11 replies to this topic

[Cygone]

2017 new year, new game?

Figured I would give MWO another try, I've been way for about 6months. Logged into Faction Play, set up a couple of drops decks and went to kill me some 'Mechs.

Well this game hasn't changed.

Camp camp camp, death ball, death ball, death ball, premade, premade, premade.

How is it, other vehicle combat games, (WoT, WoWs, AW) the majority of the map gets used, in MWO almost everything happens in 2 squares, everyone camps waiting for the other team to attack.

Their is just no dynamics in game play.

I'll come back mid year and see where the game is then, I REALLY want to like MWO, however the developer just don't seem to ever get it right.

[Peenutts]

That is the players dictating the "problem" as you see it. Players camp, deathball and premade.

Your "problem" with premades will go away for you by playing quickplay solo. You stated you wanted to "kill me some mechs." That is what quick play is all about. Faction play is for groups.

Your other two problems you can help yourself with. Get a microphone and when drop into a match suggest out what ever strategy you think works. Talking during matches results in more wins in my opinion and I play solo quick play 100% of the time.


However grouping up the team is your best bet for a win. Usually the light mechs run off to find the enemy as the rest of the team comes together. If you want to have yourself a good time call out to move to left sides of maps. Teams always have this notion to move right, which can be fine. But if you want to see some funny stuff guide your team right into the enemy, who probally went to their right.

To conclude just remember only you can prevent forest fires.

[El Bandito]

Join a big unit, preferably Clan, or failing that Merc unit, and all your troubles will go away.

[JudauAshta]

first of AW is dead until 2.0 comes out, 2nd WOT is known to have terrible maps and mechanics. wows is not even relevant to me.

mwo for me is for more balanced then wot, has better maps. is mwo perfect, nooo. but it's pretty good.

you can also thank pgi for not including -/+25% rng on everything.

imagine playing a brawling atlas where you have a 25% chance to miss point blank, 25% chance for enemy to crit you to death. that's wot in a nutshell.

but then again it's human nature to whine about everything.

[Ruar]

Part of the problem could be solved by letting commanders draw on the map. Have some lines, arrows and Xs that can be placed to help coordinate attacks.

Another part is looking at map design and see what is forcing players to use certain tactics. From what I've seen the maps are either small and cluttered or open and flat. Imagine the polar highlands with deep gullies that disguise movement. How about the canyon map doubled in size? Take tormaline desert, flatten it out some, and add in a bunch more of the crystal outcroppings to get rid of the death valley's and open up more movement options.

You can't fully blame the players when map design is a huge part of why people move and fight where they move and fight. This was seen in WoT with constant map updates and changes to encourage desired gameplay and balance the strength of starting points.

[Novakaine]

Resist the Clans!

[H I A S]

El Bandito, on 07 January 2017 - 06:57 AM, said:

Join a big unit, preferably Clan, or failing that Merc unit, and all your troubles will go away.

lol
he was in my unit and there was no problem to stomp the opfor as 4 men in CW. so winning isnt the problem.

btw: he is right. it's a problem of bad map and mode design. the com give it the rest.

Edited by arivio, 07 January 2017 - 08:45 AM.

[El Bandito]

arivio, on 07 January 2017 - 08:44 AM, said:

lol
he was in my unit and there was no problem to stomp the opfor as 4 men in CW. so winning isnt the problem.

btw: he is right. it's a problem of bad map and mode design. the com give it the rest.

You just proved my point. He needs to get back into a unit.

[H I A S]

and u need to l2read

[Anjian]

Cygone, on 07 January 2017 - 04:21 AM, said:

2017 new year, new game?

Figured I would give MWO another try, I've been way for about 6months. Logged into Faction Play, set up a couple of drops decks and went to kill me some 'Mechs.

Well this game hasn't changed.

Camp camp camp, death ball, death ball, death ball, premade, premade, premade.

How is it, other vehicle combat games, (WoT, WoWs, AW) the majority of the map gets used, in MWO almost everything happens in 2 squares, everyone camps waiting for the other team to attack.

Their is just no dynamics in game play.

I'll come back mid year and see where the game is then, I REALLY want to like MWO, however the developer just don't seem to ever get it right.

We have discussed these games and their antiballing mechanics in the past, and its worth a revisit.

These games have really ugly anti-deathball mechanisms.

In World of Tanks, its called Artillery, sometimes fondly referred to as Arty. The game though suffers from something called Lemming Trains that is akin to deathballs.

World of Warships has a bit of a Lemming Train problem. However, it is lore and part of naval combat to form up into battle lines and focus fire on the enemy. They do however, have carriers that launch torpedo bombers and destroyers that may hide in the rocks and smoke ready to lay torpedo spreads.

