188 replies to this topic

[Redwo1f]

Disappearing are the days of the brawling assaults...the front liners, you know, the job they were assigned and created to do!!! (with a few exceptions). What I am seeing more and more are assaults created for the fire support role. You know the ones? the LRM 60 Kodiak?!?!? The ERLL/ Gauss Dire, etc. etc.

So here's what typically happens when 3 out of 4 members of Charlie lance are fire support and stand back hoping for targets....

YOU LOSE.

Mediums are suddenly forced to be front liners, a role they weren't designed for. Huge pressure on the remaining heavies (they better be good brawlers now, which often these days many aren't).

...the team falls apart one by one while the fire support assaults sit back with all their precious armor on the outskirts of the battle.

Ughh!!!!

Just the other day I watch a brilliantly adept player (*cough*) with his sole load-out 3ERLL on his Direwolf (!!!!!!!) sit back on the island and attempt to provide fire support while the rest of the team crumbled.

This is a terrible trend, imho. Out of role mechs, the disappearance of the brawling assaults...and now the way it is, everything else being equal, a good predictor of success or failure is the make up of Charlie lance.

:/

Edited by Redwo1f, 06 March 2017 - 10:43 AM.

[GrimRiver]

Maybe if people shunned and looked down upon nascarers and uber fast mechs that leave the assaults behind then the assaults wouldn't have to fit more ranged weapons just to stay in the fight?

I miss brawling in my assaults but I just can't do it anymore cause the whole team has to "Sonic: Gotta go fast" like it's Daytona 500.

When I'm in my assaults I have to give up considerable firepower for a bigger engine just so I can keep up.

I call it out to the team, but we all know how that ends up with PUGs.

[N0ni]

Dire wolves are not meant to be brawlers, due to the squishy nature of their side torsos (amplified if in the front lines and being focused on). Instead, they are more for "area denial". Good assault players will however use them for brawling, because they have the ability to be successful at it.

I think part of the reason why you're seeing more and more ranged builds on assaults (especially in solo hell), is that they have many times over tried to brawl or take point in a push... but got sick of the entire team not supporting them like they should... so they give up trying to brawl or be in the front lines in favor of a support role.

Speed is not necessarily an issue during a nascar, you just gotta know the ins and outs of the maps of "safe" shortcuts in relation to the position of the enemy team.

On an unrelated note: I saw a stormcrow with only 2 MPL yesterday, who even does that?

[ZippySpeedMonkey]

With the current trend of LRM stacking you should be too surprised....

[Nesutizale]

That is pretty much why I play my assaults with mixed builds..well most of my builds are mixed. If I have a team that goes with me, I can brawl. If they just leave me behind...well I just LRM...
Not the most effective way but it works in most cases.

[PurplePuke]

I brawl with my assaults sometimes.

But the reality is, I do more damage, get more kills, get more assists and KMDD, and last longer, if I use range weapons. Then I try to close with the enemy and use up my armor.

Most of the time.

Trying to lead a push with an assault often leads to wondering where your team went and dying before accomplishing anything.

Most of the time.

Edited by PurplePuke, 06 March 2017 - 11:33 AM.

[Paigan]

Redwo1f, on 06 March 2017 - 10:39 AM, said:

[...]

So here's what typically happens when 3 out of 4 members of Charlie lance are fire support and stand back hoping for targets....

YOU LOSE.

[...]

What you brawlers call "standing back", I call tactical positioning.
What you call "what they are created for" (in your mind), I call suiciding.
This is a thinking man's shooter. Not a suicider's shooter.
Thinking means:
- Use terrain (e.g. choke points. I have to explain EVERY match what a choke point is)
- Use your range
- Use suitable tactics like firing lines, flanking, etc.
- Observe the enemy instead of stumbling into them

Ideally, shoot without being shot at (meaning exploiting cover and range).
And know when you have to switch to brawl mode. If people fail to do that switch, then and only then are they cowards. Not before.
But don't see brawling as the mandatory thing to do. That's missing the whole "thinking man's" part of the game.

