26 replies to this topic

[Lightfoot]

MWO by default maps the X axis to 'Torso-Twist', you have to flip this to 'Analog Turn' in MWO's Options/ Controller. This is very important. So when done you will have "Joy 0 Axis X" mapped to Analog Turn and "Joy 0 Rot Z" mapped to Torso Twist. This is the standard setup for a MechWarrior Joystick since MW1 and I told PGI in Closed Beta many times, but, alas.

Now you have the mech looking up/down and turning off the stick X and Y, and torso twist rotating with the stick twist.

Could be the problem for many who tried to use a Joystick in MWO? Devs included?

I don't think MechWarrior has used the Joystick X Axis for torso twist since the Sim-Pod days, but this was because the Sim-Pods had Rudder Pedals and from what I understand MWO doesn't support Rudder Pedals very well.

Mapping the Joystick X-Axis to Analog Turn results in a much more stable, precise aiming solution and sets the mech up like a flight-sim control scheme where you have the easy turning on X-Axis and the hard Turn (Rudder) on the Joystick Rotation (Rot Z). More like a tank turret since the Torso-Twist stays where you place it while the mech steers around things.

If you were using the Joystick with the X-Axis mapped to Torso Twist it would be a total nightmare. PGI should fix this to MechWarrior Normal mapping of Analog Turn to Joystick X-Axis since many new to MechWarrior don't know it's the best solution, or was for MechWarrior 2 through 4. Maybe if the default Cry Engine had Analog Turn MWO would be using the standard Joystick setup?

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Admittedly my issue is the limitation the game places on you to basically need to armlock in order to use a joystick effectively. This wouldn't be a problem, if all mechs had a similar torso turn/pitch profile, but they don't... and this hinders joystick play more than anything else.

[The Lobsters]

Umm... so do people really use their joystick for aiming? I know mwo is default mapped to do so, but this game isn't really optimised for joystick aiming.

Do yourselves a massive favour guys and switch the stick to your left hand for driving the mech, and the mouse in your right hand for aiming. It really is the best of both worlds then.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

The Lobsters, on 03 March 2017 - 04:01 AM, said:

Umm... so do people really use their joystick for aiming? I know mwo is default mapped to do so, but this game isn't really optimised for joystick aiming.

Do yourselves a massive favour guys and switch the stick to your left hand for driving the mech, and the mouse in your right hand for aiming. It really is the best of both worlds then.

No.

I shouldn't be forced to mouse aim if I'm using a joystick, that absolutely destroys the entire point of using a HOTAS.

Look man, I've played Mechwarrior since Mech2, and I can tell you right now, in EVERY SINGLE OTHER ITERATION OF THE GAME, I've been able to be on par, or better, than mouse/keyboard users with a joystick. MWO is literally the only Mechwarrior game I've played [living legends included] that has actively dicked me over for using a HOTAS setup.

Also, Joysticks are NEVER comfortable in the left hand, Left hand is for throttle, NEVER for stick.

[AnTi90d]

The Lobsters, on 03 March 2017 - 04:01 AM, said:

switch the stick to your left hand for driving the mech, and the mouse in your right hand for aiming. It really is the best of both worlds then.

That's how I play. I use Xpadder with a Playstation 2 controller, WASD to the Dpad and the analog mapped to be five different button presses. I have full throttle / arm lock toggle / free look / override / night vision / consumables / weapon group 3 / jumpjets / weapon door toggle / start team chat / start all chat / map / scoreboard / eject .. um.. a macro to type my password in and hit Enter.. uh.. I can't remember the other buttons.. mostly because that's all that I regularly use.

I use a gaming mouse instead of a regular one for my right hand, though.. and have weapon group 1 / weapon group 2 / Teamspeak PTT / VOIP / targeting / max zoom toggle and thermal vision on it. (I have to say that having a mouse with a small button inside of your left mouse button is frikkin' awesome to throw zoom toggle onto.)

[The Lobsters]

CMDR Sunset Shimmer, on 03 March 2017 - 04:05 AM, said:

No.

I shouldn't be forced to mouse aim if I'm using a joystick, that absolutely destroys the entire point of using a HOTAS.

