33 replies to this topic

[Shiroi Tsuki]

Anything that is high mount, asymmetrical, usually an energy boat and typically a heavy

[Coolant]

Unfortunately if you look up meta gaming on Wiki it has nothing to do with what people mean in MWO and also unfortunately it stuck. I try not to use it at all. I've called people on it in the past, but since have pretty much given up.

"Metagaming is any strategy, action or method used in a game which transcends a prescribed ruleset, uses external factors to affect the game, or goes beyond the supposed limits or environment set by the game. Another definition refers to the game universe outside of the game itself.
In simple terms, it is the use of out-of-game information or resources to affect one's in-game decisions."

https://en.wikipedia...wiki/Metagaming

[Y E O N N E]

Out of game resources...like Li Song, Smurfy's, and Microsoft Excel...

Also, that definition is the same one I just used on page 1, but from a different perspective.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 26 March 2017 - 01:39 PM.

[SmokedJag]

Coolant, on 26 March 2017 - 01:23 PM, said:

Unfortunately if you look up meta gaming on Wiki it has nothing to do with what people mean in MWO and also unfortunately it stuck. I try not to use it at all. I've called people on it in the past, but since have pretty much given up.

"Metagaming is any strategy, action or method used in a game which transcends a prescribed ruleset, uses external factors to affect the game, or goes beyond the supposed limits or environment set by the game. Another definition refers to the game universe outside of the game itself.
In simple terms, it is the use of out-of-game information or resources to affect one's in-game decisions."

https://en.wikipedia...wiki/Metagaming

That can apply to "game design notwithstanding, this is what people use and what people do 95% of the time." World of Tanks is infamous for this with North American and Russian playstyles being vastly different with the exact same game. Russians will be hyperaggressive and brawl with anything, on any map.

[Tarogato]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 March 2017 - 12:28 PM, said:

The metagame of MWO is whatever maximizes your damage out while minimizing your damage in.

This is a pretty good "in as few words of possible."

Basically, "meta" is the most effective thing you can do. Which is characterised by using mechs with good survivability and/or good hardpoints, and building them such that they are as optimised as possible for a given engagement range. Exactly what is meta is dependent upon the balance of the game - for instance, laservomit used to be meta, but then PGI nerfed it and buffed PPFLD, and now PPFLD is meta. There are still laservomit meta builds, but they really aren't "the meta" right now because PPFLD is typically more effective presently.

For instance, the HBK-IIC-A runs 2x cERPPC, because they are high mounted, the mech doesn't have to expose very much or very long to deal damage, its damage is applied all together. cERPPC is arguably the best weapon in the game right now.

A VND-1AA running 2x ERPPC would not be meta, because Innersphere ERPPCs are not as good, and the Vindicator has both ERPPCs on a single arm (which can easily be knocked off) and the hardpoints are very low mounted so the mech has to expose a lot for a long time to deal its damage. Not very effective, not meta.

The Nova is an example of a meta chassis right now - it's one of the best brawlers in the game. Its best build runs 12 cSPL, which outputs an obscene amount of damage in a short period of time at close range, and the Nova has the requisite speed and jumpjets to get in range. It's also a really small mech that is difficult to kill. You could run something like 6 cERML + 6 cERSL on it, which is a great build, but that is not very meta, because it doesn't have one optimum engagement range - if an enemy is beyond cERSL range, it can't use the cERSLs, and if an enemy is within cERSL, then it can't use the cERMLs because they are too hot for close range. This is referred to as "bracket building", where you have weapons dedicated to more than one engagement range, and the weapons are not optimal at each others ranges, so you can only use half of your weapons at any given time, which means your build is only half a mech at any given time, when you really should be using your whole mech all the time if you want to win.

[SQW]

If you have no AMS and has less than 10 units of rear armor, congratulations, you are most likely running a meta.

[Y E O N N E]

SQW, on 26 March 2017 - 04:58 PM, said:

If you have no AMS and has less than 10 units of rear armor, congratulations, you are most likely running a meta.

I do both of those things even on goofy 'Mechs...because rear armor is not that important unless you are a fatty and because AMS is wasted in the presence of cover and concealment.

[SQW]

Yeonne Greene, on 26 March 2017 - 05:01 PM, said:

I do both of those things even on goofy 'Mechs...because rear armor is not that important unless you are a fatty and because AMS is wasted in the presence of cover and concealment.

Your team mate, whose cover you are standing in, might appreciate some AMS assistance because he is now in the open because of you.

Seriously though, why do people think AMS is for self defense only? Also, a few pts of armor to the rear might very well save your from a SRM alpha whereas it's mostly useless at the front when facing mechs with 50+ alphas.

[Y E O N N E]

SQW, on 26 March 2017 - 05:14 PM, said:

Your team mate, whose cover you are standing in, might appreciate some AMS assistance because he is now in the open because of you.

Seriously though, why do people think AMS is for self defense only? Also, a few pts of armor to the rear might very well save your from a SRM alpha whereas it's mostly useless at the front when facing mechs with 50+ alphas.

You would be better defended by me killing that guy faster, which leaving the AMS helps me to do.

[Zergling]

SQW, on 26 March 2017 - 05:14 PM, said:

Your team mate, whose cover you are standing in, might appreciate some AMS assistance because he is now in the open because of you.

Seriously though, why do people think AMS is for self defense only? Also, a few pts of armor to the rear might very well save your from a SRM alpha whereas it's mostly useless at the front when facing mechs with 50+ alphas.

Because knowing how to play the game at a decent level negates both of those threats without spending tonnage on it.
LRMs are easily countered without AMS or even ECM, just by fighting near cover you can use to quickly break line of sight. Shots to your rear can be avoided by situational awareness.

I practically never use AMS, and my mechs are light on rear armor, yet most of the builds I run wouldn't be described as 'meta'.

Edited by Zergling, 26 March 2017 - 06:37 PM.

[Pyed]

The more experience I get playing this game, the less back armor I run.

[PhoenixFire55]

Every build that kills you and is different from yours is meta. Every build that kills you and isn't different from your own is haxx. I thought it was obvious ...

[Pr8Dator]

Pyed, on 26 March 2017 - 07:14 PM, said:

The more experience I get playing this game, the less back armor I run.

I run only 5 points and even wonder why I even put 5 points there

[mogs01gt]

Pr8Dator, on 26 March 2017 - 06:35 AM, said:

Anything with twin Gauss?
Then that makes my 2 Gauss + 4 SPL Loki a metabuild??

Right now, Gauss and PPCs, then to a lesser extent standard laser vomit.