Btw, I win a lot more than I lose. And since I play 100% solo queue (casual, no time for more), it must mean I carry my team a lot more than I mess up.

Edited by Paigan, 06 March 2017 - 11:35 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Assaults are never meant to be front liners anyway. It is a common misconception that most new players perpetuate. Assaults typically carry more firepower than any other mech, and generally because of their size on top of that draw a lot of attention when pushing. So considering all that on a push it is actually better (even for brawling assaults like the Atlas) for them to be in the middle/back end of the pack because mediums and heavies generally can generally use their speed/agility to avoid/spread the first salvos whereas something like the Assault will most likely be stripped or dead fairly early.

Middle of the pack is where assaults thrive because they are the easiest to overwhelm without proper support and because they tend to stand out so it is best to have buddies to help mitigate them being focused down.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 06 March 2017 - 11:34 AM.

[Weeny Machine]

Only assaults`? Most heavies are pure snipers. When an enemy team pushes the medium and lights get rolled and then the remaining mechs get crushed.

I cannot count how often I had matches were heavies and assaults sat back and didn't move - at all - even when the fight moved away from them

PurplePuke, on 06 March 2017 - 11:31 AM, said:

I brawl with my assaults sometimes.

But the reality is, I do more damage, get more kills, get more assists and KMDD, and last longer, if I use range weapons. Then I try to close with the enemy and use up my armor.

Most of the time.

Trying to lead a push with an assault often leads to wondering where your team went and dying before accomplishing anything.

Most of the time.

You do that at cost of your team. Armour sharing is vital to keep as many mechs running as possible so your firepower remains up. In your case, the few mechs at the front are always focused falling apart first

What you do is just good to polish your epeen in form of damage and K/D but not to win games. Sorry

Edited by Bush Hopper, 06 March 2017 - 11:35 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Bush Hopper, on 06 March 2017 - 11:33 AM, said:

Armour sharing is vital to keep as many mechs running as possible so your firepower remains up.

Armor sharing is great, but it also doesn't mean the assault has to lead the charge. Players will often switch to the Assault once he comes into view during a push which means he really should not be the first target the enemy sees, that just makes things too easy for the enemy on a push.

[PurplePuke]

Bush Hopper, on 06 March 2017 - 11:33 AM, said:

Only assaults`? Most heavies are pure snipers. When an enemy team pushes the medium and lights get rolled and then the remaining mechs get crushed.

I cannot count how often I had matches were heavies and assaults sat back and didn't move - at all - even when the fight moved away from them




You do that at cost of your team. Armour sharing is vital to keep as many mechs running as possible so your firepower remains up.

What you do is just good to polish your epeen in form of damage and K/D but not to win games. Sorry

Somebody didn't read my post before he got all righteous. Here's what I said:

"Then I try to close with the enemy and use up my armor."

BTW, getting kills, assists, and damage is actually how you win. You're welcome, team.

[GrimRiver]

Nesutizale, on 06 March 2017 - 11:29 AM, said:

That is pretty much why I play my assaults with mixed builds..well most of my builds are mixed. If I have a team that goes with me, I can brawl. If they just leave me behind...well I just LRM...
Not the most effective way but it works in most cases.

Pretty much what I do.

I run 80% brawling weapons and 20% ranged support on my assaults, but lately I'm finding myself fitting more and more ranged support just so I can stay relevant in the fight.

Brawling has become harder too due to teams not wanting to push up and help and then wonder why assaults aren't pushing, like they expect assaults to do ALL of the pushing.

[Skanderborg]

My atlas is in the hanger almost permanently now due to how this game has evolved (rather changed).

Because the prevalence of much longer ranged clan weapons and everyone playing the peekaboo trade game every match it really doesn't have a place. If i decide to push I just get torn apart (the open area maps don't help at all) my team at most gets a few good shots in while the enemy exposes themselves to shoot me.

