20 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

Assuming that IS can now use Clan weapons.

By virtue of superior profile in humanoid, would IS have a huge advantage now?

As such, would you still want Clan XL to be installed on IS mechs if that's the case? Or would immortal IS mechs with Clan weapons AND engines be ridiculously OP?

Flame on!

[N0ni]

Mix tech is not going to happen.


Flame off.

[Alistair Winter]

N0ni, on 10 March 2017 - 05:32 PM, said:

Mix tech is not going to happen.


Flame off.

[Mechteric]

IS still shouldn't get to use clan weapons (or vice versa). I think they've been pretty good about sticking to that design philosophy and the game design balance certainly would be worse if they allowed cross teching.

[razenWing]

N0ni, on 10 March 2017 - 05:32 PM, said:

Mix tech is not going to happen.


Flame off.

Why not? Fedcom civil war is about IS vs IS. Besides, as I recall in the storyline, Clans are pretty much irrelevant after Fedcom Civil War. They did a lil bit of their own stuff in Dark Ages... but beyond that... Clans are just like... there. They don't do anything anymore.

[N0ni]

razenWing, on 10 March 2017 - 05:51 PM, said:

Why not? Fedcom civil war is about IS vs IS. Besides, as I recall in the storyline, Clans are pretty much irrelevant after Fedcom Civil War.

Balance. As already stated by the post above yours. Also, do you really think PGI cares about LOOOAAAARR? (intentional "lore" jest)

[Tarl Cabot]

Bringing iXL more into parity with cXL by surviving loss of 1 side torso with non-death penalties, then go from there.

[Lunaya]

Also, after the Civilwar clans are not "Irrelevant." While they are not the cause of the WoB Jihad they play a major role in it and actually in many cases keeping the IS from falling to the WoB. Along with various fairly prominent things from 3070 until the Dark Ages where Clan Wolf becomes a major thing again.

[Y E O N N E]

Lunaya, on 10 March 2017 - 06:52 PM, said:

Also, after the Civilwar clans are not "Irrelevant." While they are not the cause of the WoB Jihad they play a major role in it and actually in many cases keeping the IS from falling to the WoB. Along with various fairly prominent things from 3070 until the Dark Ages where Clan Wolf becomes a major thing again.

"Fairly prominent things" mostly involves the Ghost Bear Dominion taking over the Mary Sue role from the Federated Suns and Clan Wolf turning back into the Bad Guys ™. Oh, and Nova Cat basically dissolving into nothing.

[Alan Davion]

Tarl Cabot, on 10 March 2017 - 06:36 PM, said:

Bringing iXL more into parity with cXL by surviving loss of 1 side torso with non-death penalties, then go from there.

But then you'll have the Clan players up in arms citing rules such as "3 engine crits = death" and so on. Cause, you know, IS XLs take up 3 crit slots per side torso.

And we can't have that now. Got to keep those Clan players in power.

[AncientRaig]

Alan Davion, on 10 March 2017 - 07:00 PM, said:

But then you'll have the Clan players up in arms citing rules such as "3 engine crits = death" and so on. Cause, you know, IS XLs take up 3 crit slots per side torso.

And we can't have that now. Got to keep those Clan players in power.

Of course. And don't forget, the Heavy Medium Laser will be totally balanced because it has the same range as an IS Medium Laser and high heat penalties in a game where nobody cares about heat generation and there are no heat penalties. It's totally going to be the RACs, prohibitively heavy IS UACs, and the LFE that'll ruin game balance.

[Tarl Cabot]

Alan Davion, on 10 March 2017 - 07:00 PM, said:

But then you'll have the Clan players up in arms citing rules such as "3 engine crits = death" and so on. Cause, you know, IS XLs take up 3 crit slots per side torso.

And we can't have that now. Got to keep those Clan players in power.

Tell them they can have their 3 or 4 crit rule back when there are engine crits that actual do something other than be crit padders. IGP, I mean PGI, using only part of the a boardgame rule that involved dice probabilities in a game that has pinpoint hit functionality does not make for game play parity/balance. If introduced LFE will only partially cover up the issue.

When it was only IS VS IS, it was okay but once the Clans were introduced, or even more so when Clan battlemechs were were introduced it is no longer okay nor does it really make any sense, gameplay-wise.

(shrugs) IGP, I mean PGI... is likely to **** it up anyhow.

Edited for, hmm... well

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 10 March 2017 - 08:32 PM.

[Alan Davion]

Tarl Cabot, on 10 March 2017 - 07:44 PM, said:

(shrugs) IGP is likely to **** it up anyhow.

