74 replies to this topic

[cazidin]

RestosIII, on 06 February 2017 - 02:18 PM, said:

Honestly, I'm one of the sick people that actually would have enjoyed a WoT aiming system if it was implemented back when the game launched, but doing it now, this late into the game's life span? I don't think it would work out well at all.

Now, for something I wish was in the game right now that would be nice, and would still work? Still wish AC recoil was in the game like in MW3.

At least my bad ideas are funny...

[RestosIII]

cazidin, on 06 February 2017 - 03:22 PM, said:

At least my bad ideas are funny...

Oh, I 100% know a WoT system wouldn't work for this game just because of how it was setup in the first place. But at least AC recoil would work.

[cazidin]

RestosIII, on 06 February 2017 - 03:29 PM, said:

Oh, I 100% know a WoT system wouldn't work for this game just because of how it was setup in the first place. But at least AC recoil would work.

I wasn't talking about your idea. You're cool.

Although... he HAS given me an idea for a joke thread. Prepare your angry gifs!

Edited by cazidin, 06 February 2017 - 03:35 PM.

[FrozenWaltDisney]

Pjwned, on 06 February 2017 - 03:06 PM, said:

Really dumb idea, especially considering the reason why.

If you want STD engines to be more relevant despite their (typically) smaller rating when equipped, which is fine, then decouple mech agility from engine rating instead.

Punishing movement and big engines with decreased accuracy is stupid.

It's a bit more complicated then broad strokes you paint, and this type of system is hardly unique since it exists pretty much everywhere. But thanks for you opinion, I glad you can articulate your feels so well

I am not sure how decouple mech agility would work though. That seems like a much more drastic change.

Edited by FrozenWaltDisney, 06 February 2017 - 04:05 PM.

[NighthawK1337]

RestosIII, on 06 February 2017 - 01:20 PM, said:

So what you're saying is that you want to nerf light mechs. No thanks.

Basically this^


So yeah,

[Andi Nagasia]

i had a topic like this, but my Topic was about Bobing,
(Arm Weapon Viability + Convergence Idea)
and also gave use to Arms, which most smaller mechs store their weapons,

[Pjwned]

FrozenWaltDisney, on 06 February 2017 - 04:05 PM, said:

It's a bit more complicated then broad strokes you paint, and this type of system is hardly unique since it exists pretty much everywhere. But thanks for you opinion, I glad you can articulate your feels so well

There's no meaningful distinction between what I said and what you proposed, at all, and it "exist[ing] pretty much everywhere" is irrelevant.

And it's a bad idea for 2 reasons:

1) Arbitrarily messing with weapon accuracy is stupid; there's no way of doing this without introducing some element of randomness to weapon accuracy and that automatically disqualifies the idea as being complete trash.

2) Punishing mechs for moving and having big engines just makes combat even more static than it already is, in addition to light mechs being unequally affected because they're punished for using their speed even though that's nearly all they have.

Is that better? Do I need to go into more explicit details why your stupid and (self-evidently) bad idea is bad?

Quote

I am not sure how decouple mech agility would work though. That seems like a much more drastic change.

Every mech just gets a baseline torso twisting speed instead of it varying based on engine rating; pretty simple beyond the initial implementation which would also be pretty simple anyways.

And it's less drastic than your stupid idea to constantly screw with weapon accuracy.

Edited by Pjwned, 06 February 2017 - 05:12 PM.

[FrozenWaltDisney]

Pjwned, on 06 February 2017 - 05:10 PM, said:

And it's less drastic than your stupid idea to constantly screw with weapon accuracy.

Not sure how you quantify something that is variable... but hey apparently you figured it out.

Andi Nagasia, on 06 February 2017 - 05:04 PM, said:

i had a topic like this, but my Topic was about Bobing,
(Arm Weapon Viability + Convergence Idea)
and also gave use to Arms, which most smaller mechs store their weapons,

Ooh interesting. Nice read. I really wish we could actually brawl... but the technical aspects were far from PGI when I first backed, and I don't think much has changed. I will have to wait for the Battletech game to complete which so happens includes that

[Pjwned]

FrozenWaltDisney, on 06 February 2017 - 05:23 PM, said:

Not sure how you quantify something that is variable... but hey apparently you figured it out.

That's why you establish a baseline, like I said.

Let's just make up something on the fly and say that a mech's agility is determined by its max engine rating, subtract the mech's tonnage from that number, and the mech's baseline agility is what it gets from that engine rating; so for example a Locust weighs 20 tons and has an engine cap of 180 so its baseline agility would be the same as what it gets from a 160 rated engine currently.

Not an example of a good idea, but still an example of how you could establish a baseline; there would be many other options too.

[RAM]

Speed dependent reticle shake: long overdue...


RAM
ELH

[FupDup]

Tristan Winter, on 06 February 2017 - 01:46 PM, said:

For what it's worth, I think that the MWO as a game has never had any kind of Cone of Fire...

