuals/pugs can have fun in faction play and not get seal clubbed and rolled in 90% of there games each would still contribute to the winning or losing of planets in the faction warfare battles.

I believe this will work so PGI can still retain the older team players and contributors and regain the wallets and trust of the pug/casual player base in MWO plus pugs/casuals can still join a team if they choose and play in that queue when they feel they have enough skill to do so.

P.S PGI the older IS mechs are still weak and almost useless against there clan counterparts could you give 95% of the older IS mechs a armor boost? And I personally want to stay playing faction warfare and contributing to this game and funding it but you have to start seeing the other side of coin not just what the teams want.

This is not only idiotic, but it was already tried and almost killed the game.

[KingCobra]

Kwea said (This is not only idiotic, but it was already tried and almost killed the game. )

No sir I disagree it was tried and it works it is still working quite well in the solo MM and it was never given a chance to work in Faction Play so I ask how has it killed the game? = NO!!

I truly believe you are misinformed sir.

Edited by KingCobra, 14 December 2016 - 10:13 AM.

[QueenBlade]

you don't remember solo CW?

you don't remember how people would create 1 person units so they could drop into the "group" CW?

[KingCobra]

Queensblade said (you don't remember solo CW?

you don't remember how people would create 1 person units so they could drop into the "group" CW? )

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Sure I do and you know why players did this right?

it WAS SO THEY COULD GET THE FACTION REWARDS that's all its a no brainer there I did it also just for the mech bays and rewards but hey PGI deservers a cookie there people were just playing to get the rewards and not worrying about all the imbalances and pug slaughter going on by the teams.

And don't get me wrong I think many players should join teams in Faction Play with there good skills but I believe they should only play other teams for pure competitive reasons there is no glory or competitiveness in slaughtering 12 lowly pugs.

Edited by KingCobra, 14 December 2016 - 10:51 AM.

[MischiefSC]

I'm going to be honest - at this point CW is just a new version of QP.

Split it but let us opt into unit queue. Then add a MM.

Pug queue has minimal if any effect on taking worlds.

This lets the terribad pugs go derp in the maps/modes without ruining the game for people who want to play to win.

Worlds are irrelevant, factions are irrelevant. It's just new maps/modes for QP. Finish the process and lets move forward before cement, again, that nobody but a handful of diehards should play FW.

[KingCobra]

MischiefSC said (I'm going to be honest - at this point CW is just a new version of QP.

Split it but let us opt into unit queue. Then add a MM.

Pug queue has minimal if any effect on taking worlds.

This lets the terribad pugs go derp in the maps/modes without ruining the game for people who want to play to win.

Worlds are irrelevant, factions are irrelevant. It's just new maps/modes for QP. Finish the process and lets move forward before cement, again, that nobody but a handful of diehards should play FW. )

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And I agree let the pugs play for faction rewards and teams for competitive FW game play but I also think teams need a boost from PGI in there ability to have a global chat lobby system to be able to recruit new players and train those players for free in private matches.

If you remember the MSN gamming zone during the NBT or MWL planetary years those two leagues alone had more active players than MWO has had ever and it was because of the fun social atmosphere along with the competitive team play,

Edited by KingCobra, 14 December 2016 - 11:09 AM.

[Evil Goof]

KingCobra, on 14 December 2016 - 08:35 AM, said:

For 4 years PGI has let teams Seal Club new players and pugs not only in faction play but in the past in the solo MM queues.

Finally PGI became smart and pretty much split the mm queues in solo play which helped the game immensely. Now it is time for PGI to split the Faction play queues into PUG Vs PUG, and Teams Vs Teams ONLY.

This has been needed for 3 years to be honest I have been on teams in MWO and have played it as a pug and I do know there is value in each type of game play but the inherent problem in MWO is when you stack up a team Vs PUGS its always a slaughter.

Many are going to come on this thread with
#1 join a team?
#2 suck it up buttercup
#3 this is hard mode= which it should be in a team Vs team situation not seal clubbing new players and casuals.

#ECT ECT ECT.

But the real reality is PGI needs to be funded to keep this game MWO alive and build the new MechWarrior5.
So I would propose splitting the faction play queues into 2 groups
#1= Teams vs teams only
#2 = Pugs Vs Pugs only.
this way new players and casuals/pugs can have fun in faction play and not get seal clubbed and rolled in 90% of there games each would still contribute to the winning or losing of planets in the faction warfare battles.

I believe this will work so PGI can still retain the older team players and contributors and regain the wallets and trust of the pug/casual player base in MWO plus pugs/casuals can still join a team if they choose and play in that queue when they feel they have enough skill to do so.

P.S PGI the older IS mechs are still weak and almost useless against there clan counterparts could you give 95% of the older IS mechs a armor boost? And I personally want to stay playing faction warfare and contributing to this game and funding it but you have to start seeing the other side of coin not just what the teams want.