Look man, I've played Mechwarrior since Mech2, and I can tell you right now, in EVERY SINGLE OTHER ITERATION OF THE GAME, I've been able to be on par, or better, than mouse/keyboard users with a joystick. MWO is literally the only Mechwarrior game I've played [living legends included] that has actively dicked me over for using a HOTAS setup.

Also, Joysticks are NEVER comfortable in the left hand, Left hand is for throttle, NEVER for stick.

Cool your boots man, it's just a point of view, not dogma. Not worth getting upset about. Take some air.

I appreciate that you may enjoy the immersion of hotas, and that yes, previous iterations of mechwarrior suited the traditional joystick setup more. For mwo though, I have just found left hand stick, right hand mouse to be the more effective setup. I'm not sure there is actually a point to using hotas, other than the immersion of your controls mirroring the game graphics. Mwo is an online mechsim fps competitive shooter. To remain competitive with all the mouse users, I just need to use the mouse. If hotas was better optimised things might be different. PGI have left hotas control in the long grass. This iteration just isn't hotas friendly.

But really mate, whatever works for you. Isn't that kinda the point of alternative control methods. I have no wish to trigger you.


On the subject of left hand joysticks not being comfortable, I do have to disagree. 'Says who' in fact. I find holding my hand in the vertical position much more comfortable than horizontal. I do have a sports injury that also make that easier for me.

I guess it just comes down to personal preference, whatever feels the most comfortable.



ed. I do have large hands, so getting them round a stick is a lot easier for me,and conversely, WASD is just asking for my hands to seize up.

Edited by The Lobsters, 03 March 2017 - 04:28 AM.

[The Lobsters]

AnTi90d, on 03 March 2017 - 04:21 AM, said:

That's how I play. I use Xpadder with a Playstation 2 controller, WASD to the Dpad and the analog mapped to be five different button presses. I have full throttle / arm lock toggle / free look / override / night vision / consumables / weapon group 3 / jumpjets / weapon door toggle / start team chat / start all chat / map / scoreboard / eject .. um.. a macro to type my password in and hit Enter.. uh.. I can't remember the other buttons.. mostly because that's all that I regularly use.

I use a gaming mouse instead of a regular one for my right hand, though.. and have weapon group 1 / weapon group 2 / Teamspeak PTT / VOIP / targeting / max zoom toggle and thermal vision on it. (I have to say that having a mouse with a small button inside of your left mouse button is frikkin' awesome to throw zoom toggle onto.)

Hmm, glad you posted that mouse pick. I was just wondering yesterday that I needed a third, non scroll wheel mouse button to assign advanced zoom and to simultaneously trigger a mouse sensitivity macro. Also. I have big hands, I need a big mouse. That looks like a contender.

[AnTi90d]

The Lobsters, on 03 March 2017 - 04:33 AM, said:

Hmm, glad you posted that mouse pick. I was just wondering yesterday that I needed a third, non scroll wheel mouse button to assign advanced zoom and to simultaneously trigger a mouse sensitivity macro. Also. I have big hands, I need a big mouse. That looks like a contender.

https://www.amazon.c...O/dp/B00GD3VA66


I've had it 15 months and have no issues.. other than the mouse feet being slowly eaten away by my metal mousepad.

It has two buttons on the side and the extra trigger button. The glowing button is a set switcher; each set can have its own button layout / macros / sensitivity. You can have 1-6 sets to flip through. It has a built-in macro program, a long cord and removable weights.

I have no real complaints about it.. I just wish I could get a version with 4-6 buttons on the side instead of just 2.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

The Lobsters, on 03 March 2017 - 04:24 AM, said:

Cool your boots man, it's just a point of view, not dogma. Not worth getting upset about. Take some air.

I appreciate that you may enjoy the immersion of hotas, and that yes, previous iterations of mechwarrior suited the traditional joystick setup more. For mwo though, I have just found left hand stick, right hand mouse to be the more effective setup. I'm not sure there is actually a point to using hotas, other than the immersion of your controls mirroring the game graphics. Mwo is an online mechsim fps competitive shooter. To remain competitive with all the mouse users, I just need to use the mouse. If hotas was better optimised things might be different. PGI have left hotas control in the long grass. This iteration just isn't hotas friendly.