In War Thunder, you got planes that bomb tanks. Those bombs have an area effect radius that can take out as many tanks within that radius. You also got barrage artillery.

There is a mech game I am recently playing on Android called War Robots. Also features a lot of stompy robots, and yet I never see deathballs there. The game also features on high tiers, area effect artillery like missiles. If your mechs are all bunched up, it makes a juicy target for area effect missiles.

But what strikes me with WR as well as WT, is that both games are highly objective driven. Does not matter if your team has more kills, if you don't capture the points, you will lose. There are more wins and losses on the account of the capture, or failure to capture, objectives, than the total attrition of the enemy team, which is actually more of a rare event. Being objective driven forces teams to disperse and capture all objectives, then defend them.

MWO tried to use an artillery element in the game for the same reason, but the result wasn't that popular, and I am sure the player base, small already as it is, would go up in arms if the arty barrage reaches a kill level against a fresh mech.

In my opinion, the nature of large walker mechs actually makes it closer to warships than tanks or infantry, which requires battle lines or formations to be drawn. The game doesn't feel like modern warfare, which requires a mastery of all space in the battlefield, but feels more like ancient and medieval warfare, with strict and close formations. What you experience in the game is not far off from Roman soldiers being ordered to form into a dense line, then have the discipline to maintain that line under heavy enemy assault.

But if players find fun in playing like that, I don't have any problems with it.

I was thinking about an FW game I played yesterday that felt like that, in Caustic. Two battle lines drawn between Clan and IS mechs, followed by a furious exchange both sides, and mechs dying all over. The battle wasn't clear to win till the final stage, when everyone was summoning their last reserve mechs, usually small fast ones, and Clanners won the final skirmishes.

Edited by Anjian, 07 January 2017 - 08:23 PM.

[Summon3r]

Anjian, on 07 January 2017 - 08:16 PM, said:

We have discussed these games and their antiballing mechanics in the past, and its worth a revisit.

These games have really ugly anti-deathball mechanisms.

In World of Tanks, its called Artillery, sometimes fondly referred to as Arty. The game though suffers from something called Lemming Trains that is akin to deathballs.

World of Warships has a bit of a Lemming Train problem. However, it is lore and part of naval combat to form up into battle lines and focus fire on the enemy. They do however, have carriers that launch torpedo bombers and destroyers that may hide in the rocks and smoke ready to lay torpedo spreads.

In War Thunder, you got planes that bomb tanks. Those bombs have an area effect radius that can take out as many tanks within that radius. You also got barrage artillery.

There is a mech game I am recently playing on Android called War Robots. Also features a lot of stompy robots, and yet I never see deathballs there. The game also features on high tiers, area effect artillery like missiles. If your mechs are all bunched up, it makes a juicy target for area effect missiles.

But what strikes me with WR as well as WT, is that both games are highly objective driven. Does not matter if your team has more kills, if you don't capture the points, you will lose. There are more wins and losses on the account of the capture, or failure to capture, objectives, than the total attrition of the enemy team, which is actually more of a rare event. Being objective driven forces teams to disperse and capture all objectives, then defend them.

MWO tried to use an artillery element in the game for the same reason, but the result wasn't that popular, and I am sure the player base, small already as it is, would go up in arms if the arty barrage reaches a kill level against a fresh mech.

In my opinion, the nature of large walker mechs actually makes it closer to warships than tanks or infantry, which requires battle lines or formations to be drawn. The game doesn't feel like modern warfare, which requires a mastery of all space in the battlefield, but feels more like ancient and medieval warfare, with strict and close formations. What you experience in the game is not far off from Roman soldiers being ordered to form into a dense line, then have the discipline to maintain that line under heavy enemy assault.

But if players find fun in playing like that, I don't have any problems with it.

I was thinking about an FW game I played yesterday that felt like that, in Caustic. Two battle lines drawn between Clan and IS mechs, followed by a furious exchange both sides, and mechs dying all over. The battle wasn't clear to win till the final stage, when everyone was summoning their last reserve mechs, usually small fast ones, and Clanners won the final skirmishes.

good points across the board............ ive moved from this game to warships a very long time ago and then come back to this and then go back to ships very soon after coming back to MWO..... a mech game along hte lines of warships would be nothing short of absofknlutely epic.

id love to see wargaming take a go at it.

that said btech is just around the corner

Edited by Summon3r, 07 January 2017 - 08:28 PM.

[Ruar]

In lore Battlemechs are considered to be closer to knights on horseback rather than foot soldiers. Which makes battle lines and the small, swirling duels fit.