IGP hasn't been a factor for a couple years at least. All the mistakes have been purely on PGI since they bought out IGP.

That said...

Tarl Cabot, on 10 March 2017 - 07:44 PM, said:

Tell them they can have their 3 or 4 crit rule back when there are engine crits that actual do something other than be crit padders. PGI using only part of the a boardgame rule that involved dice probabilities in a game that has pinpoint hit functionality does not make for game play parity/balance. If introduced LFE will only partially cover up the issue.

When it was only IS VS IS, it was okay but once the Clans were introduced, or even more so when Clan battlemechs were were introduced it is no longer okay nor does it really make any sense, gameplay-wise.

The problem with what you want is it would require a complete re-work of the heat system, that would include actual heat penalties such as reduction of mech speed and so on.

And you know the ultra-comp meta-humpers will scream that down in short order cuz MUH TWITCH SKILLZ YO~!

[AncientRaig]

Alan Davion, on 10 March 2017 - 08:13 PM, said:

The problem with what you want is it would require a complete re-work of the heat system, that would include actual heat penalties such as reduction of mech speed and so on.

And you know the ultra-comp meta-humpers will scream that down in short order cuz MUH TWITCH SKILLZ YO~!

Which is hilariously sad considering that this is supposed to be a MechWarrior game. I miss the days where reaching 100% on that heat indicator meant I had 0.003 seconds to contemplate the immense stupid I had just done before my reactor went boom and where getting above 70-80% meant it was time for a rousing game of "guess which component is about to go bye-bye unless you can coolant dump faster than a Clanner can accept a batchall." Heat penalties made heat generation actually mean something and that added another layer of the game to try to master. Unfortunately, the powers that be wish for MWO to be an e-sport, and a true to form Mechwarrior game would never work as an e-sport.

Edited by Sidefire, 10 March 2017 - 08:41 PM.

[Tarl Cabot]

Edited previous post about IGP.. I really meant PGI...

As for an actual engine crit system in MWO, it would be interesting but I actually would not want it in MWO because it would not be done with enough of a robust crit setup and would definitely lower overall TTK. So the other side of the coin would be to adjust current setup since there is not a gameplay reason to have such a huge discrepancy between how the loss of 1st side torso between cXL and iXL is handled.

Quote

" Heat penalties made heat generation actually mean something and that added another layer of the game to try to master.

This... even without engine crits that would have an effect on a mech, the lack of a few of the actual heatscale penalties except when reaching/exceeding 100% is... sad. And all the BT HS levels and items would not need to be used but simply used as a guideline.

But one thing at a time...

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 10 March 2017 - 08:44 PM.

[Alex Morgaine]

Alan Davion, on 10 March 2017 - 08:13 PM, said:

IGP hasn't been a factor for a couple years at least. All the mistakes have been purely on PGI since they bought out IGP.

That said...



The problem with what you want is it would require a complete re-work of the heat system, that would include actual heat penalties such as reduction of mech speed and so on.

And you know the ultra-comp meta-humpers will scream that down in short order cuz MUH TWITCH SKILLZ YO~!

ZOMG I CANT 360 NOSCOPE AOL GAUSSLASER ALL TOGETHER AND I GO SLOW AND CANT SEE NERF OP HEAT 99% IS FINE


Did I do reasonable justice? I don't dorito or dew much.

[AncientRaig]

Alex Morgaine, on 10 March 2017 - 09:43 PM, said:

ZOMG I CANT 360 NOSCOPE AOL GAUSSLASER ALL TOGETHER AND I GO SLOW AND CANT SEE NERF OP HEAT 99% IS FINE


Did I do reasonable justice? I don't dorito or dew much.

Needs more comp meme joke gifs. Example:

[SQW]

What are you guys on about with Clan weapon on IS mech etc?

It'll just be plain QP within FP maps. Why does IS side have Clan mechs? Why salvage from the Clan invasion a la MW4 of course. Duh!

[FalconerGray]

Lunaya, on 10 March 2017 - 06:52 PM, said:

Also, after the Civilwar clans are not "Irrelevant." While they are not the cause of the WoB Jihad they play a major role in it and actually in many cases keeping the IS from falling to the WoB. Along with various fairly prominent things from 3070 until the Dark Ages where Clan Wolf becomes a major thing again.

And what relevance does this have to MWO?

[Jay Leon Hart]

Yeonne Greene, on 10 March 2017 - 06:56 PM, said:

"Fairly prominent things" mostly involves the Ghost Bear Dominion taking over the Mary Sue role from the Federated Suns and Clan Wolf turning back into the Bad Guys ™. Oh, and Nova Cat basically dissolving into nothing.

*uncontrollable sobbing*