13 replies to this topic

[SuperFunkTron]

Proposition:
Require all players to build a full drop deck of their own mechs with a minimal upgrade requirement before they can drop in FP the first time. This will be referred to as an "extended" or "field" training period in which a player "proves their ability" to fight for their Faction. A visual progress meter with clear goals and how to meet them will help players keep aware of what is advance in their quest to become FP ready. When the players enter the FP screen, they will arrive at a drop deck configuration screen with information letting them know the requirements to meet to get their first FP drop as well as information on their progress toward that goal as well as what they still need to complete to load that first drop deck.

Reasoning: Control basics, game mechanics, mechs and weapon classes are all necessary to understand in order to contribute to FP. There was a lot of discussion about adding a "gate" or a specific criteria before one is allowed to play in the Faction Play game mode. It is of great benefit to both experienced and new players a like to make sure that players participating in FP are minimally competent so as to a) not drag down more experienced players and b)not intimidate new players out of the game.

Details: Building a visual progression chart that a player must complete before they can drop in FP would help make sure that players have a reasonable amount of experience and practice while providing an engaging and immersive "extended training period" before they drop into the competitive game mode. The time it takes for a player to complete the "extended field training" ensures that they've gained enough experience and have an idea of what is going on. With the first drop deck requiring a player to use only his owned mechs, an early goal to work towards (beyond collect mechs to fight) is provided to help give some guidance and direction as to what a player needs to be minimally competitive.

Extended Field Training- what it is:

1. A minimum number (X) of games playing trial mechs from both skill trees before purchasing a mech from that respective weight class.

2. Owning and completing "basic" level upgrades for at least 1 mech from a weight class will provide a certification for that pilot toward completing his Extended Field Training. Aside from making sure a new pilot has experience in a certain mech, this would substantially reduce the disadvantage of fewer upgraded node benefits to some degree.

4. *Optional- A certain number of completed actions could be added as a requirement for each class to provide some clear strategies for mechs from each class (some ideas are a light must get X number of Scouting and protected light awards, and assault requires X KMDD, medium requires achieve enough "lance in formation" or "protected medium" awards etc...)

Benefits
-Improved new player preparation for FP means it will be less intimidating and off putting when start dropping.
-Basic experience and comprehension of mech classes and upgrades are made part of a more engaging and immersive preparation process.
-Direction by means of clear objectives and requirements of what is necessary for a minimally viable drop deck provides a path to follow in what is currently a sandbox.
-Upgrade tree difference will be reduced between new and experienced players.


Drawbacks/ Trade offs and Possible Solutions
-Extends the time before FP is playable- the trade off is that FP will receive fewer unprepared players.
-Cost differences between IS and Clan chassis will likely lead to IS mechs being selected more often due to perceived savings- A means to convey that the most IS mechs require additional upgrades that eventually make the costs comparable to their Clan counterparts.
-Grind time may be off putting- C-bill, XP, and weapons awards could be added during this "extended field training" period to help with node upgrades, mech upgrades, and weapons experimentation.
-New players will not know whether to commit to IS or Clan Mechs- Information provided from the very beginning of the game and regularly reinforced throughout this early period should make the general differences between the two tech trees clear (laser burn time, weapons range, standard vs omnimech) and encourage players to choose a choose a side sooner*.



* Possible solutions for this are requiring a player to pilot an IS and Clan mech from each weight class at least X number of times before they can buy their first mech. This may be seen as an unnecessary hurdle at first, but exposing the player to both technologies before buying their first mech will reduce the the large amount of buyer's remorse and "wasted first mechs".

This is a rough draft but I'd like to hear thoughts and reactions to this. I know FP matchmaking is a very hot topic right now and finding any way we can to improve match quality should be a priority. Devising a method to improve incoming FP players while creating a more interesting and better guided early experience for new players will also increase player retention as they won't feel as bad about

[Daidachi]

The most compelling argument I've seen has been to add a tutorial for FP into the current academy.

