Roundtable Meeting With Russ Bullock And Devs On Twitch.tv/ngngtv
#141
Posted 27 January 2017 - 02:29 PM
I for one want to see more simulation elements in this game. It doesn't have to be AlphaWarrior Online. In spite of what GasGuzzler may say
#142
Posted 27 January 2017 - 02:42 PM
MovinTarget, on 27 January 2017 - 06:34 AM, said:
Our unit will typically stay on an alternating 2 week rotation between clams and IS. We aren't groupies following bigger units.
So basically, if we were forced to choose on side or the other, it would suck. Believe it or not, I like FP better than QP and that means FP is the primary force behind my being a bit of a whale. I am pretty sure I am not the only one.
So simply put, put me and others in a corner and there will be some wallet implications for PGI.
Additionally, while people hate to admit it, mercs are rather pivotal in "balancing" sides... if ypu lock people in and it ends up being unbalanced based on player preferences... it could make things worse.
Balance means dirrent things to dofferent people:
Is it that either side can win a given match?
Is it either side can win a planet?
These are two different things if you think about it... it would be awfully hard to flip a planet if every game is a discreet 50/50 coin toss.
So part of what needs to be tackled is honestly people just getting on board with a common idea of long term success conditions...
Maybe we simply have each hour of a phase be a certain mode and at ceasefire tally which side had the most wins... or each hour is a "pie piece" and getting 51% (or whatever it would be if 8 hours, need 5 pie pieces)... then you could get unit/player bonuses for each hour's win (an hour is arbitrary here, just an example) and also for best overall performance over the phase.
That may ultimately not be optimal either, but the current tug of war, eternal qp mode is not super fun...
Well there is no fun when a Loyalist get the short stick of FP. The main problem I see is that Mercenaries run Faction warfare when it's supposed to be the opposite. If you're a IS or Clan loyalist, you have to stick with the side you are given but as a Mercenary, I can run an IS or Clan deck. I hate the Mercenary life in this game both in a lorewise and gameplay perspective. What I also hate about Merc Life is the fact they can jump around all willy-nilly with no consequences at all. A merc corp can take planets within days, but next week that same merc corp can take back those planets as IS. I don't think that Merc Corps should be removed from the game but they should be restricted from ever serving the Clans. This is also why I said the Clans should have a Merc equivalent of their own. One example this could be shown is by having the traditional Clan Daggerstar.
For example these pictures would be fine:
With these pictures at least they make sense, because you are saying, "I am a Clan unit but I am reinforcing a specific Clan."
NOT THESE!:
It just feels wrong to me. If the current clan images were altered to have the Clan Daggerstars instead of the Merc Corp symbol, I wouldn't gripe too much about it.
But still, loyalists need more love than just pictures. For Loyalist players, they should be infused with RPG-Elements like NPC faction leaders for faction events. Rewards could be better as well such as Faction Decals, Unlocking Faction Patterns for Faction Specific mechs, faction colors, etc. Anything to make Loyalists much more appealing than Mercenaries.
Edited by Will9761, 27 January 2017 - 03:04 PM.
#143
Posted 27 January 2017 - 02:50 PM
Edited by naterist, 27 January 2017 - 02:50 PM.
#144
Posted 27 January 2017 - 03:04 PM
Will9761, on 27 January 2017 - 02:42 PM, said:
For example these pictures would be fine:
With these pictures at least they make sense, because you are saying, "I am a Clan unit but I am reinforcing a specific Clan."
NOT THESE!:
It just feels wrong to me. If the current clan images were altered to have the Clan Daggerstars instead of the Merc Corp symbol, I wouldn't gripe too much about it.
But still, loyalists need more love than just pictures. For Loyalist players, they should be infused with RPG-Elements like NPC faction leaders for faction events. Rewards could be better as well such as Faction Decals, Unlocking Faction Patterns for Faction Specific mechs, faction colors, etc. Anything to make Loyalists much more appealing than Mercenaries.
As I stated earlier in this thread *and* in the thread about bumping Clan tonnage to 245, I fully endorse Loyalists getting some love, despite the fact that I am a merc.
I would love it if they made it so attractive that I'd be tempted to switch, permanently... but it's not, and I like using all my mechs... that's my attraction to merc life... [IDI] doesn't just follow the merc pack (if there even is one), its not all about winning, we like competetive games and care more about having fun that feeling like we *have* to win every single game.
So yes, I honestly would love to see them make Loyalist a more attractive career path.