We already have it, actually. Machine Guns, SRMs, and LBX. That's what CoF is at its core.

Firing two PPCs under a CoF system would more or less be like firing an LB 2-X right now in terms of accuracy.

Edited by FupDup, 06 February 2017 - 06:42 PM.

[El Bandito]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 06 February 2017 - 01:23 PM, said:

Don't forget promote more static engagements.

But that's how Battlemechs fought in the novels. If they wished to shoot with any kind of accuracy they had to slow down or even completely stop. And their targeting computer had to get a full lock first, as well. Unless you are Kai Allard.

Except MWO's silly instant pinpoint convergence is making Kai Allard out of most of us. There is little immersion.

Edited by El Bandito, 06 February 2017 - 07:13 PM.

[NighthawK1337]

El Bandito, on 06 February 2017 - 07:10 PM, said:

But that's how Battlemechs fought in the novels. If they wished to shoot with any kind of accuracy they had to slow down or even completely stop. And their targeting computer had to get a full lock first, as well. Unless you are Kai Allard.

Except MWO's silly instant pinpoint convergence is making Kai Allard out of most of us. There is little immersion.

Yep lore vs gameplaywise, I guess that's the best compromise we can have. Otherwise TC needs to offer auto aim in compensation to balance out the accuracy loss.

Andi Nagasia, on 06 February 2017 - 05:04 PM, said:

i had a topic like this, but my Topic was about Bobing,
(Arm Weapon Viability + Convergence Idea)
and also gave use to Arms, which most smaller mechs store their weapons,

I could settle with bobbing when moving.

Edited by NighthawK1337, 06 February 2017 - 07:52 PM.

[FupDup]

El Bandito, on 06 February 2017 - 07:10 PM, said:

But that's how Battlemechs fought in the novels. If they wished to shoot with any kind of accuracy they had to slow down or even completely stop. And their targeting computer had to get a full lock first, as well. Unless you are Kai Allard.

Except MWO's silly instant pinpoint convergence is making Kai Allard out of most of us. There is little immersion.

Standing still for prolonged periods of time and facetanking each other is not my idea of "immersive," unless we're trying to simulate British tactics during the American revolution.

[NighthawK1337]

CoF has been discussed to death.
General consensus by both PGI and the playerbase is that it's a piss poor way to use a balancing mechanic. Can we move on to something else? I'm getting flashbacks to ColdDarkness' post about this similar thing, but broader. (are you ColdDarkness' Alt?)

https://mwomercs.com...-weaponaccuracy


Seriously it's post like this that tends to bring up bad ideas like "Ghost Accuracy" or something.
Precision alteration is bad for balance. If done for lore then it will result to auto-aiming too.

We should look for a simpler solution with the least variables.
Like introducing LFE or just removing the death penalty and just adding more movement or heat penalty to ST loss for IS. PGI already removed engine destruction from Crit slots and just purely from component destruction. That's why MGs can't kill by the 3 slot crits rule, but indirectly from bonus damage leading to component destruction.

Edited by NighthawK1337, 06 February 2017 - 08:12 PM.

[El Bandito]

FupDup, on 06 February 2017 - 07:52 PM, said:

Standing still for prolonged periods of time and facetanking each other is not my idea of "immersive," unless we're trying to simulate British tactics during the American revolution.

Except WoT already does that and that's WWII era game. And that didn't detract from its success. I certainly didn't imagine the game to be a mech CoD when I backed MWO.

[NighthawK1337]

El Bandito, on 06 February 2017 - 08:17 PM, said:

Except WoT already does that and that's WWII era game. And that didn't detract from its success. I certainly didn't imagine the game to be a mech CoD when I backed MWO.

Mech CoD title goes to "Hawken"

It's more like mech "ARMA".

If anything, CoF will make it more like CoD. Since CoD have it on all weapons. While in ARMA, if I remember correctly bullet drop is the more important aspect. Although I haven't played ARMA a lot.

Edited by NighthawK1337, 06 February 2017 - 08:23 PM.

[Albino Boo]

Here we go again with yet another thread about convergence. The answer is still no because people would just move and shoot with streaks or lrms. If you turn every weapon into sandpaper then logical thing to is use the guided one that allows you to move and shoot at the same time.

Edited by Albino Boo, 06 February 2017 - 09:20 PM.

[Snazzy Dragon]

Ok, Paul, show us on the paper doll where the bad light mech touched you.

[Pjwned]

El Bandito, on 06 February 2017 - 07:10 PM, said:

But that's how Battlemechs fought in the novels. If they wished to shoot with any kind of accuracy they had to slow down or even completely stop. And their targeting computer had to get a full lock first, as well. Unless you are Kai Allard.

Except MWO's silly instant pinpoint convergence is making Kai Allard out of most of us. There is little immersion.

I'm fine with addressing convergence directly if it's such a problem...which it clearly is because we wouldn't need stupid **** like ghost heat if convergence wasn't so unbalanced.

Introducing cone of fire BS, especially as a penalty for moving around, is not the way to do that.