Unfortunately that has been mentioned so many times that I have very real doubts that it'll ever be implemented.

[SuperFunkTron]

Daidachi, on 18 February 2017 - 08:53 AM, said:

The most compelling argument I've seen has been to add a tutorial for FP into the current academy.

Unfortunately that has been mentioned so many times that I have very real doubts that it'll ever be implemented.

I think the tutorial combined with the above proposed idea would be the best idea possible. New players have clear cut goals as to what they need to do to become FP competent and enough time would be spent completing and improving those skills that we'd hopefully see a big reduction in players scoring under 500 per FP match

[MacClearly]

Go to the FW leaderboard right now and look at the top twenty loyalist units. Pay attention to the disparity between units with tons of people that drop a whole lot and have a lot of members and units that actually play well. So there are guys that have been playing faction for years that are still absolutely terrible at it.

Don't get me wrong, doing something to try and make the overall experience better is a great idea. Just I think that the only way is to use psr and perhaps something to help units fight other units. The skill gap is not simply just about new players.

[SuperFunkTron]

MacClearly, on 18 February 2017 - 10:57 AM, said:

Go to the FW leaderboard right now and look at the top twenty loyalist units. Pay attention to the disparity between units with tons of people that drop a whole lot and have a lot of members and units that actually play well. So there are guys that have been playing faction for years that are still absolutely terrible at it.

Don't get me wrong, doing something to try and make the overall experience better is a great idea. Just I think that the only way is to use psr and perhaps something to help units fight other units. The skill gap is not simply just about new players.

Agreed. Skill disparity is definitely an issue for both new and older players alike, that's just reality. One of the issues I've been coming across lately, and there are many others who see it as well, are the number of players scoring below 300-400 damage across all 4 mechs.

This is more prominent among new players who are rushing into FP too quickly out of curiosity without the experience to handle basic combat or cohesive team orders. This really frustrates the more experienced players and can be equally frustrating or off putting for new players (of course there are those who just love being on the battlefield regardless of how well or badly they play, mechs are fun).

This is by no means a broad, fix-all solution to skill disparity nor is it a matchmaker to evaluate PSR and experience. This is a way to bring up the level of bottom level of players while providing an actual objective set and over all training goals. If we are going to find ways to improve FP, we have to find solutions for specific issues and this is specifically targeting the first bump in the road. New players have little guidance beyond the academy, which is still very limited and not nearly as excited as actual combat. This system provides an interesting, lore based idea to make that initial path to FP something fun while preparing them for the brutality of FP.

[MacClearly]

SuperFunkTron, on 18 February 2017 - 11:52 AM, said:

Agreed. Skill disparity is definitely an issue for both new and older players alike, that's just reality. One of the issues I've been coming across lately, and there are many others who see it as well, are the number of players scoring below 300-400 damage across all 4 mechs.

This is more prominent among new players who are rushing into FP too quickly out of curiosity without the experience to handle basic combat or cohesive team orders. This really frustrates the more experienced players and can be equally frustrating or off putting for new players (of course there are those who just love being on the battlefield regardless of how well or badly they play, mechs are fun).

This is by no means a broad, fix-all solution to skill disparity nor is it a matchmaker to evaluate PSR and experience. This is a way to bring up the level of bottom level of players while providing an actual objective set and over all training goals. If we are going to find ways to improve FP, we have to find solutions for specific issues and this is specifically targeting the first bump in the road. New players have little guidance beyond the academy, which is still very limited and not nearly as excited as actual combat. This system provides an interesting, lore based idea to make that initial path to FP something fun while preparing them for the brutality of FP.

No I can appreciate what you are saying but a lot of people learn by playing. It is just how some go about it. So if that kind of player meets other tier 5's he might stand a far better chance at sticking around since he wasn't barred from the mode.