#145
Posted 27 January 2017 - 03:49 PM
as for gameplay ideas comes to mind the 12v12 aspect of most shooters tends to be a bit stale.. perhaps a push to a scale like planetside 2's game play which is a larger scale 100 vs 100 with different support & main mechs which the other mw game online portrays in which has the addition of aerospace fighters, tanks & battlesuits.
the main aspect of mwo maps have 15 main maps which could be used as a basic idea for planets to form around in plus limit the planets to these conditions in order to develop a possible story line for a limited amount of planets in which the factions fight in instead of 300+ planets with the same 5 invasion type maps(sulfur/moon/arctic/forest/crystal) .
maps like polar arctic and thera therma (revised) slightly enhanced and expended about 2-3 times could hold more different types of units(air/ground/infantry) and mechs
it just seems to feel like mwo has reached its peak and therefore interest and people playing is dropping to new lows without a more diverse gameplay, like the implementation of player made bases in planetside 2 i think the current mwo franchise will fail and cease to keep the player base interested in the game
#146
Posted 27 January 2017 - 04:03 PM
Draven Darkshadow, on 27 January 2017 - 03:49 PM, said:
as for gameplay ideas comes to mind the 12v12 aspect of most shooters tends to be a bit stale.. perhaps a push to a scale like planetside 2's game play which is a larger scale 100 vs 100 with different support & main mechs which the other mw game online portrays in which has the addition of aerospace fighters, tanks & battlesuits.
the main aspect of mwo maps have 15 main maps which could be used as a basic idea for planets to form around in plus limit the planets to these conditions in order to develop a possible story line for a limited amount of planets in which the factions fight in instead of 300+ planets with the same 5 invasion type maps(sulfur/moon/arctic/forest/crystal) .
maps like polar arctic and thera therma (revised) slightly enhanced and expended about 2-3 times could hold more different types of units(air/ground/infantry) and mechs
it just seems to feel like mwo has reached its peak and therefore interest and people playing is dropping to new lows without a more diverse gameplay, like the implementation of player made bases in planetside 2 i think the current mwo franchise will fail and cease to keep the player base interested in the game
If the servers and clients could handle 100v100 that would be crazy to see.. but a big if...
#147
Posted 27 January 2017 - 05:15 PM
Tarogato, on 26 January 2017 - 01:30 AM, said:
I just listened to this section of the premeeting now and this really is a high priority issue. I gave it some thought and I think that a good solution can be made by modifying an idea I presented earlier in this thread. Check this spoiler:
Faction Play IS map and planet significance.
If you associate a pair of game modes (domination, conquest, invasion, skirmish) with each of the planet types, then you could essentially improve chances of a certain game mode being present but not exclusively 1 type that that planet/region. An example would be that Domination and skirmish could be the most likely game types for the Intel region. Invasion and conquest could be predominantly on the industrial regions. An alternate game mode grouping would be present on the logistics region.
This would allow a small amount of control over the game type that people want to drop in while providing some element of chance so that it isn't a single mode to a single region. The obvious downside to this is that it would essentially create 3 buckets where people decide which of the resources they want to capture most for that time in the phase. However, the increased depth may bring enough people into FP to allow a tier system to be implemented there and thus solve skill disparity issues.
Looking at the discussion points, it seems that no single implement can sufficiently improve FP on its own, but rather a combination of them together are necessary to both raise interest in FP which will raise the population, then retain enough of them in order to add a matchmaker that will balance the matches in FP.
#148
Posted 27 January 2017 - 06:14 PM
I disagree with all of that. Balance will happen anyway over time, and is not necessarily a CW thing, but just a game thing. XL engines. More trivial stuff that gets sorted out in balancing. Rewards? The game should be fun to play with or without extra stuff. What is the use of extra stuff if you're doing the same thing all the time and not actually affecting the MAP.
What we need, in a nutshell, is:
Supply lines. The further from a capitol planet you are, the less you get paid. Every week, faction loyalists get to vote to change that planet. However, the larger the empire, it means that the front lines may be very far away from the capitol. This has the effect of the larger the empire, the less they pay their mercs/harder to supply their front lines = less cbills.
Raiding: a game mode that represents guerrilla warfare and partisan attacks behind the front lines. These raids have the effect of reducing supply (cash) to the front lines. If a faction doesn't defend against them, the front line guys don't get paid. The raids should be 6 v 6 or 8 v 8 filling in the blanks in our drop options and helping smaller units to build up from scouting matches to bigger groups.