But really mate, whatever works for you. Isn't that kinda the point of alternative control methods. I have no wish to trigger you.


On the subject of left hand joysticks not being comfortable, I do have to disagree. 'Says who' in fact. I find holding my hand in the vertical position much more comfortable than horizontal. I do have a sports injury that also make that easier for me.

I guess it just comes down to personal preference, whatever feels the most comfortable.



ed. I do have large hands, so getting them round a stick is a lot easier for me,and conversely, WASD is just asking for my hands to seize up.

Sorry man, didn't mean to freak on you, just kinda tired of this argument.

I've been frustrated with MWO since release due to just, not being joystick friendly in any way... I mean, sure you can handle movement with it nice enough, but when I could out-brawl mouse/keyboard players back in Mech4 using a Logitech extreme 3d pro... then I come over here and can't even use a Saitek X52 pro without gimping myself, I feel cheated.

it's frustrating man. Mechwarrior used to be about the simulation aspect... but I guess they wern't kidding about MWO "not being your daddy's Mechwarrior"

[AnTi90d]

If you really want to go 100% joystick, try going into 3rd person view. It automatically locks the arms and PGI actually put a slight autoaim into it.

Edit from two months later: There is no autoaim in FPV.

Quote

its just the reticle rendering differently at different distances combined with seeing from above instead of straight down the barrels.

Edited by AnTi90d, 23 April 2017 - 01:13 PM.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

AnTi90d, on 03 March 2017 - 05:27 AM, said:

If you really want to go 100% joystick, try going into 3rd person view. It automatically locks the arms and PGI actually put a slight autoaim into it.

nope. the camera done makes me far too obvious to enemy's. it's not worth it.

[CygnusX7]

Hey I get it, and respect anyone who wants to use a joystick in this game but that's a steep mountain to climb.

[Mystere]

This is how I setup my Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog via TARGET:

• Rudder for turning
  
• Y-axis for elevation
  
• X-axis for torso twist
  
  • mapped 90% of stick throw to 90-degree torso twist via mouse emulation
    
  • leftmost and rightmost 5% of stick throw switches to regular joystick control

[Amsro]

I use the joystick for accel/decel and turning left/right, for aiming/torso twisting I use the mouse.

I found this to be the best combo for general agility and aiming while on the move.

[Lightfoot]

Hmmm, I don't have any problem aiming the arms with a joystick. Targets are close and fat anyway if you are using the arms, but I can also hit targets 300-400 meters away with the arms if guarding a damaged section. I just can't believe I am piloting a mech if I use a mouse though. For me MechWarrior has to be a Sim.

[Mister Blastman]

Joystick? Who uses joysticks? Real men use steering wheels!

[Mystere]

Mister Blastman, on 03 March 2017 - 07:46 PM, said:

Joystick? Who uses joysticks? Real men use steering wheels!

I've said it before and I will say it again. If you're going to use a steering wheel, at least do it in style:

[SuomiWarder]

Until MWO I always played MW games with a joystick. Used the stick for twist and turned with two buttons on the base. Had everything I needed mapped to the stick so I cold keep both hands on it and play.

Alas MWO did not want to let me play with my joy stick (hmm, that sentence turned south real quick). It's a shame because the stick feels more "Mechy" and immersive. But I went to the mouse so I could play effectively.

[Lightfoot]

Just wanted to mention one bug some have spoken of with Rotation Z controlling Turn and X-Axis controlling torso-twist is that the Torso Twist drifts when the stick is in a neutral position. That goes away when X-Axis is set to Mech Turn.

Other than that MWO actually has the best Joystick controls of any MechWarrior game. Depends on your Joystick and it's profiling software, but the sensitivity sliders in the Controller tab can do a lot.

[Mystere]

Lightfoot, on 22 April 2017 - 11:33 PM, said:

Other than that MWO actually has the best Joystick controls of any MechWarrior game. Depends on your Joystick and it's profiling software, but the sensitivity sliders in the Controller tab can do a lot.

I'm going to have to disagree, otherwise I would not have had to do this for torso-twist.