[SuperFunkTron]

MacClearly, on 18 February 2017 - 12:28 PM, said:

No I can appreciate what you are saying but a lot of people learn by playing. It is just how some go about it. So if that kind of player meets other tier 5's he might stand a far better chance at sticking around since he wasn't barred from the mode.

I agree that some sort of match maker would also help a lot. But in a mode that comes with an initial warning of being competitive and more difficult, it makes sense that players should at least have a basic control of their mechs and weapon systems. This system doesn't work to keep players out, it works to train them so they don't drown when they first drop in.
Barred isn't really so much the idea, this is more of a long term goal to unlock with short term objectives on the way there.

Once the population gets large enough, that long waits wouldn't be an issue, then a match maker is the absolute right step to improving match competitiveness in FP, but it makes sense that even the tier 5 guys should be able to handle a variety of mechs in a mode that requires that.

[MacClearly]

SuperFunkTron, on 18 February 2017 - 12:52 PM, said:

I agree that some sort of match maker would also help a lot. But in a mode that comes with an initial warning of being competitive and more difficult, it makes sense that players should at least have a basic control of their mechs and weapon systems. This system doesn't work to keep players out, it works to train them so they don't drown when they first drop in.
Barred isn't really so much the idea, this is more of a long term goal to unlock with short term objectives on the way there.

Once the population gets large enough, that long waits wouldn't be an issue, then a match maker is the absolute right step to improving match competitiveness in FP, but it makes sense that even the tier 5 guys should be able to handle a variety of mechs in a mode that requires that.

You could be right or maybe there should be both implemented. As far as tier five guys I encourage everyone to create an alt. It is actually hard to stay in tier five so I don't have the faith that you do.

There is also the possibility that the FW population would increase by adding a matchmaker alone. I don't hear too many tier one guys complaining and yes I do know guys that are good that solo FW all of the time. If the ones with issues thought they had a chance to go and have fun and maybe run different builds I think there is a good chance that alone would reel some more players in.

[Tarl Cabot]

And PGI's version of PSR has many issues. A new player would have to really be a "potato" usually playing ON a potato to not advance out of T5.

Even if FP had a "matchmaker", how well would it have really turned out, considering how it turned out for Quickplay when it was solo+ 2-4man groups in one queue and the 12man queue in another queue? The biggest factor at that time was those groups were on external VOIP nor did PGI have a restriction on HOW many groups were on a side, nor could anyone tell most of the time who had dropped as a group.

What is funny is that CW started without MWO's VOIP. CW was released Dec 11, 2014 and in-game VOIP was not released until Feb 17 2015. MWO still has the same chat interface now it did then but no command wheel. Those that wanted to get the most out of CW joined up on the Comstar's NA or EU TS if they were not part of a unit with its own TS. The worse part were pugs who had a fit when they were on counterattack.

Simply pointing out that when PGI adds something, it is usually done as a minimal viable product, so beware of what you wish for...

[SuperFunkTron]

Tarl Cabot, on 19 February 2017 - 08:35 PM, said:

Simply pointing out that when PGI adds something, it is usually done as a minimal viable product, so beware of what you wish for...

The system itself is a minimally viable product. If they just require 1 mech from each weight class to be purchased, a number of in game rewards to achieve (mech protected, scouting, etc). This would be just a little more work than creating a weekly event and adding an in game progress/ completion chart. Not a whole lot to screw up there.

[Chound]

SuperFunkTron, on 19 February 2017 - 08:55 PM, said:

The system itself is a minimally viable product. If they just require 1 mech from each weight class to be purchased, a number of in game rewards to achieve (mech protected, scouting, etc). This would be just a little more work than creating a weekly event and adding an in game progress/ completion chart. Not a whole lot to screw up there.

for a new player to OWN a mech from every weight class would just leave him on the sidelines for a considerable time. Mechsare not cheap It would be months to grind out enough Cbills to purchase a heayv or assault mech at 10 Million Cbills. I haven't earned that much accumulated let alone have it sitting. I was getting told the best way to learn the game is after the accademy join a faction. Your way he would have to learn the game in PUG matches a guarenteed way to lose new players from frustration.