Planets with meaning. Certain planets should have bonuses. These should be non-mech bonuses. If you control the planet you get stuff like sensor towers, turrets, smoke/chaff artillery, VTOL support, armor support, infantry nests (like SRM nests, hidden until triggered) and so on. These wouldn't make the mechs any better, but would be things that would help in minor ways during the battle. Mech factories: I do like the idea of faction specific mechs or tech, but for all practicality, leave it. In fact, I'm sick of the IS vs. Clan segregation. When we get the new tech in summer, IS will (canonically) be buying clan mechs from Sea Fox, Nova Cats will be part of the Inner Sphere, along with Clan Wolf in Exile, and the Ghost Bears will merge with FRR. (And thank God, so sick of the segregation.) If a faction takes a clan or IS factory, for each factory planet they take, they can add a mech of opposite tech to their drop decks.
Unit coffers should help the unit: let us withdraw money from the coffers to buy mechs or otherwise support new players or help them fill out their drop deck. This amount could be capped. Up to unit leadership how stuff is distributed.
Economic mini-game: This game would run separately from the main game, and solo players could use it representing stock brokers, arms dealers, commodities vendors. These would be 'rogue traders' who would go around and make deals both within and outside of the faction lines. The effects would be stuff for either the faction (for faction players) or the unit. You could get your hands on the black market and get technology for your friends. (Maybe put a clan mech in an IS dropdeck and vice versa.) For factions that are in trouble, it would help mitigate the effects of raids and supply line issues. It would give poorer players a chance to really contribute to their unit/faction as well. Players could own dropships and rent Jumpships to move around the galaxy.
Factions should be able to pick and vote on a very specific planet or at least prefecture to attack, and other factions (houses/clans) should not get in the way. If there aren't enough players to populate entire factions, limit the fronts to, say, Steiner vs. Falcon. Add factions as population increases, unlocking those factions/fronts. You could even consider adding more of a type of faction if populations get too lopsided. Let's say you have Steiner vs. Falcon, but there are twice as many clan players. Open up Wolf too. Wolf will HAVE to fight Falcons as they don't border Steiner. Likewise with Merrick. It would be a balancing factor. (Even I'm not sure on that, but worth a consideration.).
Notice, EVERYTHING above adds content to the game, and MEANING.
Edited by Peiper, 27 January 2017 - 06:35 PM.
#149
Posted 27 January 2017 - 06:55 PM
LOYALISTS:
Can either be Solo or in a Unit.
Loyal to their faction
Can only fight for their sworn Faction and its allies.
Handles votes to determine planetary assaults
Reputation gains are increased
Cbills gains are based on reputation rank (rank 20 will make more than a rank 1) but are lower than Mercenary pay
House/Clan based Mechs repair/refit faster and cheaper than non-House/Clan based Mechs
Players can use reputation to cover repair/refit expenses or cbills or MC.
Breaking loyalty will reduce reputation gain. Must undergo a 5-match probation period before receiving full benefits.
MERCENARIES:
Must be in a Unit.
Must sign a Faction Contract.
Can only fight for their contracted Faction and its allies
Fighting for the highest bidder, does not vote (7 day contracts)
MRBC reputation gain stays normal
Cbills gains and bonuses are increased and are based on reputation rank
Repair/Refit costs and timers are increased
Players can use reputation to cover repair/refit expenses or cbills or MC.
Breaking of contracts are met with severe penalties. Reduction in contract bonus.
FREELANCERS:
Cannot be in a Unit.
No Faction Contract or allegiance is required.
Can only drop into matches by accepting an Urgent Call To Arms
Receives only standard cbill gains
Does not receive Faction Loyalty or MRBC reputation points.
Repair/Refit costs and timers are standardized
ATTACK TYPES
SCOUTING
4v4 Game Mode, where one team tries to steal/gather Intel, while the others try to stop them.
1 mech, 20 to 55 tons max
INVASION
12v12 Game Mode, Tug of War combat in an attempt to remove the enemy forces from the planet and take control for your faction.
Each battle can sway the capture percentage from two to five percent.
Crushing Victory - Win with more than 36 mechs remaining for your side, 5% pull
Clear Victory - Win with 35-24 mechs remaining for your side, 4% pull
Average Victory - Win with 23-12 mechs remaining for your side, 3% pull
Close Victory - Win with less than 12 mechs remaining for your side, 2% pull
Every time 20, 40, 60, 80, and 100% is crossed. A CW map is triggered in the matchmaker. Everything else in between is randomized between the QP map/game modes to create a random and dynamic planetary campaign. Planet will only be captured if 4/5 (9/10) CW map nodes are in favor of the attacking forces.