The tier system should be utalized first and foremost. I would also like to see a queue for random pugs and set groups just as used in quick play and group quick play. Can't be overly restrictive how PGI tried it the last time however. A player should still be able to add himself to the looking for group queue in FW so that premades that aren't full twelve can pick up folks to fill their roster. This seems to be working fairly well for the group quick play right now vs the regular random quick play so why reinvent the wheel here?

A couple things that this is likely to do however that will get a ton of people pissy and create push back, is that there are a lot more dropping for Clan than IS. Those on the side that is oversaturated are going to be upset about any lockouts that will effect their ability or delay them getting matches. It will be tough to ignore those outcries but for the good of the game I think that is exactly what PGI has to do if they want to save FW. People will have to accept if you want to be on the side with 2000 teams going against the side with 100, you will have to wait to play one of those 100 teams.

Stormie, on 14 December 2016 - 08:41 AM, said:

You they already did this right? And there were basically zero fights in the PUG queue? In fact all the PUGs fiddled the system to get back in the group queue so they could get games?

In fact it was such a success that it was removed again after a brief period (1 week? - memory is a little hazy)

It was the restrictions on how it was implemented in phase three not the idea itself that was bad.

Needs to be open just like the quick play and group quick play are now. So it doesn't matter if you are in a Unit or not and the average tier of the group is taken into account.

[Zolaz]

The kiddy pool is over there ... in QP. When you want to take off your floaties you can come to the deep end of the pool, let us know Cobra.

[naterist]

OPs biggest point, and the one that NEEDS to happen for this game, is PGI needs to stop giving a **** about what the units want. they don't care about what's best for the game, they care about what's best for their units rankings and their leaderboard position.

[RaptorCWS]

naterist, on 14 December 2016 - 12:27 PM, said:

OPs biggest point, and the one that NEEDS to happen for this game, is PGI needs to stop giving a **** about what the units want. they don't care about what's best for the game, they care about what's best for their units rankings and their leaderboard position.

says the guy who has made rant after rant on the forums for the past 2 weeks about how unfair teamspeak is and how unfair units are. the units do not want to see FP die. its their favorite game mode. what is with your hate for units? did you ask to join a unit and get turned down? seriously most of your complaints are against people organizing into groups and playing with people they like to play with. Is it that no pugs were invited to the round table? because I really do not know of any good players who only pug. sure they may be out there but the good players whose names i see consistently dropping are apart of a unit, which is part of the reason why pgi invited leaders from the top units in FP to the round tables. because they play the game type more than most people in general, they come up with the builds and strategies that work. you do not balance a game around the games worst players.

[Wing 0]

Another idiot crying to split the queues again. solo players were given a chance and it had an EPIC FAIL. Solo queues took a 2 hour wait at average to get 1 lousy game where group queues got games in a 5 or 10 min average wait to get games. NGNG mentioned it wouldn't work before PGI gave it a shot and they were right about it. That's not going to happen again. So unless you're willing to work with units like the mode is said and not go pugging by yourself in trial mechs, you can always stay in quick play. The other option is the "exit" over there if you don't like that option.

Here is what the msg it gave out in regards of faction play:

Faction play has a strong emphasis on team cohesion and specialised 'Mech Loadout, and unlike Quick Play There is NO Skill-based matchmaking system in place! Faction play matches are often comprised of experienced and organized MechWarriors running well-stocked and heavily customized' Mech Loadouts.

If you are new to MWO it is strongly reccommend honing your skills in Quick Play and building up a stock of at least four customized and framiliar 'Mechs before joining the fight for the Inner Sphere

Its a different ball game here. Many players who play in Faction play on a daily basis will say something very similar.

[Freeman 52]

Sorry guys. Solo/grouo split never happened. I remember because I was solo, and it funneled solos with unit tags into the unit queue. That's why the non-tag queue emptied, and it was then that people made 1-man units to even play FP. And within a week PGI decided to eliminate the split because there were not enough solo players... Talk about a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Get your history right if you are trying to make a point.

And by the way, those first few matches that did happen between the unit-less were actually balanced and more fun than the usual stomps. So imagine what a split similar to QP could do.

[MischiefSC]

So to be clear - better to have FW dwindle out like it did in CW3 then just continue the changes already started?

FW is gone. Factions are irrelevant, worlds/fronts mean less than they did before. This is QP with new maps/modes. Current model is less appealing to the FP crowed who were in the empty CW3 and less forgiving to the pugs who've come to try it out.

FW is gone. Dead. Abandoned. Factions were removed and expectations set that any deeper mechanics wouldn't happen. We need to move beyond that and look at how to make what we have function.

The system of "we want pugs to come play so long as they know they'll always lose" isn't a sustainable system. We've tested that already.

[meteorol]

Freeman 52, on 14 December 2016 - 01:08 PM, said:

Sorry guys. Solo/grouo split never happened. I remember because I was solo, and it funneled solos with unit tags into the unit queue.

I can't get rid of the feeling a considerable amount of people never really understood the difference between the solo/group split people asked for and the unit/non unit split pgi delivered.