[LordNothing]

get rid of quick play. fp inherits map/mode voting from qp, and any modes not currently represented in fp (like escort).

create a solo bucket for fp, no units, no mercs or loyalists.

freelancer becomes noob mode and gets to play in the solo bucket.

you may use trials in solo bucket but you may not use them anywhere else.

freelancer then receives a 10 rank tree.

completing rank 3 unlocks call to arms, up to 2 freelancers may participate in any big boy drop at any time. no trials. this allows them to train in real world conditions without a full commitment to it.

complete rank 5 to unlock career selection, you may bail freelancer at this point or complete the tree, or stay freelancer if you are too potato. if you do too well here you may get a handycap, because we cant have people farming noobs and potatoes.

you may solo in loyalist or merc modes, though groups are still encouraged. but these solos play in the regular queue. the important thing is that these solos have been properly seasoned and shouldn't be noobs or potato-pugs.

unit players gain spec ops missions, which are always unit vs unit. same game just guaranteed elite. it also becomes the primary means to capture planets. its not so much a bucket as a match scheduling feature, you still technically play in regular queue, you just have to fight other units for planets. units work out their play times in a batchall type thing.

regular queue may also limit groups to 8 players. this leaves room for cta or solo players. this is more to give less organized players of all types a window on the group play style, and to help train the inexperienced, rather than to make things easier on pugs (it does that too). groups are encouraged to help them become better mechwarriors. remember you can still play 12 man games but you need to use the scheduling feature.

now instead of having 3 buckets (solo, group, and fp), you have 2 buckets and scheduled matches. this should have little effect on organized units as they have the ability to handle the organizational requirements. the learning curve isnt so steep and the new and casual players can keep to their own. it provides a path for learning as well. good solos and small groups dont have to worry about the potatoes clogging up the works. big groups are still where you want to be, but they are encouraged to pass their knowlege and tactics to the lesser players. players who feel they are good enough get to play the planet capture game.

Edited by LordNothing, 22 February 2017 - 03:46 AM.

[SuperFunkTron]

Chound, on 21 February 2017 - 11:16 PM, said:

for a new player to OWN a mech from every weight class would just leave him on the sidelines for a considerable time. Mechsare not cheap It would be months to grind out enough Cbills to purchase a heayv or assault mech at 10 Million Cbills. I haven't earned that much accumulated let alone have it sitting. I was getting told the best way to learn the game is after the accademy join a faction. Your way he would have to learn the game in PUG matches a guarenteed way to lose new players from frustration.

You've got a good point with the cost of mechs, but that's why c-bill rewards would be incorporated for completing tasks that reinforce useful maneuvers in FP (lance in formation, scouting, protected mech). With sizeable c-bill rewards that could essentially cover the cost of 1 or 2 mechs (assault or heavies) on top of the original 25 game cadet bonus, new players would find themselves purchasing a mech from each group rather quickly as they ingrain those basic maneuvers. It will also provide experience in each of the mech types to ensure a new player has an idea of both the advantages the class brings as well as what to expect from enemies in those classes.

Joining a unit in FP is definitely the best way to improve in FP, but having a player establish a baseline ability for piloting a mech, group movement, and aiming would only enhance the rate of progress when entering FP. Sort of a learn to walk before you run type plan. The idea isn't too keep new players out, it is to help them get prepared when they enter the shark tank.

[DANKnuggz]

I didn't even touch FP until I had a full drop deck of my OWN mechs and had finished their elites..... Only an absolute IDIOT drops into FP with trials or with little to no understanding of how to build a proper loadout... If you don't have the patience it takes to build proper mechs and skills then I don't WANT you in FP, I don't care how low the pop gets...

I was a NEW player and took the time to build my OWN drop deck.... If I can do it so can they and they will be better players for the experience, I know I am.

Edited by DANKnuggz, 23 February 2017 - 02:13 PM.