LEAGUE MAP
Faction Play map shows the realm of space known as the Inner Sphere. It is here that the six ruling Houses and four invading Clans battle one another over control of worlds. The Inner Sphere is divided into realms controlled by each Faction at the beginning of the game. Each planet contributes to the costs of repairs towards your Mechs. As planets are lost and gained, repair costs and timers will increase or decrease. These planets are also connected by a lattice system that Loyalists can vote on as part of determining which Planets their faction will assault.
Lattice Map reference: http://iscs.teamspam...30.20020918.jpg
FACTION REPUTATION
LOYALISTS:
Rank 1 to 20 will increase pay from 1% to 20%, and decrease repair cost/timers. The attached rewards are given only once, but rank will reset between seasons
*Change how Clan loyalist gain reputation. Rename to Honor.
Honor is gained by dropping with tonnage available (reducing their total drop deck tonnage by taking lighter mechs). The more tonnage available in their drop deck, the more honor that is gained. Honor can be increased further through victories.
MERCENARY:
Rank 1 to 20 will increase pay from 1% to 20%, and decrease repair cost/timers. The attached rewards are given only once, but rank will reset between seasons
FACTION POPULATION BALANCE
https://mwomercs.com...ost__p__5131382
PLANETARY TYPES
With the addition of quickplay maps there posses an opportunity to make Planet types based on climate.
CW MAPS
Boreal Vault
Emerald Taiga
Grim Portico
Hellebore Springs
Sulfurous Rift
Vitric Forge
QP MAPS
Alpine Peaks
Canyon Network
Caustic Valley
Crimson Strait
Forest Colony
Frozen City
Grim Plexus
HPG Manifold
Polar Highlands
River City
Terra Therma
The Mining Collective
Tourmaline Desert
Viridian Bog
Examples:
COLD WORLD
CW map: Boreal Vault
QP maps: Alpine Peaks, Frozen City, Polar Highlands
HOT WORLD 1
CW map: Victric Forge
QP maps: Caustic Valley, Terra Therma, Viridian Bog
HOT WORLD 2
CW map: Sulfurous Rift
QP maps: Caustic Valley, Terra Therma, Viridian Bog
HOT WORLD 3
CW maps: Victric Forge, Sulfurous Rift
QP maps: Caustic Valley, Terra Therma, Viridian Bog
Idea here is that it would make building drop decks simpler and tuned towards Planet types instead of map
PLANETARY VALUE / LOGISTICS
By including the Repair/Refit system, planets can now be valued where they affect repair costs and timers. Factions that begin to lose planets, repair costs and timers would begin to increase.
Special planets can be labeled to affect the repairs towards specific mechs and/or specific weight classes as well. Encouraging factions to hold or take these planets.
MC can still be used as an added reward, keep costs similar to those that would cover repair costs for unit members
END GAME OBJECTIVES / SEASON END / MAP RESET
Clans: Capture Terra
Houses: Capture majority of House capitals (3)
The idea here is that by sharing objectives this will encourage Clans and Houses to fight not only each other but themselves as well. Upon completing these objectives, the unit with the most impact towards a faction’s victory will receive rewards that they can show off next season.
If Clan win:
Loyalist
Leader: Title, Decal, and Camo - ilKhan
Unit members: Title, Decal, and Camo - ilClan
Mercenary
Leader: Title, Decal, and Camo - Colonel
Unit members: Title, Decal, and Camo - Wolf’s Dragoons
If House win:
Loyalist
Leader: Title, Decal, and Camo - First Lord
Unit members: Title, Decal, and Camo - Star League Defense Force
Mercenary
Leader: Title, Decal, and Camo - Colonel
Unit members: Title, Decal, and Camo - Wolf’s Dragoons
#150
Posted 27 January 2017 - 06:55 PM
-
on death, you can choose where you now want to Drop,
once the Drop Timer Starts(Every 30Secs) your Locked in and cant change your Choice,
(this Stops problems with People from changing their Chose in Route to drop)
-
if more than 4 people have Chosen a Single Drop Location in that 30Sec Window,
each Drop Ship past the First is Delayed more as to allow all to Drop in the Same Location,
(this stops the need for multiple Drop Locations in a single Drop Location)
Invasion Phase Selection Fix,
-
Manipulative Voting per Phase,
1st Phase= Possible Game modes to Vote on(Skirmish, Conquest, Domination)
2nd Phase= Possible Game modes to Vote on(Conquest, Domination, Assault)
3rd Phase= Possible Game modes to Vote on(Domination, Assault, Invasion)
Factions Loyalist Bonuses?