So i decided to play "smart" with my atlas , sticking with the team and waiting for the enemy to close so i can give my team amazing close ranged dps they don't typically have. However most of the time i get yelled at for not pushing (lol) or not contributing to the ranged trade. This is justified however , why have an atlas hanging out when you could have a long ranged assault to help trade?

"why are you hiding atlas?" "why don't you push into them atlas?" "You're an atlas , you are meant to get shot at"

it never stops and its quite annoying when i'm just trying to play appropriately and get into a favorable environment for brawling instead of taking alphas from 10 mechs trying to "push"

One might argue "put some ranged weapons on the atlas". The hard points simply are not suited to trading and it only hampers my brawling capability. The best build I've come up to "compromise" is 3 large lasers , ac20 , 2 srm 6 with a std 325 and its a bit toasty. But its not nearly as good in cqc as the typical build.

So i gave up. I bought a timber wolf and trade with my gauss and lasers.

Trust me , the most fun I've had in the game is brawling in my atlas , taking on guys in the most bad *** mech in the game at point blank range. But these days it simply doesn't work 90% of the time.

Edited by Skanderborg, 06 March 2017 - 12:07 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 06 March 2017 - 11:37 AM, said:

Armor sharing is great, but it also doesn't mean the assault has to lead the charge. Players will often switch to the Assault once he comes into view during a push which means he really should not be the first target the enemy sees, that just makes things too easy for the enemy on a push.

I didn't say he has to lead. However, what I see lately is that assaults and heavies sit FAR in the back basically cut off from the rest but not because they were left behind but because they just stopped to snipe

[GuardDogg]

If you haven't noticed. Assaults are easy targets, and destroyed in seconds, compared to lights that take 3x more fire hits than an assault and still run around. Assaults have problems staying in front of the team due to speed, and noticed. People are suppose to be afraid of Assaults, soon as they come around the corner. But in this case. Being afraid of an Assault mech Doesn't do well in MWO.

Edited by GuardDogg, 06 March 2017 - 11:51 AM.

[Davegt27]

OP your wasting your time

the try hards will be on telling you how wrong you are and how great they and assaults are

see my thread

https://mwomercs.com...__fromsearch__1

[PurplePuke]

Davegt27, on 06 March 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

OP your wasting your time

the try hards Win Hards will be on telling you how wrong you are and how great they and assaults are

see my thread

https://mwomercs.com...__fromsearch__1

FTFY

[Skanderborg]

GrimRiver, on 06 March 2017 - 11:40 AM, said:

Pretty much what I do.

I run 80% brawling weapons and 20% ranged support on my assaults, but lately I'm finding myself fitting more and more ranged support just so I can stay relevant in the fight.

Brawling has become harder too due to teams not wanting to push up and help and then wonder why assaults aren't pushing, like they expect assaults to do ALL of the pushing.

This

[PurplePuke]

But when brawling does work, and there is some coordination, not much can withstand an entire Assault Lance advancing at once.

It is truly glorious.

[MaximusPayne]

Played a QP game a few nights back in my uac10-5ERmed-LRM45 Warhawk on Frozen City (assault mode). Literally, the first 8 minutes was both sides playing peekaboo with each from their respective bases. I couldn't get a solid lock for my LRMs and rest of my weapons didn't have the range. I knew if I tried to lead a push, I'd be painting a bright red bullseye on my forehead and die a quick and lonely death. So, I fell back and throttled down until the rest of my team decided to grow a pair. With 5 minutes left, an assault with 2 mediums got bored and pushed, so I fell in with them. The game was extremely boring and, honestly I can't remember if we won or lost but it brought back all the reasons why I uninstalled MW4 years ago. MWO is going down the same path that did MW4 in: long range peak-n-pop. Yawn....
Might be a good time to dust off my Battlefield4 account.