-
give Loyalist Free(Loyalist Patterns) / (Faction Colors)
which are only Available as long as you remain a Loyalist to that Faction,
Change to another Faction and you lose your Faction Patterns/Colors,
(this removal doesnt not remove Patterns/Colors Bought with MC)
-
Also give Loyalists X2 Experience?(Buffer for Skill Trees)?
Higher Tonnage when Droping(Perhaps 10 or 15 more Tons)?
Edited by Andi Nagasia, 27 January 2017 - 08:07 PM.
#151
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:08 PM
#152
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:13 PM
...Voting is like telling your Contract or Commander as a Solider you know whats best. Time to follow orders/do your job.
#153
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:16 PM
#154
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:25 PM
#155
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:31 PM
Their three points are small mechanics in the scheme of things. Not unimportant, but certainly not "most" important.
Most important remains population which ended in single bucket, no factions, no planets (and soon it sounds, no phases). This comes back to match balance. This in turn makes broken respawn miserable at times.
This is what continues to kill FW.
#156
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:36 PM
Example: Battle Value (BV) ranged from 1-20. Each dropship of your 4 mechs has a BV total that is Equal for both IS and Clan. You have a Jenner-D, an Oxide, and a Jenner-IIC. The Jenner D is a value of 6, the Oxide is a value of 9, and the IIC has a value of 10 because clan tech is a bit better (this also depends on if the stats say if Oxide or IIC is better). You might not have enough BV left to take the IIC or Oxide with your other 3 mechs so you take the Jenner-D, or even a bad Medium mech with the same BV, instead.
This way more powerful/OP/Meta mechs are not being taken the entire time, it gives way to variety, and when new Meta Mechs come to light (because of Patch changes), all you have to do is change the BV of that mech to give easy balance.
I want to know what you think! Please give me your ideas around this.
Edited by ragedog4, 27 January 2017 - 07:40 PM.
#157
Posted 27 January 2017 - 07:53 PM
ragedog4, on 27 January 2017 - 07:36 PM, said:
I want to know what you think! Please give me your ideas around this.
I LOVE battle value. Much better than tonnage to show worth of mechs. Should have been done LONG ago before they even worried about trying to make clan and IS mechs balanced/the same.
As far as canon merc units: Make them something a unit could join, gets more money or something and neato stickers for their mechs, but the cost is, they don't choose your faction. The MRBC or other omnipotent (devs) choose which faction you fight for. Could help balance factions.
Regarding mixing clan and inner sphere mechs in a drop deck:
With the new weapons/tech coming out, timeline moves foward, no? by 3060, CSJ is dead, FRR and Ghost Bear are merging. Nova Cats and Clan Wolf in Exile are inner sphere factions with clan tech. Sea Foxes/Diamond sharks are selling mechs to everyone, salvage all over the place. it's time to dump the segregation of tech, and battle value will help determine balancing should any problems occur with that.
But come on, today we spent two hours talking about game balance, drop zones/dropship locations, and how to give out more rewards. Not a single piece of new content was mentioned other than something happening in July. No vision. No forward momentum. Highly discouraging. It seems both the player and the Devs are stuck in a box, can't see out, can't see that there's so many more possibilities. Sigh... As disappointing as the buckets podcast.
Edited by Peiper, 27 January 2017 - 08:02 PM.
#158
Posted 27 January 2017 - 08:04 PM
#159
Posted 27 January 2017 - 08:08 PM
edit: Other points...
Not much talk about Scouting. With the Bushwacker in Scouting, need to allow Clans to use Stormcrows again.
Stop with the shotgun nerfing approach. 'HunchbackIIC is too annoying with poptarting, so lets nerf that and Huntsmans, and all JJ mechs!'
What is with the fixation on poptarting? At present and in the last six months, it really has not been a problem, and only done effectively by a small segment of players.
Solution to being able to select your spawn point and not have dropships intersecting.... Drop pods.
More love for Loyalists, whether with the skill tree, higher weight class, faction base quirks, etc. In turn, Mercs do not get those and get their own merc theme perks.
Does PGI have an actual QA team? As in, dedicated QA and now a Dev doing the testing?
Edited by Morticia Mellian, 27 January 2017 - 08:17 PM.
#160
Posted 27 January 2017 - 08:09 PM
I would be more than happy to open a dialogue regarding the Faction perks and Faction Specific Mechs as well as ways to balance them appropriately to avoid a "meta" faction and to address the benefits that such systems would provide for the overall health and retained population in FP. I have a few posts in this thread already (main one is post 57 on page 3) with some of the ideas introduced. They are rough outlines and are designed to be a start point for the concepts to be discussed and further developed.
Thanks
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